The people behind the violence in the American protests of George Floyd.

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
"I think @schuylaar had a very good point, how does that security guard know that what the biker sprayed at him wasn't acid? "

Acid doesn't come in a pepper spray dispenser, isn't orange and doesn't smell like pepper. Pepper spray has become a very common defense tool in these protest, I can't think of any acid attacks, so this is really stretching it.

"Your standing up for Rittenhouse now though is a direct flip on what you said to DIY. "

Rittenhouse had a gun pulled and pointed at him, so if you condemn that but justify a guy getting a pepper sprayed you have lost all objectivity. One is justifiable the other is other not. So I'm not doing a flip. If somebody pepper sprayed Rittenhouse and he shot them, I would be condemning him. Like I said, I think Rittenhouse went there looking for trouble (don't think he was looking to kill people) but if he was protecting your business or house from getting burned down I'm sure you'd have a different perspective on things.
These circumstances are apples and oranges, there are many differences and lot's of video. I never heard Rittenhouse had a gun pulled on him, just that someone tried to disarm him, the fellow with the skateboard carried it habitually and was a hobbyist. Rittenhouse went looking for trouble whipped up by bullshit rightwing media and a fanatical mother who drove him armed to a protest and riot across state lines. Both of these people are morons, though the boy has the excuse of youth and brainwashing. A cop wannabe who flunked out of police cadets.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
"I think @schuylaar had a very good point, how does that security guard know that what the biker sprayed at him wasn't acid? "

Acid doesn't come in a pepper spray dispenser, isn't orange and doesn't smell like pepper. Pepper spray has become a very common defense tool in these protest, I can't think of any acid attacks, so this is really stretching it.

"Your standing up for Rittenhouse now though is a direct flip on what you said to DIY. "

Rittenhouse had a gun pulled and pointed at him, so if you condemn that but justify a guy getting a pepper sprayed you have lost all objectivity. One is justifiable the other is other not. So I'm not doing a flip. If somebody pepper sprayed Rittenhouse and he shot them, I would be condemning him. Like I said, I think Rittenhouse went there looking for trouble (don't think he was looking to kill people) but if he was protecting your business or house from getting burned down I'm sure you'd have a different perspective on things.
Let's get to perspectives
Do you support Trump? If you do why?
How do you feel about the commander and chief and the republicans in general?
What are your priorities?
What is America's biggest problem and why?
 

Werp

Well-Known Member
Do you support Trump? If you do why?

I am going to vote for Trump, I am not what you would consider a traditional Trump supporter. This is really a really broad question. Off the top of my head one of the main reason's I'm voting for him is immigration. I feel if we open our borders and let everyone in, we ourselves will turn into a 3rd world country (already starting to happen.) Also I don't want to be a minority. Name one country, Mexico, India, China, who would allow there immigration policy to turn the majority of the population into the minority?

The republicans in Democrats are the left and right wing of the same bird. There are differences but they have the same masters. Democrats just try to make it seem like they care more, they don't. The trillions of dollars spewed out during this pandemic to help big business could have been used during the housing crash in 08 but Obama did nothing. He let people get there house foreclosed on. How many countries did Obama bomb while in office? How many has Trump? The media tried to paint this picture of Trump being this unstable war mongering lunatic that was going to get us into all sort of wars. The way I see it is this. Trump is a builder and I think he see's it has counter productive to go to war and bomb places to oblivion. He wants to see buildings going up, not coming down. His rhetoric is just a bluff to make other countries bend to his will but when it comes down to it, he hates war. I'm personally not a big fan of him but he was saying the same things back in 40 years ago as he does today. Take a look at Biden he voted against gay marriage in 2006, wrote a crime bill that incarcerated many african americans but now speaks against the unjust laws and the list goes on. He is a known plagiarizer ( even his build back better slogan is stolen) and really doesn't have any integrity. He is a politician who knows how to sell himself as any easy going likable guy but he's in bed with corporate america and is a wolf in sheeps clothing.

