Al B. FAQt

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sparkafire

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Hi AL Having an issue with my transplanted MUMS I transplanted my mums from sitting in pellets in 6in RW and i needed to get them with the rest of my plants on a 2hr flood.

I put them in buckets with RW above the water line. My leaves have started to look like PIC below yellowing leaves along with being very papery and rough in texture the plant seems very weak and just not feeling well in general I believe its Magnesium deficiency.

I am thinking flushing the RW just because of the buildup of crap in it and see where that gets me.

What are my options to fix this? I am kinda at a loss here.

I am using Flora Nova VEG 1400 PPM it was 3 hr water cycle 24 /7 but just moved it to 2 hr water and 18/6 light and it is always 5.8PH

Thanks ABF




My set up

 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
I am using Flora Nova
First, get an inorganic nutrient. The sales lit on FloraNova indicates that it is partly organic. It is thus incompatible with H2O2. H2O2 could be breaking down the organics into forms unusable by the plant, causing this problem.

As a side note, I've been looking at Botanicare's product line as a result of several ppl asking me questions about grows while using their products. Botanicare have some odd mixes of inorganic and organic nutes as well as organic nutes, which cause problems through incompatibility with H2O2. Hydroguard is a protein-based enzymatic agent which is also incompatible with H2O2. Sweet and Clearex are sugar-based magic sauces which are fully useless in hydroponics. Liquid Karma is a growth stimulant, organic based, meaning it is also incompatible with H2O2.They also don't tell you what's in it, making it a 'magic sauce.' Their Hydroplex bloom enhancer is about the only thing they sell that I'd even consider using; they do give good information about what's in it.
 

growinman

Well-Known Member
:mrgreen:Al, could you please direct me to a pic of yours showing what your pots look like? I cant seem to find one and I am wondering what exactly to get.... If you keep the majority of the roots inside, do the pots just have holes in the bottom?<----how long does it take to flood them then?

Thanks for your time!! and expert help!!:joint::joint:
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
:mrgreen:Al, could you please direct me to a pic of yours showing what your pots look like? I cant seem to find one and I am wondering what exactly to get.... If you keep the majority of the roots inside, do the pots just have holes in the bottom?<----how long does it take to flood them then?
They are ordinary black plastic pots intended for soil with drain holes in the bottom, 175mm top dia, 130mm bottom dia, 175mm tall. Water from flooding enters and leaves just fine, thanks. Takes the same time to flood them as the pump takes raise the flood level to the overflow.

Netpots are not desirable in this application.
 

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
Al,

Thanks again for all the valuable information.

Do you worry about moving your plants around or do you do it on a regular basis? I know you obviously move them every 2 weeks when they switch trays but in between those times do you rotate/move them very often? Does that cause shock while the plant tries to re-align towards the lights?

Also, over many posts I have read 3 sizes for your flood trays. 4'x4' which we both know is wrong, 900 mm from the Errata on one of your monster posts and 820 mm from another location. What is the true answer?

For the flood tray in one post you said that you flood your trays to 150mm depth and in another post you recommended that the tray be flooded between 100mm - 120mm. Provided that the plant in a 40mm rockwool cube is 1/2" above the flood line would it be preferrable to flood as much of the pot as possible or just to a set level in pots filled with rockwool flock liner and fytocell?

I am finishing getting supplies together and am just trying to think the grow through so that I can be prepared for many of the minute details.

Thanks in advance.
 

gvega187

Well-Known Member
al, do you have any experience with hygrozyme? I hear you can basically use it as a substitute for h2o2 in some cases. It prevents root rot as does h2o2, but works well with organic/chem nutes like floranova.

haven't checked out the FAQ'd lately, but looks like it is only getting more popular. Thanks for hanging in there pro.
 

growinman

Well-Known Member
They are ordinary black plastic pots intended for soil with drain holes in the bottom, 175mm top dia, 130mm bottom dia, 175mm tall. Water from flooding enters and leaves just fine, thanks. Takes the same time to flood them as the pump takes raise the flood level to the overflow.

