BHO with Vacuum oil/wax tutorial

BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
hhaa, give him a break. i prettyyy sure(some) the stuff that ive whipped up is the best stuff ive ever laid eyes on(and i never knew much about it before i started this)... i never hit up clubs though.. so i dunno what they bangin
Hey Guzias1 so you whip your oil before vac purge? Ya I've never had the need to go to a dispensary other than to get some seeds a couple of times.
 

Guzias1

Well-Known Member
Oooos.wrong words. I don't usually whip. I just meant I've made some good tings :)

I've seen some great whip with though. Cant say im against it
 

BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
Ok bc. Do you have any current questions? Oyther related. Getting that comb?
Thanks Guzias1. Ya for sure!
1. This thread is huge so I've been making my way through it. I'm up to page 98..From the stuff I've read that you guys have posted I can see that there is definitely a phenomena where some oils just wont wax up. I think that's what's happening with the oil I'm working with right now. It's from 2 month old sugar trim and popcorn. I have tried all temps with it from slow low to medium, to higher. I've tried very gradually increasing temps, everything with it. Question: Have you found that the oils that wouldn't wax up good for you were from older oil, or do you think it has more to do with the oil getting too warm at some point therefor somehow changing the chemistry of it?
2. I know this question's answer could vary a bit depending on strain, amount of tane in it pre vac, temp during purge etc. but I'm just looking for an average..Question: How long on the average would you think it would take a 20 gram chunk of oil to purge to full wax honeycomb? I'm using 20 gram as a number cause my tube fits a QP in it so at 18% return it should be somewhere around 20 gram runs I'm going to be doing if I can get this process down good.
3. Do you think stopping the vac during purging along the way negatively affects the outcome on how good the oil will wax up?
4. How many times along the process do you think on the average to you fold the oil back to center then re vac after the muffin has gotten more stable?
5. Have you done runs with just sugar trim and no buds? If so how do you think it turns out compared to just bud runs?
6. If I'm going to use small popcorn do you think it's necessary to cut them up or just run them as popcorn? At what size bud would you start to cut up?
7. When you feel the oil has waxed to completion do you turn off the heat while the it's still in the vac then let slowly dry under vac pressure; or just pull it out while still warm then room temp dry under no vac?
8. Not sure if my vac gauge is fucked or not but it's reading past 30 hg on full vac. The numbers run out at 30 but I'm guessing it would have to be 31-32 if it's accurate. Is this possible? I thought a full vac was 30 max? If it is pulling that high is that a bad thing? Is there a "magic" number that works best for making honeycomb? I see people saying 28-29.8 hg etc..
9. Do you think its critical or more affective to have the vac pump continuously running at full vac or do you get the chamber to full vac then close the valves and turn the pump off?
10. Oil color: I understand that the strain type, and the length of flower time ie. trichome color will affect the finished color of the oil BUT is there any other factors that affect how dark the oil gets during this whole process getting to honeycomb? It just seems so odd that a nice yellow color oil after extraction can turn to such a dark oil during purging. I'm wondering if it may have something to do with the oil surface physically touching the bottom of the heated chamber (on parchment though) during purging. I'm wondering if it would lessen the oil darkening if the oil is first put into a bowl, or ramekin on parchment then into the chamber so there is no direct heat touching the oil. More like creating an oven affect on the oil...thoughts?
11. What does you user name mean? :grin:

Thanks a lot Guzias!

If you ever have any questions about flowers fire away or send me a pm anytime.
 

qwizoking

Well-Known Member
Wow....I'll get around to answering via edit so this isn't a complete waste of a post........(eventually, and what I can)

but wow, lol, so many questions

I don't make wax often enough to really feel comfortable answering questions about it..but..

2. I've waxed material that was decarbed prior to extracting and ive waxed oil that was decarbed after extracting..

3. A vacuum is not necessary to wax though it makes it uniform and easier to do, I don't believe stopping the vac will have any negative effect

4.folding isn't necessary unless as mentioned its gonna run off, ideally you want a thin film..not folded chunk

5. Sugar trim will be a dirtier product due to cuts in the leaf material, but that goes back to my preference of iso, in any case trichs on leaves mature first.....

