atheist vs muslim

Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
i'm not complaining about people defending themselves. if i am attacked, i have no problem defending myself.
i'm complaining about people showing up looking for a fight under the pretense of "defending people"...
as long as antifa doesn't throw the first punch, or brick, or engage in property damage, i have no problem with them defending themselves if attacked.
you sure that's what's happening? i'm not asking you what the proud boys are doing, or anyone else...are you sure that antifa doesn't show up and instigate shit? no problem with them showing up....no problem with them responding to threats....big problem with them being the threat
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
I mean the political forums too.

Why is it that you only complain about antifa and not fascist goons?
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there's no shortage of people complaining about fascist goons. i'm trying to bring up the point that you can contaminate yourself with violence. that the acts of others do not have to dictate your responses. that if you find the methods of your foe unconscionable, then you CANNOT use the same methods yourself, without being as guilty as they are. violence can't be a knee jerk reaction. if you're going to resort to violence, make it sudden, make it terrible, and make it effective. fighting in the streets is for teenagers and drunks.
organize, plan, execute.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
i'm not complaining about people defending themselves. if i am attacked, i have no problem defending myself.
i'm complaining about people showing up looking for a fight under the pretense of "defending people"...
as long as antifa doesn't throw the first punch, or brick, or engage in property damage, i have no problem with them defending themselves if attacked.
you sure that's what's happening? i'm not asking you what the proud boys are doing, or anyone else...are you sure that antifa doesn't show up and instigate shit? no problem with them showing up....no problem with them responding to threats....big problem with them being the threat
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So, a crowd of people drive from hundreds of miles away to converge on my city carrying weapons, body armor and touting white supremacist racist agenda who continue to beat people who oppose them after they have stopped resisting is ok with you.

Locals who stand up to them, interfere with their marches through our streets is free speech too. Defending one's self from them is deplorable to you.

Got it.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
there's no shortage of people complaining about fascist goons. i'm trying to bring up the point that you can contaminate yourself with violence. that the acts of others do not have to dictate your responses. that if you find the methods of your foe unconscionable, then you CANNOT use the same methods yourself, without being as guilty as they are. violence can't be a knee jerk reaction. if you're going to resort to violence, make it sudden, make it terrible, and make it effective. fighting in the streets is for teenagers and drunks.
organize, plan, execute.
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People defending themselves and the streets of their city from fascists who attacked them is not wrong.
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
So, a crowd of people drive from hundreds of miles away to converge on my city carrying weapons, body armor and touting white supremacist racist agenda who continue to beat people who oppose them after they have stopped resisting is ok with you.

Locals who stand up to them, interfere with their marches through our streets is free speech too. Defending one's self from them is deplorable to you.

Got it.
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that's not what i said. that's pretty much the opposite of what i said. defending yourself is perfectly acceptable, indeed, it's commendable.
starting the shit to begin with is not acceptable. and not effective. why don't you guys get together and make a plan? waving signs and throwing bottles is not an effective deterrent. organized, determined, planned resistance is effective. make a wedge, divide their crowd, then divide it more. pinpoint the effective fighters and target them. bring them down and the rest will scatter. you want to keep fighting in the street? keep doing what you're doing. you want to make these people afraid to show their faces? get effective, target leaders, make it hurt to achieve their goals, make it hurt to do everything they do. then go beyond. target them online with propaganda, use their own means against them. you don't even have to lie like they do, just tell the truth.

yeah, i think it's great to let people push me around.....i just don't stand around talking shit about it, if someone pushes me, i push back, and if they swing at me, i swing back.

i just make goddamn sure i'm swinging BACK, not first
 
Venus55

Venus55

Well-Known Member
I think it’s insane that the MOMENT someone has an opposing view they’re Instantly labelled some kind of racist, Nazi, anti-this anti-that. . Like WTF. This is bigotry at its finest. Conformity. “These are my views and I want them to be yours. Conform”. But that’s just it, views and opinions are exactly all they are.

Anyone here claiming Hitler was a practising Christian is deluding themselves. But I’m not saying that he wasn’t a Christian either. I’m saying NOBODY really knows. There’s only opinions and speculations. If anyone knew for fact there would be no discussion. (Is God Real?)


And what I don’t get the most is WHY DOES IT MATTER?? Why does it matter that much to u today that randoms online think the exact same way as you, or they’re worthy of your insults? you’re willing to spend your life arguing, making life miserable (for everyone) in an attempt to “force” YOUR opinion and your view onto strangers.
Don’t get me wrong, debate IS healthy. An even ebb and flow of thoughts, ideals, beliefs. And potentially see things from a different perspective. Grow , I think they call it.

@schuylaar, u say the politics section or just politics isn’t any cause of divisiveness. Are u kidding me? Politics is the essence of divide lol. gimme a break.
 
MichiganMedGrower

MichiganMedGrower

Well-Known Member
Venus55 said:
I think it’s insane that the MOMENT someone has an opposing view they’re Instantly labelled some kind of racist, Nazi, anti-this anti-that. . Like WTF. This is bigotry at its finest. Conformity. “These are my views and I want them to be yours. Conform”. But that’s just it, views and opinions are exactly all they are.

Anyone here claiming Hitler was a practising Christian is deluding themselves. But I’m not saying that he wasn’t a Christian either. I’m saying NOBODY really knows. There’s only opinions and speculations. If anyone knew for fact there would be no discussion. (Is God Real?)