Our biggest problem is our divide - united we stand divided we fall. We are falling.

As a side note, the biggest gripe I have about republicans is the their stand on the environment. That to me should be a top priority.

There's the off the top of my head not in any particular order rantings...............
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Do you support Trump? If you do why?

I am going to vote for Trump, I am not what you would consider a traditional Trump supporter. This is really a really broad question. Off the top of my head one of the main reason's I'm voting for him is immigration. I feel if we open our borders and let everyone in, we ourselves will turn into a 3rd world country (already starting to happen.) Also I don't want to be a minority. Name one country, Mexico, India, China, who would allow there immigration policy to turn the majority of the population into the minority?

The republicans in Democrats are the left and right wing of the same bird. There are differences but they have the same masters. Democrats just try to make it seem like they care more, they don't. The trillions of dollars spewed out during this pandemic to help big business could have been used during the housing crash in 08 but Obama did nothing. He let people get there house foreclosed on. How many countries did Obama bomb while in office? How many has Trump? The media tried to paint this picture of Trump being this unstable war mongering lunatic that was going to get us into all sort of wars. The way I see it is this. Trump is a builder and I think he see's it has counter productive to go to war and bomb places to oblivion. He wants to see buildings going up, not coming down. His rhetoric is just a bluff to make other countries bend to his will but when it comes down to it, he hates war. I'm personally not a big fan of him but he was saying the same things back in 40 years ago as he does today. Take a look at Biden he voted against gay marriage in 2006, wrote a crime bill that incarcerated many african americans but now speaks against the unjust laws and the list goes on. He is a known plagiarizer ( even his build back better slogan is stolen) and really doesn't have any integrity. He is a politician who knows how to sell himself as any easy going likable guy but he's in bed with corporate america and is a wolf in sheeps clothing.

Our biggest problem is our divide - united we stand divided we fall. We are falling.

As a side note, the biggest gripe I have about republicans is the their stand on the environment. That to me should be a top priority.

There's the off the top of my head not in any particular order rantings...............
So you feel that Trump handled the covid crises responsibly and correctly?
You feel he does not lie more than most politicians or people?
Do you believe in liberal democracy? Support the US constitution and rule of law, especially for public officials?

BTW: Liberal is not an economic ideology, it means freedom under the constitution and the rule of law, government for the people by the people, liberty. Liberalism always leads to the same place, responsible government and equal rights for all, people rise in society according to merit, not race. Some Americans signed onto liberal democracy, but opted for fascism when they realized it meant equal rights for all, including brown folks. I'm not just throwing terms around here look up the definition of fascism and you will find Trump and Trumpism fit it perfectly. This is not a game, this is your freedom at stake too.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Do you support Trump? If you do why?

I am going to vote for Trump, I am not what you would consider a traditional Trump supporter. This is really a really broad question. Off the top of my head one of the main reason's I'm voting for him is immigration. I feel if we open our borders and let everyone in, we ourselves will turn into a 3rd world country (already starting to happen.) Also I don't want to be a minority. Name one country, Mexico, India, China, who would allow there immigration policy to turn the majority of the population into the minority?

The republicans in Democrats are the left and right wing of the same bird. There are differences but they have the same masters. Democrats just try to make it seem like they care more, they don't. The trillions of dollars spewed out during this pandemic to help big business could have been used during the housing crash in 08 but Obama did nothing. He let people get there house foreclosed on. How many countries did Obama bomb while in office? How many has Trump? The media tried to paint this picture of Trump being this unstable war mongering lunatic that was going to get us into all sort of wars. The way I see it is this. Trump is a builder and I think he see's it has counter productive to go to war and bomb places to oblivion. He wants to see buildings going up, not coming down. His rhetoric is just a bluff to make other countries bend to his will but when it comes down to it, he hates war. I'm personally not a big fan of him but he was saying the same things back in 40 years ago as he does today. Take a look at Biden he voted against gay marriage in 2006, wrote a crime bill that incarcerated many african americans but now speaks against the unjust laws and the list goes on. He is a known plagiarizer ( even his build back better slogan is stolen) and really doesn't have any integrity. He is a politician who knows how to sell himself as any easy going likable guy but he's in bed with corporate america and is a wolf in sheeps clothing.