6.if its scraggly enough, I run a lot of my material whole but it can't be compact or the fluid won't get through

7.it'll do its thing in the vac.. but like I said you don't have to have a vac to wax so it will also do it just sitting out if its hot enough, after a while it gets crumbly for me

8.yea that's too high...28.5

10. Good wax is lighter in color than the oil, so is whipped or anything else..when it darkens you've heated it up too much imo..yes wax and honeycomb are a bit different


My opinion is that you should properly extract and purge your oil then smoke it...all the bullshit to make it look pretty hurts flavor and potency
 

Bublonichronic

Well-Known Member
Thanks Guzias1. Ya for sure!
1. This thread is huge so I've been making my way through it. I'm up to page 98..From the stuff I've read that you guys have posted I can see that there is definitely a phenomena where some oils just wont wax up. I think that's what's happening with the oil I'm working with right now. It's from 2 month old sugar trim and popcorn. I have tried all temps with it from slow low to medium, to higher. I've tried very gradually increasing temps, everything with it. Question: Have you found that the oils that wouldn't wax up good for you were from older oil, or do you think it has more to do with the oil getting too warm at some point therefor somehow changing the chemistry of it?
2. I know this question's answer could vary a bit depending on strain, amount of tane in it pre vac, temp during purge etc. but I'm just looking for an average..Question: How long on the average would you think it would take a 20 gram chunk of oil to purge to full wax honeycomb? I'm using 20 gram as a number cause my tube fits a QP in it so at 18% return it should be somewhere around 20 gram runs I'm going to be doing if I can get this process down good.
3. Do you think stopping the vac during purging along the way negatively affects the outcome on how good the oil will wax up?
4. How many times along the process do you think on the average to you fold the oil back to center then re vac after the muffin has gotten more stable?
5. Have you done runs with just sugar trim and no buds? If so how do you think it turns out compared to just bud runs?
6. If I'm going to use small popcorn do you think it's necessary to cut them up or just run them as popcorn? At what size bud would you start to cut up?
7. When you feel the oil has waxed to completion do you turn off the heat while the it's still in the vac then let slowly dry under vac pressure; or just pull it out while still warm then room temp dry under no vac?
8. Not sure if my vac gauge is fucked or not but it's reading past 30 hg on full vac. The numbers run out at 30 but I'm guessing it would have to be 31-32 if it's accurate. Is this possible? I thought a full vac was 30 max? If it is pulling that high is that a bad thing? Is there a "magic" number that works best for making honeycomb? I see people saying 28-29.8 hg etc..
9. Do you think its critical or more affective to have the vac pump continuously running at full vac or do you get the chamber to full vac then close the valves and turn the pump off?
10. Oil color: I understand that the strain type, and the length of flower time ie. trichome color will affect the finished color of the oil BUT is there any other factors that affect how dark the oil gets during this whole process getting to honeycomb? It just seems so odd that a nice yellow color oil after extraction can turn to such a dark oil during purging. I'm wondering if it may have something to do with the oil surface physically touching the bottom of the heated chamber (on parchment though) during purging. I'm wondering if it would lessen the oil darkening if the oil is first put into a bowl, or ramekin on parchment then into the chamber so there is no direct heat touching the oil. More like creating an oven affect on the oil...thoughts?
11. What does you user name mean? :grin:

Thanks a lot Guzias!

If you ever have any questions about flowers fire away or send me a pm anytime.
Ill give it a whack:joint::-?

1. Yes, older material seems to be darker and less likly to comb and just stay goopy

2. Larger batch than I ususly run, but shouldn't take more than a couple hours to purge

3. not sure what "how good the oil will wax up" means..but as far as consistancy for regular taffy like wax no, honeycomb not sure yet...i dont know why i always assume people using a vac want honeycomb, can make taffywax on your pyrex with a whip in notime

4. I Only really fold it if its about to run off the parchment paper

5. IMO nug runs taste much better /better start product better end product

6. I put my material in a blender, but don't powder it i like the consistency of weed out of a grinder

7. It Should comb under heat in vac

8. My chamber only gets to 28.5 not sure what's up with that being over 30

9. Can turn off ur pump, sometimes I just leave it on tho

10. I think time in vac may affect color "aswell as heat, that's why I like higher heat with less time in vac

Your turn guz
 

vacpurge

New Member
alright, tried it all with 0 heat.

evap butane with 0 heat..dont think this made a difference.

then vaced with no heat. 65F room temp, maybe a bit cold here in canada late october.

formed a half ass muffin which wasnt able to break. then it kinda dried and solidified like that.

