Would Clinton have carried the DNC in the direction Obama oriented it?

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
If Sanders voted against funding for the troops in a war we were already in, he would have been painted as against the troops. He did the same thing I would have done. Voting to cut the funding during a session of congress completely against it wouldn't have accomplished anything. He voted against the initial invasion because he was smart enough to know it was bullshit at the time, Clinton didn't.
That's such a bullshit copout. Every fucking member of congress was fully aware from very early on where that money was going and it was always a fucking scam to enrich big corporations like KBR and Northrop Grumman. In fact his voting record clearly indicates his position in their pockets in regards to shielding weapons manufacturers from culpability for what is done with their products.
 
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abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
I fought in that war, lost very dear brothers there and continue to dwell in that hell regularly. I came home and helped organize opposition to it and I resent people swearing Bernard has anything to do with that opposition. He even had antiwar protesters arrested in his district in 1999 long before it.

Fuck Bernie Sanders.
 

Stroker

Well-Known Member
I fought in that war, lost very dear brothers there and continue to dwell in that hell regularly. I came home and helped organize opposition to it and I resent people swearing Bernard has anything to do with that opposition. He even had antiwar protesters arrested in his district in 1999 long before it.

Fuck Bernie Sanders.
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Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
That's such a bullshit copout. Every fucking member of congress was fully aware from very early on where that money was going and it was always a fucking scam to enrich big corporations like KBR and Northrop Grumman. In fact his voting record clearly indicates his position in their pockets in regards to shielding weapons manufacturers from culpability regarding what is done with their products.
Yeah, you're right. He should have voted against funding for the troops. That would have solved everything.

You are the most confused individual on RIU
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Yeah, you're right. He should have voted against funding for the troops. That would have solved everything.

You are the most confused individual on RIU
That is exactly what he should have done. If the funding would have dried up we would have redeployed, war over. I don't go around playing the vet card all the time but you can just shut right the hell up. You don't know what you're talking about, you're parroting about something that I lived.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
That is exactly what he should have done. If the funding would have dried up we would have redeployed, war over. I don't go around playing the vet card all the time but you can just shut right the hell up. You don't know what you're talking about, you're parroting about something that I lived.
The funding wouldn't have dried up, even if Sanders voted against it. Name one war in US history that ended because the funding dried up, I'll wait.. Our country puts wars on the credit card for future generations to fund. Trump and the Republicans just passed a ~$700 billion defense budget (an increase of $80 billion) while citizens in Flint Michigan continue to go without clean drinking water. Sanders voted correctly when it came to the floor of the Senate. Unless you're willing to cite your support for some other politician who you think is better than Sanders, you can rightly shut the fuck up about his record on war. He's one of the most anti-war politicians in congress and his record proves it. That might not meet your standards, but since you refuse to name someone you support to contrast Sanders record with, it's irrelevant. Sanders is the best you will get. To criticize him as being some kind of war hawk when he was one of the only members of congress to vote against the biggest foreign policy blunder in United States history is fucking retarded.

Your veteran badge doesn't earn you automatic respect. You never fought for or protected any of my freedoms, you only took them away from 3rd world citizens
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
He's one of the most anti-war politicians in congress and his record proves it.
Red Herring. We're talking about an imperialist shitstain posing as a leftist. Not only that but you're completely wrong. He could have voted against it, if he'd had a conscious or if he wasn't a shitstain. But he is a shitstain. If congress does not appropriate funds for a war for the following quarter, the military would really have no choice but to use its available resources to either redeploy or make due without. The fact is, he voted for it because it is funding that makes war continue and who voted in favor of its waging is really not important, since war can be waged with or without the approval of congress but war cannot be waged without funds.
 
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UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
how is that federal criminal investigation into bernie sanders' bank fraud going?

do you think the grand juries are just a big republican hoax?

LOL
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Red Herring. We're talking about an imperialist shitstain posing as a leftist. Not only that but you're completely wrong. He could have voted against it, if he'd had a conscious or if he wasn't a shitstain. But he is a shitstain. If congress does not appropriate funds for a war for the following quarter, the military would really have no choice but to use its available resources to either redeploy or make due without. The fact is, he voted for it because it is funding that makes war continue and who voted in favor of its waging is really not important, since war can be waged with or without the approval of congress but war cannot be waged without funds.
Then name a single war in US history that ended because congress defunded it

It has never happened

So the idea that Sanders could have voted against funding for the troops already involved in two wars to end it is idiotic. His political opponents, including you, I'm sure, would have said he doesn't support the troops. He supported funding for the troops because he knew they were going to be there regardless of his vote, the same as any sane individual would have done. You don't play politics when people's lives are on the line. You'd think someone who has served in the military would be the first to understand that.
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Then name a single war in US history that ended because congress defunded it

It has never happened

So the idea that Sanders could have voted against funding for the troops already involved in two wars to end it is idiotic. His political opponents, including you, I'm sure, would have said he doesn't support the troops. He supported funding for the troops because he knew they were going to be there regardless of his vote, the same as any sane individual would have done. You don't play politics when people's lives are on the line. You'd think someone who has served in the military would be the first to understand that.
Every bit of this is fallacious. The fact is, as I said in my first reply to your bullshit in this thread, the notion that he opposed the war because of his voting record is a bullshit copout. Read the following very carefully, I will format it as a lesson in logic, since you're an idiot:

(premise 1)The commander in chief can order military action with or without the approval of congress.

