will usa default on there loans
- Thread starter DrFever
- Start date
jeff f
New Member
dont think its gonna happen but if it does, hold onto your horses.....it will get ugly in a hurry.
can you imagine the SS collectors doing battle with the freeloaders over who is going to get paid? then throw in the bond holders, mostly chinese, who are gonna come in a restructure our shit the way they want to...
mad maxx
can you imagine the SS collectors doing battle with the freeloaders over who is going to get paid? then throw in the bond holders, mostly chinese, who are gonna come in a restructure our shit the way they want to...
mad maxx
Charlie Ventura
Active Member
There's an old saying among sales people: "Don't sell the steak, sell the sizzle." The threat of default is the "sizzle." The encumbrance of our future generations with insurmountable debt is the "steak."
deprave
New Member
Glad you liberals love paying taxes so much cause we are about to get smacked with it like it or not. Enjoy your new wages at 9% lower if they don't get us with the 25% they are shootin for, actually they are shootin for the whole combo. If You make 30k a year...try 18k lifestyle.... from now on...you just got demoted..Goodbye to your precious middle class.
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
I agree with deprave, they can raise the debt ceiling and avert this all they like, but it's doing absolutely nothing but prolonging the inevitable and just making it that little worse.
mame
Well-Known Member
Uhm. This is the CPI in rate of change, notice how our most recent spike topped at 3.5%... And this is the measure most righties point to to "prove" we're facing crazy high levels of killer inflation! Oh noes!
And here's a more precise indicator(for use with monetary policy, anyway):
I wonder how many times I've got to explain to you kiddos that inflation is not a problem. In fact, as long as we remain in a liquidity trap all the money printing Bernanke is willing to do will neither set off high, uncontrollable inflation nor will it create a ton of jobs; It will, however, prevent deflation which is essential in preventing things from getting worse while we wait for the required fiscal stimulus and it will help lower the burden of private and public debt - the former being a major inhibitor to the "recovery".
edit: I dont think we'll default. Lawmakers are smarter than that - even the Republicans(except maybe the house freshmen). This whole thing is just political theater designed by the Republicans to extract concessions from Obama - who is percieved as a weak negotiator. Regardless, it seems like we'll have our credit rating downgraded so pretty soon we'll have some more tangible evidence that Republican obstructionism - not Democratic policies - are to blame for our nations continued economic weakness.
And here's a more precise indicator(for use with monetary policy, anyway):
I wonder how many times I've got to explain to you kiddos that inflation is not a problem. In fact, as long as we remain in a liquidity trap all the money printing Bernanke is willing to do will neither set off high, uncontrollable inflation nor will it create a ton of jobs; It will, however, prevent deflation which is essential in preventing things from getting worse while we wait for the required fiscal stimulus and it will help lower the burden of private and public debt - the former being a major inhibitor to the "recovery".
edit: I dont think we'll default. Lawmakers are smarter than that - even the Republicans(except maybe the house freshmen). This whole thing is just political theater designed by the Republicans to extract concessions from Obama - who is percieved as a weak negotiator. Regardless, it seems like we'll have our credit rating downgraded so pretty soon we'll have some more tangible evidence that Republican obstructionism - not Democratic policies - are to blame for our nations continued economic weakness.
jeff f
New Member
I agree with the political theater comments.
But the theater is from the dems. Their the ones using scare tactics.
The real drop dead date is sometime in late September not Aug 3rd like obama want granny to believe.
And you can show all the fancy, "no inflation here " charts you want.
Americans are paying more for food, fuel, and medical than they ever had to in history. And those are the only numbers that matter
But the theater is from the dems. Their the ones using scare tactics.
The real drop dead date is sometime in late September not Aug 3rd like obama want granny to believe.
And you can show all the fancy, "no inflation here " charts you want.
Americans are paying more for food, fuel, and medical than they ever had to in history. And those are the only numbers that matter
hazyintentions
Well-Known Member
I'm keeping this hehe
mame
Well-Known Member
So when prices go up that automatically means that monetary inflation is the culprit? Seriously? Medical costs have consistently outpaced inflation rates since fucking forever, and it's a problem with the system we use - it has very little to do with inflation. Fuel has already dropped down from it's recent high of $114 per barrel of crude, which is a $4 nationwide average per gallon; I remember quite vividly when gas hit $5... do you remember why? Supply and demand; The increase in the cost of fuel in the last decade has almost all been related to emerging markets, China being the largest source, demanding more fuel. This moves into the price of food, obviously, because fuel effects the cost of almost everything we buy. I've also highlighted plenty supply problems for core food/food ingredients like hard Wheat, which is seeing issues with one of it's larger suppliers - Germany - and corn problems in the U.S....