Our biggest problem is our divide - united we stand divided we fall. We are falling.

As a side note, the biggest gripe I have about republicans is the their stand on the environment. That to me should be a top priority.

There's the off the top of my head not in any particular order rantings...............
You might start watching Beau here, he has his head screwed on straight, is smart and a patriot. He always has something interesting to say and you can learn a lot, I do.

 

buttar

Member
Wow, the Admin larping in hanimmal's echo chamber
You're talking with a guy who is in the UK, so he knows all about it! :lol:
So, do you always chirp in when someone says something you do not agree with?

You assumed because I set up my account from London that I am not from the USA, more worrying is that you would then publish on the forum my geographical location in sympathy with Hanimmal's position, I'd consider this as inappropriate behaviour for the website forum admin, I'm also sure many members would agree, will they be next If they say something you don't like or agree with?

For your information, I am posted in the UK for the next 2 years.

Let's see if this get's deleted,
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
"I think @schuylaar had a very good point, how does that security guard know that what the biker sprayed at him wasn't acid? "

Acid doesn't come in a pepper spray dispenser, isn't orange and doesn't smell like pepper. Pepper spray has become a very common defense tool in these protest, I can't think of any acid attacks, so this is really stretching it.

"Your standing up for Rittenhouse now though is a direct flip on what you said to DIY. "

Rittenhouse had a gun pulled and pointed at him, so if you condemn that but justify a guy getting a pepper sprayed you have lost all objectivity. One is justifiable the other is other not. So I'm not doing a flip. If somebody pepper sprayed Rittenhouse and he shot them, I would be condemning him. Like I said, I think Rittenhouse went there looking for trouble (don't think he was looking to kill people) but if he was protecting your business or house from getting burned down I'm sure you'd have a different perspective on things.
The shooter is held on charges for murder 1. The prosecutor and judge seem to think murder 1 can be proven to a jury. You are basically saying that a person may kill somebody if they get scared. So, basically anybody can murder anybody. You are consistent in this. You think Rittenhouse is a hero. I think otherwise. In some states, your lax standard for justification of murder is the law. We'll see what happens in CO.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I am going to vote for Trump, I am not what you would consider a traditional Trump supporter. This is really a really broad question. Off the top of my head one of the main reason's I'm voting for him is immigration. I feel if we open our borders and let everyone in, we ourselves will turn into a 3rd world country (already starting to happen.) Also I don't want to be a minority. Name one country, Mexico, India, China, who would allow there immigration policy to turn the majority of the population into the minority?

The republicans in Democrats are the left and right wing of the same bird. There are differences but they have the same masters. Democrats just try to make it seem like they care more, they don't.
You do realize that white people are not going to be 'the minority' right? They may not be more white people than all the other 'non-white' people combined, but that doesn't mean that they are the minority.

The trillions of dollars spewed out during this pandemic to help big business could have been used during the housing crash in 08 but Obama did nothing. He let people get there house foreclosed on.
Obama was not president until 2009.

It was during Bush presidency in 2008 that the economy melted. Much like if Biden takes over for Trump, Obama inherited a crashed economy that the Democrats had to put back together while the Republicans will sit back and blame the Democrats for spending too much. This is why the Republicans right now will not pass legislation to actually help fix the economy, they know that they are going to likely lose in November and want to troll the Democrats so they can hopefully get back a branch in DC in 2022.

How many countries did Obama bomb while in office? How many has Trump?
Screen Shot 2020-10-12 at 8.21.46 AM.png

Is there a reason to just look at the number of countries vs the number of bombs?