Netpots are not desirable in this application.
Thanks for the quick response, Al!! This is just what I needed to know to get this thing going tonight.... I didn't thinnk they could be the regular pots---now I dont even have to go to HD, let alone the hydro store!!:peace:bongsmilie Have a great night!!
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Al,
I know you obviously move them every 2 weeks when they switch trays but in between those times do you rotate/move them very often?
No, not usually. I put the shortest plants nearest the light when shifting them from tray to tray.
Does that cause shock while the plant tries to re-align towards the lights?
No, phototroping toward light does not cause 'shock.' When we talk about 'shocking' a plant, it's usually in reference to transplant shock, in which roots are torn in the process of transplantation, which causes the plant to wilt.
Also, over many posts I have read 3 sizes for your flood trays. 4'x4' which we both know is wrong, 900 mm from the Errata on one of your monster posts and 820 mm from another location. What is the true answer?
They're both right. The trays have a lip that runs around the edge, which rests on the stand. The overall dimensions including the lip are 900 x 900mm. The dimensions of the flat floor of the tray where pots sit are 820mm x 820mm.

For the flood tray in one post you said that you flood your trays to 150mm depth and in another post you recommended that the tray be flooded between 100mm - 120mm. Provided that the plant in a 40mm rockwool cube is 1/2" above the flood line would it be preferable to flood as much of the pot as possible or just to a set level in pots filled with rockwool flock liner and fytocell?
The 'flood to 1/2" below RW cube' spec is for pots of pellets where clones have been started in RW cubes. When using RW floc as a medium, it's really only necessary to flood to about 50mm deep as RW has a strong wicking action. With Fytocell, I flood it to a depth similar to that for pellets but much less often, 2x/lights-on for wks 1-2 flowering plants, and 3x/lights-on for more developed plants.
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
al, do you have any experience with hygrozyme? I hear you can basically use it as a substitute for h2o2 in some cases. It prevents root rot as does h2o2, but works well with organic/chem nutes like floranova.
yes, if you're deadset upon using organics, you'd use an enzymatic agent to help break down dead organic matter. However, they do not kill pathogens nor do they give off O2 in the rootmass while so doing.

Thanks for the quick response, Al!! This is just what I needed to know to get this thing going tonight.... I didn't thinnk they could be the regular pots---now I dont even have to go to HD, let alone the hydro store!!
yep, ordinary average pots for soil.



I used to buy them at Kmart, found them for half the price ($0.45/ea in stacks of 70) at a gardening plastics supply house.
 

ShirShmokesAlot

Active Member
hello..
So i've read the first 127 pages of your FAQ before i even registered to join the site. figured it was definately worth my time. anyway i was just wondering if you had some pointers and tips for a newb. i've grown a couple cycles before, but non educated like, alot of trial and error, whatnot. its been a few years, and i'm definately ready to get back to being self supplied. i will have a 400w hps special coming from htg, it should be here 1-2 days. i have a blank canvas, plenty of room, and unlimited potental. i would love to stay right in the 2'x3' range for flowering, and will be following your specs for clones and "mums", i can get all that on my own, naturally unfortunately i will have to grow in soil, as that i am a total newb, and dont want to mess with hyd til i have a little more experience handling the plants. any suggestions or advice for a smooth start would be greatly appreciated.
thanks a million.
 

DeweyKox

Well-Known Member
Yo Al, How the hell do I get this Clue like stinkyness off my fingers? After handling the plants, I wash my hands with soap and water, and makes not difference, should I where gloves?

And is this all the THC, and is there a way when touching them especially during harvest where you wont take it off the plants onto your hands?
 

Dugout

Active Member
Hey Al, haven't talked to you in a few days so I thought I would let you know what is going on. I have 2 seedlings that have come up. I planted one about 2 days before the other because the second seed I started on the first day didn't make it. Anyway the seed that was planted 2 days later has caught up and passed the first seed by about an inch. The stem seems to be a little spendally it almost makes an S shape. Is there anything I can do to correct this situation. I have about 8 days before transfering to hydro unit and will waite about 4 days after that to start nutes at a low low level. Planning on bumping it up every 4 days till at desired level I thought I heard you say when you add nutes to change your water every time is this even as you are raising the PH levels to desired amounts? Well bro I hope this message finds you doing well. I look forward to hearing from you as always. Peace and out The Ole Hippy DUGOUT
 

ldnsharkkid

Well-Known Member
Hey al, whats up mate?? I was hoping you might be able to lend me an opinion on my setup, and anything i may be doing incorrectly, you are 'DA' man when it comes to flood and drain. My main questions if you dont have time to look at my journal are:

1. Im going to fire up the MH over my seedlings in about 2 days, so they will be 14/15 days old, and they will also be in the hydro system, does this sound ok and how high would you start the hanging, im using a supernova reflector with no glass and it isnt aircooled, temps aren't a problem always 24-26c ??