I then put it in the chamber at 120F over night, and it started to half wax. I took a chunk out to smoke, its tasty, half waxed. going to let the other piece sit and dry out just for ol times sake, and because its not worth winterizing these tiny runs that I do nowadays :(






some reclaim that I cleaned the bong with everclear, evapped it (no filter or winterizing... oops)... its smokeable. perma goo though:




an old pic





 

Twitch

Well-Known Member
i am too baked to answer these but here it goes

1- i do think that is the case with yours it is old material
2- the fresher the material the faster it waxes in my experience, i have waxed up 50 grams in 12 hours
3- no
4- never its a preference thing
5- it depends on how the trim is treated IMG-20130906-00595.jpg the stuff on the far left was flower all the other stuff was trim. it really does depend on how you treat and take care of the trim i treat mine like flower(almost) also i have found that if you are going to blast some stuff from a motorized trimmer and you can see the oil is green, put it under a florescent light it breaks down the chlorophyll while still in the pyrex before you purge it

6- if its the bullshit scrap that is at the bottom of the plant no, if it is actual buds i break up with my hands, or i put in freezer till brittle then put in vac sealer and vac it and it smashes it just right lol
7- once it is to your liking pull it out and and dab it, there are a couple of different consistences that are fully purged you will have to find what you like
8- i leave mine running, i have left mine running for 36 hours straight.
9- if you are below sea level then it might be correct, if your above see level it wont reach full vac and only say 28. something but that will be their full vac
the 28.9 or 29.8 is because that is what thc boils off at i still run mine at full vac, i cant accurately get it to that number, so just running it at full vac will still get you the comb just as fast
10- yes the heat is what does it



sorry i know you didnt ask me but my 2 cents is worth exactly 37 dollars in change....
 

Guzias1

Well-Known Member
Ok bc. Do you have any current questions? Oyther related. Getting that comb?

loll. i think bc was happy to spill his burning thoughts. i too have sooo many questions... i'll be happy to lend some ideas. its still very educational to meee.

hey vp, giving in to the whip ehh!?!??! kiss-ass

i jk, looking good dude, whipping helps us use less heat.. good work canada




[/QUOTE]



Thanks Guzias1. Ya for sure!


1. This thread is huge so I've been making my way through it. I'm up to page 98..From the stuff I've read that you guys have posted I can see that there is definitely a phenomena where some oils just wont wax up. I think that's what's happening with the oil I'm working with right now. It's from 2 month old sugar trim and popcorn. I have tried all temps with it from slow low to medium, to higher. I've tried very gradually increasing temps, everything with it. Question: Have you found that the oils that wouldn't wax up good for you were from older oil, or do you think it has more to do with the oil getting too warm at some point therefor somehow changing the chemistry of it?
this question has been not fully answered since day 1 of this game.. back when i started, there were three runs i that really left an impact on my brain.. my first time ever waxing something was with old well stored trim. my 2nd time was with someone elses old ass trim, but better, (joint worthy) .. my third attempt was with stored outdoor buds from the year before.. i totally expected beautiful wax.. well, i never got it, got goo for life. i dooo believe i did not fully muffin the last one though..
_ok, now, a big thing i need to say, since i can remember, im pretty 99% + sure that when i get a solid muffin at room temp (prior ro heat) ive always achaieved solid shatter, or honeycomb..
_now, since ive been making oils, i have strayed away from making room temp muffins .. why? because muffins have wasted shit loads of my life(fold, vac, refold, vac, ahhh!!!).. and heavy waited loads tend to make extremely huge muffins.. i like to keep my chamber smaller, for muh vac..
_now.. since i stopped making muffins, i have also picked up gooing shit for life.. not so easy to move goo.. but goo tastes pretty good to me :] ..
_andd ya, i think the muffin test is a good way to find out if you are gonna get a touchable consistency at the end..
_but i do think there are better ways to be discovered.. whipping really catches my attention.. a combo of vac, whip and maybe low heat should get great stuff..