The media tried to paint this picture of Trump being this unstable war mongering lunatic that was going to get us into all sort of wars.
I look at this problem more about Trump's circumventing congress to give Saudi Arabia nuclear technology while also allowing them to conduct genocide in Yemen. Abandoning/threatening all of our world allies (not just the Kurds) to give Putin free reign over Syria. Pardoning the dude that tortured and murdered the captured enemy soldier.

Trump has weakened us in the world and left our allies vulnerable to Russia.

The way I see it is this. Trump is a builder and I think he see's it has counter productive to go to war and bomb places to oblivion. He wants to see buildings going up, not coming down. His rhetoric is just a bluff to make other countries bend to his will but when it comes down to it, he hates war.
Yet he has allowed the Russian military to attack our citizens unchecked, and said nothing about the bounties on our soldiers heads.

He even agreed with Putin over our own American intel agencies.

I'm personally not a big fan of him but he was saying the same things back in 40 years ago as he does today.
It is easy when you just say everything at anytime and the next say the opposite. Trump is a bullshit artist that is unashamed to lie.

It lets people believe what they want about him if they are willing to suspend any accountability for Trump for the lies he tells.

Take a look at Biden he voted against gay marriage in 2006, wrote a crime bill that incarcerated many african americans but now speaks against the unjust laws and the list goes on.
Incorrect, by 2006 he had evolved with the rest of the nation. It was in 1996 that he voted no to a constitutional amendment on gay marriage, but also voted to end discrimination to him.

In 2006 he voted 'No' on a constitutional ban o same sex marriage.

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1849140_1849287_1849691,00.html
Screen Shot 2020-10-12 at 8.11.01 AM.png


He is a known plagiarizer ( even his build back better slogan is stolen) and really doesn't have any integrity.
This is such a stretch it is basically a lie, and has already been thoroughly debunked when trolls tried to use it against Biden in the primaries.

He is a politician who knows how to sell himself as any easy going likable guy but he's in bed with corporate america and is a wolf in sheeps clothing.
How do you know this? I call bullshit on you having some special knowledge about a candidate that spend almost 50 years in DC and never cashed in on his political office.

Our biggest problem is our divide - united we stand divided we fall. We are falling.
This I agree with. It sucks that Trump has used social division as his political campaign and allows foreign nations to continue their attack on us doing exactly this.

As a side note, the biggest gripe I have about republicans is the their stand on the environment. That to me should be a top priority.
I agree with this too. Trump has been by far the most destructive force peeling back as much progress we have made over the decades as possible for stupid reasons such as him not liking how he looks under energy efficient light bulbs.

Remember this troll by Trump?Screen Shot 2020-10-12 at 8.21.05 AM.png

There's the off the top of my head not in any particular order rantings...............
This is the problem I think, the 'top of the head' about stuff you 'heard' and believed. Our nation is under attack with the very propaganda that you listed above.

I would highly recommend looking up things you think you know on the highest factual, non-biased, free, credible source like AP news or Reuters to see where it is that you have fallen for the lies that Trump needs you to believe about him and his opponents.

Because you listed a lot of them.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
You do realize that white people are not going to be 'the minority' right? They may not be more white people than all the other 'non-white' people combined, but that doesn't mean that they are the minority.


Obama was not president until 2009.

It was during Bush (2008) that the economy melted. Much like if Biden takes over for Trump, Obama inherited a crashed economy that the Democrats had to put back together while the Republicans will sit back and blame the Democrats for spending too much. This is why the Republicans right now will not pass legislation to actually help fix the economy, they know that they are going to likely lose in November and want to troll the Democrats so they can hopefully get back a branch in DC in 2022.


View attachment 4711717

Is there a reason to just look at the number of countries vs the number of bombs?


I look at this problem more about Trump's circumventing congress to give Saudi Arabia nuclear technology while also allowing them to conduct genocide in Yemen. Abandoning/threatening all of our world allies (not just the Kurds) to give Putin free reign over Syria. Pardoning the dude that tortured and murdered the captured enemy soldier.

Trump has weakened us in the world and left our allies vulnerable to Russia.