2. I know you only flood twice a day because ur medium retains some solution, but as i will be using clay pebbles how many times should i flood the tray, i was thinking 5 times a day, 1 at lights on, 1 5 hours into lights on, 1 an hour from lights off, and then twice while its dark evenly spaced out, does this sound ok or too much???

3. If you dont mind having a look at some of my pics, i have some reddish/brown spots on my leaves, i have no clue what they are and its only on the 1 plant. Is this likely to be a big problem, i have fed them no nutes so far and the light isnt strong enough to burn the leaves, and even if it was all of them would be burned wouldnt they???

4. 70% Humidity for vegging and 50% for flowering,does this sound correct??

5. Do i need to rinse new clay pebbles and if so what with, ph'd water or some other cleaning solution??

I am fairly well-educated and once i have been told something once i grasp it pretty quickly and dont repeat questions/errors which hopefully will help me out lol......but what i mean is if you explain something quite technical to me, it wont be a problem. Anyways, id love to hear some advice and keep up the good growing, by christmas i will have exactly the same setup as yours but for now its just a 1st grow with 2 flood tables and an XXL budbox, but still the same principles, thanks again anyway............:peace::peace::peace::peace:
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
dont want to mess with hyd til i have a little more experience handling the plants. any suggestions or advice for a smooth start would be greatly appreciated.
My best suggestion is to get over your fear of hydroponics. If you use inorganic nutes, regular dosing with H2O2 and run plants in pots of some sort of media in tray-based flood systems, you will succeed the first time and will continue to do so. Yes, there's some startup costs involved in doing hydroponics- you must have EC & pH meters (about $100 ea) and must acquire the bits for a watering system (tray, tank, air & water pumps, about $50-150 depending on how good a shopper you are), but other than that, there's no difference in the startup cost for a soil based system and hydroponics. A soil grow still needs proper HPS lighting, ventilation and temp control. Soil grows are always slower and less productive than hydroponics.

Yo Al, How the hell do I get this Clue like stinkyness off my fingers? After handling the plants, I wash my hands with soap and water, and makes not difference, should I where gloves?
Cannabis resin is highly soluble in ethanol. Use a squirt of methylated spirit aka denatured alcohol (95% ethanol) on your fingers for cleanup- job done. Also great for cleaning your bong.

And is this all the THC, and is there a way when touching them especially during harvest where you wont take it off the plants onto your hands?
Unfortunately, there's no way to manicure your buds without some THC-bearing resin winding up on your fingers & shears. No worries, you can roll the sticky resin off your fingers (before removing the remaining resin with methylated spirit, of course) and smoke it later.

The stem seems to be a little spendally it almost makes an S shape. Is there anything I can do to correct this situation.
How wet are you keeping the medium you are starting the seeds in? Overwet media will cause excessive stretch in seedlings.

I thought I heard you say when you add nutes to change your water every time is this even as you are raising the PH levels to desired amounts?
Tank maintenance is easy. Add nutrient concentrates to plain tapwater (only- never add concentrates to an existing tank of mixed nutes), check pH. Most nutes include pH buffers, which when you mix for an adequate nute strength, will set the pH very close to 5.8. If the pH doesn't quite come down to 5.8, use a phosphoric acid based pHDown sauce to correct to 5.8.

Tapwater will normally be 7.1-9, you'll almost never have cause to raise pH unless you have added too much pHDown. It takes about 10ml of pHDown to drop my 125L tanks from 6.1-6.3 (where pH sits after adding nutes to my tapwater). If you overshoot below 5.8, you'll need some pHUp sauce (potassium hydroxide based, usually) to fix it. pHUp solutions are effective in VERY small quantity, use it 1ml (or less) at a time. You will want a 10ml syringe for measuring pH adjustment solns.