Again, just because prices go up - it does not automatically mean that monetary inflation is the culprit.
Prefontaine
Well-Known Member
no man we are already experiencing inflation right now, the only answer to our problems is default,
Prefontaine
Well-Known Member
you do understand that your 3.5% is actually a rise of 5.5% since the "recession" from which most of us are still Fucked?Uhm. This is the CPI in rate of change, notice how our most recent spike topped at 3.5%... And this is the measure most righties point to to "prove" we're facing crazy high levels of killer inflation! Oh noes!
And here's a more precise indicator(for use with monetary policy, anyway):
I wonder how many times I've got to explain to you kiddos that inflation is not a problem. In fact, as long as we remain in a liquidity trap all the money printing Bernanke is willing to do will neither set off high, uncontrollable inflation nor will it create a ton of jobs; It will, however, prevent deflation which is essential in preventing things from getting worse while we wait for the required fiscal stimulus and it will help lower the burden of private and public debt - the former being a major inhibitor to the "recovery".
edit: I dont think we'll default. Lawmakers are smarter than that - even the Republicans(except maybe the house freshmen). This whole thing is just political theater designed by the Republicans to extract concessions from Obama - who is percieved as a weak negotiator. Regardless, it seems like we'll have our credit rating downgraded so pretty soon we'll have some more tangible evidence that Republican obstructionism - not Democratic policies - are to blame for our nations continued economic weakness.
Prefontaine
Well-Known Member
you see by definition inflation is when 1 dollar no longer buys 1 dollar worth of stuff, it suddenly only buys .50 cents worth of stuff.
if you look at income and buying power in our history, you will see that yes we make more money then our grandparents did in the fifties, but we cant buy as much stuff,
if you look at income and buying power in our history, you will see that yes we make more money then our grandparents did in the fifties, but we cant buy as much stuff,
Prefontaine
Well-Known Member
hells yeah, i pray for default each and every morning.
tet1953
Well-Known Member
At this point it doesn't matter whether it was last May, late September or August 3rd. The world has perceived it to be and agreed that it is Aug 3rd.
jeff f
New Member
disagree. default comes when we fail to make our payments. the only way that happens before late september is if obama ORDERS our bills not to be paid.
i heard one of the senators on this weekend talking about it. cant remember who it was but he was a major player.
nobody should be routing for us to default. unless you have actually been through a bankruptcy, you dont understand what will hit you. basically your lender takes all your shit and sells it and tells you what you are allowed to keep.
if that happens, you WILL see people starving in the streets of america. not everyone obviously, but shit will hit the fan like very few currently on this planet has ever seen. everything that used to be in control, will suddenly be out of control.
tet1953
Well-Known Member
I have known for a long time about the sham they pull with Social Security. If they left it alone and all the money we pay for it was left in it, it would be solvent for everyone alive today, and probably their kids.
But that is not why I am posting. What I have just learned is that a whopping 2.67 trillion of our national debt is to Social Security. This raises some questions for me. First, if it remains officially on the books of Social Security and they have any real expectation of it being paid back, then there is absolutely no reason to call Social Security insolvent. But, we all know that will never happen. This raises my other question. If everyone knows it will never be paid back to Social Security then why not just write it off? Doesn't change Social Security because I'm sure all current analysis, tables and estimates do not factor a payback. In fact I'm sure that continued "borrowing" is factored into these things. So by writing it off we get rid of 2.67 trillion of national debt and it changes nothing else really. What am I missing?
But that is not why I am posting. What I have just learned is that a whopping 2.67 trillion of our national debt is to Social Security. This raises some questions for me. First, if it remains officially on the books of Social Security and they have any real expectation of it being paid back, then there is absolutely no reason to call Social Security insolvent. But, we all know that will never happen. This raises my other question. If everyone knows it will never be paid back to Social Security then why not just write it off? Doesn't change Social Security because I'm sure all current analysis, tables and estimates do not factor a payback. In fact I'm sure that continued "borrowing" is factored into these things. So by writing it off we get rid of 2.67 trillion of national debt and it changes nothing else really. What am I missing?