Yet he has allowed the Russian military to attack our citizens unchecked, and said nothing about the bounties on our soldiers heads.

He even agreed with Putin over our own American intel agencies.


It is easy when you just say everything at anytime and the next say the opposite. Trump is a bullshit artist that is unashamed to lie.

It lets people believe what they want about him if they are willing to suspend any accountability for Trump for the lies he tells.


Incorrect, by 2006 he had evolved with the rest of the nation. It was in 1996 that he voted no to a constitutional amendment on gay marriage, but also voted to end discrimination to him.

In 2006 he voted 'No' on a constitutional ban o same sex marriage.

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1849140_1849287_1849691,00.html
View attachment 4711705



This is such a stretch it is basically a lie, and has already been thoroughly debunked when trolls tried to use it against Biden in the primaries.


How do you know this? I call bullshit on you having some special knowledge about a candidate that spend almost 50 years in DC and never cashed in on his political office.


This I agree with. It sucks that Trump has used social division as his political campaign and allows foreign nations to continue their attack on us doing exactly this.


I agree with this too. Trump has been by far the most destructive force peeling back as much progress we have made over the decades as possible for stupid reasons such as him not liking how he looks under energy efficient light bulbs.

Remember this troll by Trump?View attachment 4711716


This is the problem I think, the 'top of the head' about stuff you 'heard' and believed. Our nation is under attack with the very propaganda that you listed above.

I would highly recommend looking up things you think you know on the highest factual, non-biased, free, credible source like AP news or Reuters to see where it is that you have fallen for the lies that Trump needs you to believe about him and his opponents.

Because you listed a lot of them.
I draw them out, foggy shoots them and you bury them! :D
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I draw them out, foggy shoots them and you bury them! :D
It is not about taking anyone down, it is about getting people the factual information they need to make better decisions and help them to understand the attack that is being conducted on our democracies around the world.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
It is not about taking anyone down, it is about getting people the factual information they need to make better decisions and help them to understand the attack that is being conducted on our democracies around the world.
I know that, I'm doing the same thing in my own way, provided there's some hope and many Trumpers are losing faith. I try to remind them about democracy, the constitution and what freedom means under it. I often ask what they see in Trump and what their biggest issues are, the more sincere will try to answer. Foggy will shoot their arguments through the heart and You will bury them in facts.

Some of them are actual enemies of the constitution, most are misguided victims of disinformation and decades old false narratives promulgated by the republicans. Almost all are racist at some level, Dylan Roof's reframe of "they're taking over", echoes among them, tribalism. It is the disinformation and alternate reality infrastructure that unifies, gives structure and direction.

This is not just a problem for America, but every liberal democracy and unfortunately America is the source of much of the problem, specifically the social media and other internet companies. The lack of professional journalistic standards and practices along with the proliferation of state sponsored disinformation and propaganda is becoming dangerous. This is especially so for liberal democracies who are multicultural and multiracial, we have lot's of potential divisions to exploit.

The quality of our decisions is dependent on the quality of information we have to work with, bullshit in, bullshit out.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Do you support Trump? If you do why?

I am going to vote for Trump, I am not what you would consider a traditional Trump supporter. This is really a really broad question. Off the top of my head one of the main reason's I'm voting for him is immigration. I feel if we open our borders and let everyone in, we ourselves will turn into a 3rd world country (already starting to happen.) Also I don't want to be a minority. Name one country, Mexico, India, China, who would allow there immigration policy to turn the majority of the population into the minority?