2. I know this question's answer could vary a bit depending on strain, amount of tane in it pre vac, temp during purge etc. but I'm just looking for an average..Question: How long on the average would you think it would take a 20 gram chunk of oil to purge to full wax honeycomb? I'm using 20 gram as a number cause my tube fits a QP in it so at 18% return it should be somewhere around 20 gram runs I'm going to be doing if I can get this process down good.
its hard to judjge time of purge to comb.. many of us have had quick turn arounds, and not so quick.. your technique plays a huge role as well. not just strain. some people will go hot water bath, fan, and scrape after most bubbles have stoppped moving, i tend to not wait that long, i feel like i start to vac when the liquid is still kind of runny.. i think this adds to a longer time purging.. people also tend to whip a bit before vac, i have seen this produce beautiful results, with amazing speeds.. i think we just want to keep the bubbles moving, at a decent rate, but also low heat if any.. i think if you can get an oil stable in a vac at lets say 100F+ at full vac, you got some great stuff in our normal atmosphere... (stable means not sticky, runny, hard) if you can get an oil stable at 120F+ at full vac, that is also amazing, but over kill.. i have witnessed a natural process of decarboxilation happen right in front of my eyes this year.. i once made a nice batch of honeycomb, well, i did something stupid with the vac, and some how the oil from the vac got all into/over my honeycomb.. sooo, i had this nice nasty honeycomb stash sit up top a shelf in my room for over a year now.. anddddd, not till recently did i find it starting to puddle, i would say its decarboxilating!! THE POINT, high temps and vac are like hugeeeee effects on the thc. i find the trichomes to be ESPECIALLY baby like once near the final stage of the purge.. meaning i would rec you try finishing off around the 100-110F range and not full vac.. BUT! prior to that, bubble away, just slow down at the end.. and each time seems to be different in my experience, so have fun watching!!


3. Do you think stopping the vac during purging along the way negatively affects the outcome on how good the oil will wax up?
ok, im still learning the vac part heheheee. but! here is my theory, the bubbles gotta keep moving, and they preferably need to be evenly purging across the entire surace.. now, i am against violent boil off. but i am for quick like bubble action, just not extremely fast.. k?
during the early vac stage, i like to bleed my vacuum by cracking it a tad, while I vac at desired HG. if i sealed off my chamber, i would gain pressure due to the bubbles, and that would eventually lead to entirely slow purge process. i tend to monitor my vac process the whole time, (takes timeee for me) each time the bubbles stop, i re vac, OR re fold , OR raise temp.. just depends ya know??


4. How many times along the process do you think on the average to you fold the oil back to center then re vac after the muffin has gotten more stable?
i fold my shit back to the center A LOT!!, i dont think anyone realizes how often i do it.. i need to get some fucken slick pads for this.. the folding part plays a huge role, its basically our clean form of mixing shit up.. (WHIPPING) folding also helps me judge its progess. SINCE i have not been doing the muffin, i have been playing with low heat, and manyyy folds :] once my folds start to get reallllyyyy thick and stretchy, i know im close to the finish line!!!


5. Have you done runs with just sugar trim and no buds? If so how do you think it turns out compared to just bud runs?
ive done runs with sugar trim, buds, shitty trim, altogether, you name it.. my input: if its ALL from the same harvest, then it ALL depends on the harvest.. was it an early chop? was it full grown crop? was it a flowered crop that started revegging?? ... i have found my best runs to come from early harvest trichomes.. whether it be a trim, nugs, moldy bud.. just early harvest gets you the gold.. thats the secret.. i also think i got some nice stuff from a plant that started revegging, larfy ass outdoor plant, but made nice oil, yield sucked.. NOW, once you start mixing different flavors, thats where you could potenitally run into problems.. one batch made with good trim from a good harvest mixed with another batch made from buds from a not so good harvest will have an overall bad taste to something just made with the good trim..


6. If I'm going to use small popcorn do you think it's necessary to cut them up or just run them as popcorn? At what size bud would you start to cut up?
i take small popcorn and run them through my grinder.. just last night i got a bag of "trim" ok, so.. as much as i love it, i hated it.. this bag had sooo many smalls in it(popcorn) sooo, instead of going straight into my tube, i had to send it all through my grinder to get the consistency i prefer.. i find the better you break down you material, the better the yield. that being said, you got to be careful breaking down your material, if you go too fine, you will pick up a lot of crap in your outcome.. that being said, if you just blast straight buds, smalls big, yield wont be as much as if you ground them, buttttt, you sure will get some delightful stuff, be sure not to use a ridicualous amount when spraying just buds.. dont spray soo much, reblast the ground buds..


7. When you feel the oil has waxed to completion do you turn off the heat while the it's still in the vac then let slowly dry under vac pressure; or just pull it out while still warm then room temp dry under no vac?
iiii haveeeee usually dropped the heat down, but never really off to finish off. like i said earlier, i think its pretty good to finished under 29hg, and arou nd 100F.. consistently though.. i would refold, melt down, and end it like that..


8. Not sure if my vac gauge is fucked or not but it's reading past 30 hg on full vac. The numbers run out at 30 but I'm guessing it would have to be 31-32 if it's accurate. Is this possible? I thought a full vac was 30 max? If it is pulling that high is that a bad thing? Is there a "magic" number that works best for making honeycomb? I see people saying 28-29.8 hg etc..
soo, i had a vac it pro setup, my gauge was offff. i would not trust a cheap gauge. up in the 29 hg range is pretty crazy. if you are hitting 30HG, i wouldnt.. get a reliable gauge.