And what I don’t get the most is WHY DOES IT MATTER?? Why does it matter that much to u today that randoms online think the exact same way as you, or they’re worthy of your insults? you’re willing to spend your life arguing, making life miserable (for everyone) in an attempt to “force” YOUR opinion and your view onto strangers.
Don’t get me wrong, debate IS healthy. An even ebb and flow of thoughts, ideals, beliefs. And potentially see things from a different perspective. Grow , I think they call it.

@schuylaar, u say the politics section or just politics isn’t any cause of divisiveness. Are u kidding me? Politics is the essence of divide lol. gimme a break.
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I agree with all this except Hitler came from a Jewish family.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
that's not what i said. that's pretty much the opposite of what i said. defending yourself is perfectly acceptable, indeed, it's commendable.
starting the shit to begin with is not acceptable. and not effective. why don't you guys get together and make a plan? waving signs and throwing bottles is not an effective deterrent. organized, determined, planned resistance is effective. make a wedge, divide their crowd, then divide it more. pinpoint the effective fighters and target them. bring them down and the rest will scatter. you want to keep fighting in the street? keep doing what you're doing. you want to make these people afraid to show their faces? get effective, target leaders, make it hurt to achieve their goals, make it hurt to do everything they do. then go beyond. target them online with propaganda, use their own means against them. you don't even have to lie like they do, just tell the truth.

yeah, i think it's great to let people push me around.....i just don't stand around talking shit about it, if someone pushes me, i push back, and if they swing at me, i swing back.

i just make goddamn sure i'm swinging BACK, not first
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I don't want to keep fighting in the streets. Why do you keep saying that? I want neo-nazi outsiders to stop converging on my city to march through my streets carrying their racist white power message. They come here with the intent of creating mayhem and to fight. How do I know that? They say that's their intent on their message boards.

Sorry, antifa are amateurs and we don't have spotters on buildings, a command center, training camps and so forth. The people standing with them are just schlubs, me included. I admit that we aren't as well armed or trained as the neo-Nazis. Others have rightfully complained we don't have good fashion sense too. Guilty as charged.

It gets chaotic when the two groups collide. You are nuts if you think people must wait to take the blow before they can protect themselves or the people next to them. Maybe the fascists should stop driving into our city to do violence and spread their message of hate, death and domination. Our message is quite simple. The good people of this city won't let these outsiders walk our streets safely. We won't.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Venus55 said:
I think it’s insane that the MOMENT someone has an opposing view they’re Instantly labelled some kind of racist, Nazi, anti-this anti-that. . Like WTF. This is bigotry at its finest. Conformity. “These are my views and I want them to be yours. Conform”. But that’s just it, views and opinions are exactly all they are.

Anyone here claiming Hitler was a practising Christian is deluding themselves. But I’m not saying that he wasn’t a Christian either. I’m saying NOBODY really knows. There’s only opinions and speculations. If anyone knew for fact there would be no discussion. (Is God Real?)


And what I don’t get the most is WHY DOES IT MATTER?? Why does it matter that much to u today that randoms online think the exact same way as you, or they’re worthy of your insults? you’re willing to spend your life arguing, making life miserable (for everyone) in an attempt to “force” YOUR opinion and your view onto strangers.
Don’t get me wrong, debate IS healthy. An even ebb and flow of thoughts, ideals, beliefs. And potentially see things from a different perspective. Grow , I think they call it.

@schuylaar, u say the politics section or just politics isn’t any cause of divisiveness. Are u kidding me? Politics is the essence of divide lol. gimme a break.
Click to expand...
If you read Roger and my dialogue you'll see we are debating differences of opinion without all the name calling. I don't think we are going to come to an agreement on this subject, but we do agree about many other things political in nature.

Opposing fascism is opposing bigotry.

Your definition of politics is inaccurate.
 
gwheels

gwheels

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
So, a crowd of people drive from hundreds of miles away to converge on my city carrying weapons, body armor and touting white supremacist racist agenda who continue to beat people who oppose them after they have stopped resisting is ok with you.

Locals who stand up to them, interfere with their marches through our streets is free speech too. Defending one's self from them is deplorable to you.

Got it.
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What a country you live in....
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
gwheels said:
What a country you live in....
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I live in the US and I proudly call Portland Oregon my city. We don't let neo-Nazis march in our streets. I didn't create this mess. It's the times we live in.
 
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MichiganMedGrower

MichiganMedGrower

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
You’re racist because you told a black military veteran that he only succeeded due to affirmative action

Hitler cited the Bible for authority, used Christian rhetoric in his speeches, promoted the German Christians, and had a 600,000 strong ‘storm troopers for Jesus christ’ force in a 98% white and Christian nation

You are a dumb shit
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I told you multisock buck. Just to make you act out more. You are a pathetic troll.

And I am aware of the history. Spent every Sunday in school at temple Emanuel listening to the stories.

You’re new. And in obvious panic.
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
MichiganMedGrower said:
I told you multisock buck. Just to make you act out more. You are a pathetic troll.

And I am aware of the history. Spent every Sunday in school at temple Emanuel listening to the stories.

You’re new. And in obvious panic.
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You’re a dumb racist who is trying to deny history

One day you’re gonna slip up and deny the holocaust and then say you were “just joking”
 
gwheels

gwheels

Well-Known Member
That unclebuck...shit i had an angry rant there and realized...wtf do i care.

Jesus even loves unclebuck...
 
gwheels

gwheels

Well-Known Member
Jesus was closer to black than white. It is hard for me i see no colour only people. But I am a canuck eh....

Most wonderful country on the planet...but we have our problems...fucking liberal party of canada.

:D

But weed is almost legal.
 
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