The republicans in Democrats are the left and right wing of the same bird. There are differences but they have the same masters. Democrats just try to make it seem like they care more, they don't. The trillions of dollars spewed out during this pandemic to help big business could have been used during the housing crash in 08 but Obama did nothing. He let people get there house foreclosed on. How many countries did Obama bomb while in office? How many has Trump? The media tried to paint this picture of Trump being this unstable war mongering lunatic that was going to get us into all sort of wars. The way I see it is this. Trump is a builder and I think he see's it has counter productive to go to war and bomb places to oblivion. He wants to see buildings going up, not coming down. His rhetoric is just a bluff to make other countries bend to his will but when it comes down to it, he hates war. I'm personally not a big fan of him but he was saying the same things back in 40 years ago as he does today. Take a look at Biden he voted against gay marriage in 2006, wrote a crime bill that incarcerated many african americans but now speaks against the unjust laws and the list goes on. He is a known plagiarizer ( even his build back better slogan is stolen) and really doesn't have any integrity. He is a politician who knows how to sell himself as any easy going likable guy but he's in bed with corporate america and is a wolf in sheeps clothing.

Our biggest problem is our divide - united we stand divided we fall. We are falling.

As a side note, the biggest gripe I have about republicans is the their stand on the environment. That to me should be a top priority.

There's the off the top of my head not in any particular order rantings...............
naive
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
https://apnews.com/article/shootings-archive-denver-b591ae83766522c5434f1b13c5e14d66
Screen Shot 2020-10-13 at 9.50.03 AM.png
DENVER (AP) — An armed security guard for a television station who is suspected of fatally shooting a man following an altercation after opposing protests was acting in self-defense when he opened fire, a lawyer representing his family said Monday.

Matthew Dolloff, 30, was being held in jail for investigation of first-degree murder following Saturday afternoon’s shooting near Civic Center Park as protesters filed out of the park following the demonstrations — a “Patriot Muster” and a “BLM-Antifa Soup Drive” counterprotest.

Doug Richards, who said he is representing Dolloff’s family, said the man who was shot reached into his shirt which made Dolloff fear for his safety, leading him to shoot. He said images of the scene from The Denver Post, which first reported his comments, show that Dolloff put his body between the man and the reporter from KUSA-TV he was working to protect.

“He was doing what he was supposed to be doing there,” Richards said.

Police have said two guns and a Mace can were found at the crime scene but declined on Monday to release any more details about what happened, including who the guns belonged to, because they do not want to harm the ongoing investigation, department spokesperson Jay Casillas said. The document laying out the reasons for Dolloff’s arrest remains sealed.

Authorities have not identified the man who was killed, but his son told The Denver Post it was his father, Lee Keltner, a 49-year-old U.S. Navy veteran who operated a hat-making business in the Denver area.

MORE STORIES:
Denver officials say Dolloff did not have a license to work as a security guard in the city and were investigating how he was allowed to work anyway.

Under rules adopted by Denver in 2018, both security companies and the guards they employ must have city licenses. Guards must undergo 16 hours of training and an FBI background check to get a license and complete eight hours more training to renew their license each year, said Eric Escudero, a spokesman for the city’s Excise and Licenses Department. Guards that carry firearms must also be screened by police, he said.

Companies that employ guards without licenses can have their licenses suspended or revoked and face fines. Individual guards who do not have licenses can be punished with a $999 fine and up to one year in jail.

Dolloff did have a permit to carry a concealed weapon in Colorado issued by his local sheriff’s office but it was suspended Monday because of the allegations against him. Elbert County Sheriff Tim Norton said he will decide whether Dolloff will get the five-year permit back based on what happens in the criminal case.

According to state business records, Dolloff was listed as the registered agent for a farm that raises animals including turkeys, sheep and goats in Elizabeth, a town outside the Denver metro area. No one answered the phone at the farm on Monday and a message left for another person listed in business filings was not returned.

KUSA-TV said Sunday that it has been hiring private security to accompany its staff at protests for a number of months. It said Dolloff had been hired through the Pinkerton security company. However, in a statement, Pinkerton said Dolloff was a contract agent, not a Pinkerton employee. The company did not reveal the name of the contract company Dolloff worked for.

“Pinkerton is fully cooperating with law enforcement authorities in their investigation of this matter,” it said.

Network news crews have taken security for years, especially overseas, said Dan Shelley, executive director of the Radio-Television-Digital News Association. In recent years, it’s become more common for television news crews amid increasingly corrosive political and ideological rhetoric, he said.

