Using an Airstone vs Water Surface Tension for O2

So I've heard that breaking the surface tension of water (like with an underwater pump pointed upwards toward the surface) is just as good if not better than using an airstone for adding O2.

Can anyone verify this?

more bubbles = more O2

airstone is no comparison and cheaper to run than a pump

I hear what your saying but check this out

http://animals.howstuffworks.com/pets/choosing-aquarium-equipment5.htm

Supposedly the air in those air bubbles never gets dissolved into the water. Only the breaking of the surface tension due to the bubbles adds O2.

Anyone has anything that says otherwise?

nope just get a pump

Briester Behemoth said:

So I've heard that breaking the surface tension of water (like with an underwater pump pointed upwards toward the surface) is just as good if not better than using an airstone for adding O2.

Can anyone verify this?

Click to expand...

It's still a source of some debate, but the fish keeping community tends to agree with that.

I have a 110 gallon aquarium, and have no need for air pumps or stones, simply because I have an overflow siphon leading to a trickle filter. All the aeration I need. Thing is, I've got a 900 gph pump (probably pushing half that with the lift involved) running 24-7. That's some money each month.

I think wal-mart's highest volume air pump and a few stones are your best bet.

K just making sure cuz logically to me you guys are right, more bubbles = more O2...but not according to that article. I've got a spare underwater pump laying around but not an extra air pump or air stone. plus I hear air stones get junky pretty quickly.

In the case of DWC, you have to take into account the oxygen the roots receive when they make momentary contact with the bubbles.

Thing is, a good flow of bubbles to the surface not only breaks up the surface tension, but it also creates water circulation in your tank/reservoir. Those rising bubbles bring a constant movement of water with them, which then ends up at the surface taking advantage of that broken surface tension.

Briester Behemoth said:

So I've heard that breaking the surface tension of water (like with an underwater pump pointed upwards toward the surface) is just as good if not better than using an airstone for adding O2.

Can anyone verify this?

Click to expand...

The oxygen exchange happens at the water's surface so as long as that surface is turning over, you're fine. However, I've run side-by-side experiments in my reservoirs where one had an air stone and one didn't. There was no difference in the health, yield or overall quality of the plants. I also run flood and drain so during that process, the water is naturally oxygenated. Other systems may have different requirements.

Homebrewer,
Thanks for that info on your side by side trials. Having people like you is what makes this place so much better than others.

Briester Behemoth said:

So I've heard that breaking the surface tension of water (like with an underwater pump pointed upwards toward the surface) is just as good if not better than using an airstone for adding O2.

Can anyone verify this?

Click to expand...

same difference. it's not the bubbles that are doing anything. It's the surface turbulence caused by the bubbles.

Briester Behemoth said:

I hear what your saying but check this out

http://animals.howstuffworks.com/pets/choosing-aquarium-equipment5.htm

Supposedly the air in those air bubbles never gets dissolved into the water. Only the breaking of the surface tension due to the bubbles adds O2.

Anyone has anything that says otherwise?

Click to expand...

Nope, that is correct.

Wet

this is interesting. i don't do hydro anything but to test out my new tent last month i cut a single cut off 2 plants about 2 weeks into flower and attempted to root them in a cup of plain water. due to the placement of the 2 cuts and the fan system in the tent, one of the cups constantly vibrated and had constant ripples on the water surface and the other didn't. the vibrating one took and the other didn't. they were 2 totally different strains but i couldn't help but think that the vibrations had something to do with it. the cup shook quite a bit.

^^ thats interesting.

If I had a grand I'd buy a DO meter and run some tests for y'all. But I don't. So please send me $1000 in the name of science, ok thanks.

d.s.m. said:

Thing is, a good flow of bubbles to the surface not only breaks up the surface tension, but it also creates water circulation in your tank/reservoir. Those rising bubbles bring a constant movement of water with them, which then ends up at the surface taking advantage of that broken surface tension.

Click to expand...

Very true. 6x 4" airstones in my 13gal res creates a current as if an aquarium pump and filter system was in use.

i'll confirm homebrewers experience with both water pump only and air bubbles only. there's wasn't any real difference in yield/quality...

i do have to say there are con's to both methods. one of them as i believe homebrewer mentioned or somewhere in this thread... was that the bubble technique the airstones get clogged and need a thorough cleaning after each run or to be replaced with new stones. one thing not mentioned - but which i've read. was that some water pumps have a magnetic component which sometimes may attract some nutrients - rendering them less available. - although i have no way to confirm that.... because i don't really notice - or haven't been looking for those difference in deficiencies.

the main point of me posting is to detail the pro's and cons of using bubbles or a water pump with organics. or (as i've noticed at the bottom of homebrewers thread) 'beneficials'... from my experience. using air bubbles creates a brownish foam. again i do notice that some of the circular airstones i've used create a volcano effect that tends to have less finer bubbles (which create the foam/floating sludge). while using an waterpump alone tends to create a lot less of this foam.

so with that said. if you want to try organic hydroponic solutions (kinda oxymoronic lol - but they exist). or beneficial microbes like vermi-t/great white/pirhanna - u might want to stay away from the bubbles - it'll make your reservoir sludgy and foamy.

anyways. my preference is using just a high gallon per hour water pump...

I come at this from a HPA (high pressure aeroponics) perspective, where the goal is to generate a time-released atomized mist. While it offers great potential, it is very tweaky, and very difficult to start seeds in it.

My next experiment is to use a large gph air pump with 4 stones in a smallish Rubbermaid Roughneck type tote. My idea is to barely cover the stones so that there is ample space between them and the bottom of the net pots. Instead of having the surface close to the net pots ala conventional DWC. This will super saturate the air space between. I think this will approximate the HPA atomized mist, which is the method NASA uses on it's space station prototype. Once I get the pump I will start a journal here. Also using HO T5 with aquarium bulbs, which have much higher lumen output, plus are available in LED like spectrums.

I am about to

Legendary journal with no bubbles approaching 2gpw his system uses fast running water to increase surface exposure
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/149998-heaths-flooded-tube-vertical-5.html