(premise 2)War can not be waged without funds.

(conclusion)His voting record therefore does not support the notion that he is anti-war.


Even fucking Pelosi voted against funding that bullshit since it was just a field day for Dick Cheney's stocks.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
the notion that he opposed the war because of his voting record is a bullshit copout.
You are a fucking retard

Those that voted for it, supported it, like Clinton. Those that voted against it, opposed it, like Sanders

Had people like Clinton voted against it like Sanders did, we wouldn't have gone to war

Deny that fact all you want. Makes no difference to me or this debate
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
A series of declarative statements by a guy who has no chips in the stack to a combat vet who fought in that war and helped in the founding of one of the largest anti-war veteran's groups in the country...

There is no reaching you. You are just a dumb ass kid who blabs about bullshit. I think you would support that fucking shitstain no matter what he does.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
A series of declarative statements by a guy who has no chips in the stack to a combat vet who fought in that war and helped in the founding of one of the largest anti-war veteran's groups in the country...
Why don't you voice the same opposition towards people who voted for Clinton? You have an irrational hatred towards Sanders and his supporters even though he was one of the only ones to oppose it at the time. It doesn't add up.

You can keep touting the veterans badge all you want, it doesn't earn you respect points or give you any advanced knowledge about the politics of war. It means you know how to point a rifle.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
You can't add.

Anyone else reading this can understand very clearly what I am saying.

Clinton is irrelevant.
Why such unjustified hatred towards Sanders but not Clinton, or McCain, or anyone other than one of the most anti-war sitting senators?

It's not about war. It's about something else, so what is it?
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
When you have utterly failed to grasp what is being told to you, insist it's really about something else...
Your criticisms don't make sense in light of the rest of the senate, including Clinton and the members of RIU who voted for her. You say you hate Sanders citing his vote in support of action in Yugoslavia in 99 and support for funding the troops in Iraq. You blame him for Clinton's loss to Trump regardless of the evidence otherwise.

I think you don't criticize the members of RIU who supported Clinton in the same way you do with Sanders supporters because of personal reasons and relationships. It has nothing to do with war votes.

In other words, the policy doesn't actually matter to you, your feelings matter.
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Your criticisms don't make sense in light of the rest of the senate, including Clinton and the members of RIU who voted for her.
Yes they do.

You insist that having voted in favor of funding does not indicate a pro-war stance while having voted against entering the war does. You are wrong in both cases. War CAN be waged without congressional approval so his nay vote there is purely symbolic. War CANNOT be waged without funds so he voted in favor of continued war. I have stayed on point, argued clearly, stated my position and why I am passionate about it. I have also included other details to bolster my argument, such as how the appropriated funds were mostly used to enrich private companies that he has voted in favor of repeatedly.

Also the vote to continue funding was nowhere near unanimous. It was more like 2/3. Your weak argument against this consisted entirely of "___ has never happened before", "I think you are really talking about something else" and "I don't care if you're a vet". Meanwhile you have ignored the actual argument against this bullshit copout you keep toting that he is antiwar because of a symbolic vote.

The fact is, you're a dumb ass kid who will support this shitstain no matter what you are told by someone who knows far more than you.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Yes they do.

You insist that having voted in favor of funding does not indicate a pro-war stance while having voted against entering the war does. You are wrong in both cases. War CAN be waged without congressional approval so his nay vote there is purely symbolic. War CANNOT be waged without funds so he voted in favor of continued war. I have stayed on point, argued clearly, stated my position and why I am passionate about it. I have also included other details to bolster my argument, such as how the appropriated funds were mostly used to enrich private companies that he has voted in favor of repeatedly.

Also the vote to continue funding was nowhere near unanimous. It was more like 2/3. Your weak argument against this consisted entirely of "___ has never happened before", "I think you are really talking about something else" and "I don't care if you're a vet". Meanwhile you have ignored the actual argument against this bullshit copout you keep toting that he is antiwar because of a symbolic vote.

The fact is, you're a dumb ass kid who will support this shitstain no matter what you are told by someone who knows far more than you.
Clinton voted to fund the wars, as well as initiate them, yet you don't criticize Clinton supporters on RIU like you do Sanders supporters

It's obviously not about the war votes, it's about something else. If it was about the war votes, you would be arguing with Buck and SneekyNinja about casting their votes for a warmonger, yet you don't

So why continue to lie about it when it's this apparent to everyone?
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Yes they do.

You insist that having voted in favor of funding does not indicate a pro-war stance while having voted against entering the war does. You are wrong in both cases. War CAN be waged without congressional approval so his nay vote there is purely symbolic. War CANNOT be waged without funds so he voted in favor of continued war. I have stayed on point, argued clearly, stated my position and why I am passionate about it. I have also included other details to bolster my argument, such as how the appropriated funds were mostly used to enrich private companies that he has voted in favor of repeatedly.

Also the vote to continue funding was nowhere near unanimous. It was more like 2/3. Your weak argument against this consisted entirely of "___ has never happened before", "I think you are really talking about something else" and "I don't care if you're a vet". Meanwhile you have ignored the actual argument against this bullshit copout you keep toting that he is antiwar because of a symbolic vote.

The fact is, you're a dumb ass kid who will support this shitstain no matter what you are told by someone who knows far more than you.

I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters,
 
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