Hey al, whats up mate?? I was hoping you might be able to lend me an opinion on my setup, and anything i may be doing incorrectly, you are 'DA' man when it comes to flood and drain. My main questions if you dont have time to look at my journal are:

1. Im going to fire up the MH over my seedlings in about 2 days, so they will be 14/15 days old, and they will also be in the hydro system, does this sound ok and how high would you start the hanging, im using a supernova reflector with no glass and it isnt aircooled, temps aren't a problem always 24-26c ??
Yes, you can introduce them to your (unspecified power) MH when they have their 2nd set of true leaves. Start with the lamp about 3-4' above the newbies, drop the lamp 1' after 3-4 days, if all looks well, drop it another 1'. Spacing depends on what size lamp you have.
2. I know you only flood twice a day because ur medium retains some solution, but as i will be using clay pebbles how many times should i flood the tray, i was thinking 5 times a day, 1 at lights on, 1 5 hours into lights on, 1 an hour from lights off, and then twice while its dark evenly spaced out, does this sound ok or too much???
NEVER flood in lights-off. Transpiration all but stops when the lights go out. There will be enough water in the rootmass to get them through the dark period. If you water in lights-off, the water will just sit in the rootmass, which can encourage root rot. Start clones in pots of pellets by watering 5x/lights-on, assuring your RW cube is 1/2" above the flood level. When plants are larger, they can get watered every 2h beginning at lights-on, avoiding watering in the last 2h of lights-on unless the plants are very vigorous and would otherwise wilt before lights-off.

3. If you dont mind having a look at some of my pics, i have some reddish/brown spots on my leaves,
Your closeup photos are too blurry for me to be able to tell you anything.

I'm not sure why you have put your 40mm cubes into larger RW blocks. This isn't necessary and makes overwatering very likely for a new grower. Once they have roots out of the small cubes, they can go into pots of pellets.



4. 70% Humidity for vegging and 50% for flowering,does this sound correct??
70% is too high, will encourage powdery mildew. 30-50% is ideal.
5. Do i need to rinse new clay pebbles and if so what with, ph'd water or some other cleaning solution??
Flush new pellets with copious quantities of plain water to remove any dust from manufacturing.
 

Dugout

Active Member
Hey Al, I have a rockwool medium 1" cube setting in a small trey surounded by clay pellets from hydro unit one of them I have cut down a little to fit into a container with miracle gro took out and planted in small trey after you told me that was no good. I think you are right about the to much water. I have been using a tbl spoon to add water to clay pellets and sometimes wet the cube. I also put a small stick that is used for corn dogs to straighten up stem seems to be working pretty good. So anyway is there anyway to correct the over watering. Thanks bro O yea that first plant that I screwed up so much on I got about 1/4 oz dried and it wasn't to bad nice mellow buzz guess I just got lucky. Things are looking really good so far on my seedlings just need to correct the over watering problem Well bro Peace and out the Ole Hippy DUGOUT
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Hey Al, I have a rockwool medium 1" cube setting in a small trey surounded by clay pellets from hydro unit one of them I have cut down a little to fit into a container with miracle gro took out and planted in small trey after you told me that was no good. I think you are right about the to much water. I have been using a tbl spoon to add water to clay pellets and sometimes wet the cube.
Pellets are not necessary until you have roots out of the cubes and are ready to put the plants into an automated watering system, flood systems work best for new growers.

The worst thing you can do is leave RW cubes in a puddle of water. This will keep them constantly saturated and is a sure way to kill seedlings or clones.

So anyway is there anyway to correct the over watering.
yeah, give them less water! :D The RW cube must never be saturated. It must be damp but never wet.

Abandon the teaspoon measure. It changes by country and can be anything from 5-8ml. Get some 10ml syringes, they're very cheap and much more accurate than a teaspoon for measuring small amts of water or pH adjustment solns.

I don't see a mention of a heat mat. If you had a proper 30C horticultural heat mat, your 25mm cubes would need about 15ml of water per day.