9. Do you think its critical or more affective to have the vac pump continuously running at full vac or do you get the chamber to full vac then close the valves and turn the pump off?
i think heat, and stage determines which vac you should be at. well. if you are tryin to preserve anyhting, like color, terps.. i let my vac run full vac while doing initial boil off.


10. Oil color: I understand that the strain type, and the length of flower time ie. trichome color will affect the finished color of the oil BUT is there any other factors that affect how dark the oil gets during this whole process getting to honeycomb? It just seems so odd that a nice yellow color oil after extraction can turn to such a dark oil during purging. I'm wondering if it may have something to do with the oil surface physically touching the bottom of the heated chamber (on parchment though) during purging. I'm wondering if it would lessen the oil darkening if the oil is first put into a bowl, or ramekin on parchment then into the chamber so there is no direct heat touching the oil. More like creating an oven affect on the oil...thoughts?
ive seen peoploe make light colored stuff with old material, but they only whipped,. i usually get a darker honeycomb too, i believe its our heat. thats why i want to figure out a low heat, whipped, vac'd product.



11. What does you user name mean?
 

BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
Hey guys thank you very much to all of you!! Very cool you guys take the time to help. Some of the friendliest most helpful people I've met have been on weed forums.
Well this has helped me a lot and I'm ready to really concentrate on fine tuning things and doing some controlled tests to see what works the best for me with different types of trim, bud, strains etc. both fresh off the plants and dried cured buds.
I really like to do things in a controlled scientific way to see if there is consistencies that can help predict a good outcome.

Guzias not sure what that answer to question 11 means lol! :D

So this batch of my old bud/trim oil did manage to eventually thicken up a bit and ended up being breakable at room temperature but it's kind of like a shattery type of wax if I had to describe it somewhat. I'll get a pic of it up here soon. Just wanted to reply to you guys as soon as I read your posts.

I'm going to blast some fresh of the drying rack buds tonight. It's OG Kush. I'll do some popcorn stuff and some top hand trimmed heavily trich caked stuff to see how the difference in those is.
When we process we use a spinner trim machine to do the lower smaller buds and the bigger top buds we hand trim them all so there is a lot more sugar on the big top pieces.

I'll take pics of my process and see what conclusions I can hopefully come up with. I think I should also break up my samples I'm going to blast into whipped and non whipped batches to also see how the end products differ from each other. I'll label them as I go to see what's up.

Thanks again guys!

S
 

Twitch

Well-Known Member
you will not get replies like that on any other forums this really is the best one and im a a member on a few
 

BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
So here's how that batch ended up..It did eventually wax up. Just not as kind of crumbly as I was hoping or picturing it would be; but it broke in pieces at room temp and didn't bend or get soft. It's a decent starting point for me I think. I've got lots of ideas in mind to improve on things since I've been taking in all the info you guys gave me.
IMG_0499.jpgIMG_0500.jpgIMG_0502.jpgIMG_0505.jpg
 

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BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
That bud pic in the above post was supposed to go in this post. I didn't realize I uploaded it when I hit post..Tried to edit it but it won't allow me to take that pic out or I'm doing something wrong?
Anyway so I ain't wasting any time lol. I got started tonight on the next run :weed:

For this run I am just using top buds from a crop that finished up off the racks 2 weeks ago. So pretty fresh compared to the last run that was 2 months old and had trim in it with the buds. This one is all just large hand trimmed top buds of OG.

I chopped up the big buds with scissors then buzzed them for a couple of seconds in the bud buster (coffee grinder) to get the pieces finer.

Here's some pics of the new run:
View attachment 2863630IMG_0508.jpgIMG_0510.jpgIMG_0511.jpgIMG_0514.jpgIMG_0516.jpgIMG_0517.jpgIMG_0519.jpg
 

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BCOGYODA

Well-Known Member
IMG_0521.jpgIMG_0522.jpgIMG_0523.jpg
Started with 165 grams of ground bud. When I did the extraction I spilled some of the extracted product while moving it to the double boiler room temp purge. I think I probably lost about 3-5 grams worth of oil. Fucking lame! The water in the double boiler never got warmer than 90F. I slowly purged like that for probably close to 2 hrs with a fan blowing over it before I scraped it up and put it on the parchment then into the vac for no heat chamber purging.
 
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