25mm cubes are a bit small, I prefer 40mm plastic wrapped cubes. With 25mm cubes on a heat mat, check them a couple of times a day, giving about 7-8ml at ~12h intervals, more or less as needed. Keep in mind that 25mm cubes will dry out rather quickly. I can't tell you just how quickly; this will vary with the air temp of your seedling/clone box, which should maintain air temp at 30C.

I can tell you that 40mm cubes weigh 5g dry and 20-25g when just damp and not wet. I can't give you as precise figures for 25mm cubes.
 

ldnsharkkid

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the advice Al, much appreciated, i think i may have overwatered them already as they are droopy and its definately not underwatering lol, i havent fed them since yesterday so ill let them dry out some more and see if they perk up, i hope so, but when i was watering them i was basically dipping them in ph'd water for 5 secs and squeezing off the excess water, but im guessin the big cubes hold a lot of water so they were too wet, newbie error but hopefully will be alrite when it goes in the hydro system, still not arrived company takin the mick might be the recession lol..........

And sorry but its a 600w MH gonna have a 600 for each flood table 2 at the mo, hopefully more at christmas.........

Also the pics will be better its ust my phone at the mo but its supposed to be 5 megapixels though lol which is supposed to be pretty good but o well ill grab the digicam from my gf soon,

Thanks for the help Al im sure well be speaking again :eyesmoke::eyesmoke::eyesmoke:
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
they are droopy
yep, overwatered.

i was watering them i was basically dipping them in ph'd water for 5 secs and squeezing off the excess water,
RW will fully saturate in just a second or two. Water cubes by dipping only a corner of the cube into a bucket of pH 5.8 water.

NEVER squeeze rockwool!! This crushes the material and removes all the airspaces. You will have constant problems with overwatering symptoms now that you have crushed the material, until this mob have roots out of the cube bottoms and are ready to go in pots of pellets in a flood system.

but im guessin the big cubes hold a lot of water so they were too wet,
Even small RW cubes are easy to overwater. The term 'overwater' means you have displaced all the air out of the medium with water.

And sorry but its a 600w MH gonna have a 600 for each flood table 2 at the mo, hopefully more at christmas.........
Why a 600MH? The only use you will have in your op for a MH is raising mums and a 175MH will do for that. Use HPS for flowering.

If you can cover the flowering area with a single 1000HPS, you'll get more intensity (165,000lm vs 95,000lm) and save a fair amount of power. A 600HPS will draw about 650-670W from the AC mains. A 1000 will draw about 1100 from the mains.

Also the pics will be better its ust my phone at the mo but its supposed to be 5 megapixels
Could be a million megapixels but that doesn't matter one bit if the camera won't focus close up.
 

poo

Active Member
hi al. I'm really sorry if you already answered this, but i couldn't find it anywhere.

I was reading some of your old posts and gathered that you use or have used canna nutes, and been incontact with the company several times.

My question is, do YOU use full strength nutes? I have a flood and drain table, 400whps, rockwool cubes in hydroton. Res pH 5.7-5.9. I have given them a week at .5ml/L, they are now on 1ml/L - plan for two weeks. Should i go upto 2 or even 3ml/l?

What do u do? Also when i switch to flower, i'll use the same strength (as in ml/L) that i did for veg the week before, but in bloom nutes, thats fine yeah?
 

crypies00

Active Member
Al, Let me first start off by saying, thank you for the amount of time you've spent helping others here. I know I've spent countless hours reading your suggestions (all of the cloning and 2 week thread) and I really do think this setup is the one that makes the most sense.

I've decided to do my own first personal grow (I've been told I need a hobby, too bad I can't include nor tell anyone about my new one!). I have access to a building that has a built in cabinet space. My problem is the cabinet is sectioned off into boxes. I can remove and reinforce any length, but I'm having difficulties trying to determine how best to section off the areas.

Here's a kiddy drawing of what I have to work with:




The box sits against a lightly insulated wall to the outside, which I have the ability to cut through in order to grab fresh air and exhaust old. I know you stress over and over about being able to control air flow and temp. And although it's about to be winter time here I think I can manage with a small heater. But it seems fresh outside air would be best.

Here's what I am thinking about modifying the cabinet to look like.



Any suggestions that would increase efficiency and do you see any potential problems that I am obviously missing due to my inexperience?

And thanks again for putting up with so many damn questions from everyone!
 
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