“It’s very unfortunate because journalists, while they’re not around to make friends, they are around to serve their communities by seeking and reporting the truth,” he said.

In some markets, like the San Francisco Bay Area, it’s become fairly routine, said Al Tompkins with the Poynter Institute for Media Studies. A private security guard there was shot and wounded when a crew on assignment was robbed of their camera outside a library in February 2019.

Typically, security guards are unobtrusive and step in simply to defuse situations, he said.

“The fact of the matter is, the intensity of doing the job of journalism keeps you from being as aware as you need to be in order to stay safe,” Tompkins said. “They’re going in there with one main goal, and that is to avoid problems.”

The brandnames people attach to themselves is ridiculous.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Screen Shot 2020-10-13 at 12.59.03 PM.png

Screen Shot 2020-10-13 at 12.45.01 PM.png

Cops rounded up a bunch of white people pretending they care about indigenous people oppression as cover for their rioting from the way these videos look. Will be interesting to read the future intelligence reports on these riots and how the domestic terrorists had been brainwashed into thinking violence was the answer.


I think that the guy talking falls into the propaganda trap by announcing what some Facebook page said the protests were about, but the best raw video/sound I saw of the arrests.
 
Last edited:

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
https://apnews.com/article/shootings-archive-denver-b591ae83766522c5434f1b13c5e14d66
View attachment 4712730
DENVER (AP) — An armed security guard for a television station who is suspected of fatally shooting a man following an altercation after opposing protests was acting in self-defense when he opened fire, a lawyer representing his family said Monday.

Matthew Dolloff, 30, was being held in jail for investigation of first-degree murder following Saturday afternoon’s shooting near Civic Center Park as protesters filed out of the park following the demonstrations — a “Patriot Muster” and a “BLM-Antifa Soup Drive” counterprotest.

Doug Richards, who said he is representing Dolloff’s family, said the man who was shot reached into his shirt which made Dolloff fear for his safety, leading him to shoot. He said images of the scene from The Denver Post, which first reported his comments, show that Dolloff put his body between the man and the reporter from KUSA-TV he was working to protect.

“He was doing what he was supposed to be doing there,” Richards said.

Police have said two guns and a Mace can were found at the crime scene but declined on Monday to release any more details about what happened, including who the guns belonged to, because they do not want to harm the ongoing investigation, department spokesperson Jay Casillas said. The document laying out the reasons for Dolloff’s arrest remains sealed.

Authorities have not identified the man who was killed, but his son told The Denver Post it was his father, Lee Keltner, a 49-year-old U.S. Navy veteran who operated a hat-making business in the Denver area.

MORE STORIES:
Denver officials say Dolloff did not have a license to work as a security guard in the city and were investigating how he was allowed to work anyway.

Under rules adopted by Denver in 2018, both security companies and the guards they employ must have city licenses. Guards must undergo 16 hours of training and an FBI background check to get a license and complete eight hours more training to renew their license each year, said Eric Escudero, a spokesman for the city’s Excise and Licenses Department. Guards that carry firearms must also be screened by police, he said.

Companies that employ guards without licenses can have their licenses suspended or revoked and face fines. Individual guards who do not have licenses can be punished with a $999 fine and up to one year in jail.

Dolloff did have a permit to carry a concealed weapon in Colorado issued by his local sheriff’s office but it was suspended Monday because of the allegations against him. Elbert County Sheriff Tim Norton said he will decide whether Dolloff will get the five-year permit back based on what happens in the criminal case.

According to state business records, Dolloff was listed as the registered agent for a farm that raises animals including turkeys, sheep and goats in Elizabeth, a town outside the Denver metro area. No one answered the phone at the farm on Monday and a message left for another person listed in business filings was not returned.

KUSA-TV said Sunday that it has been hiring private security to accompany its staff at protests for a number of months. It said Dolloff had been hired through the Pinkerton security company. However, in a statement, Pinkerton said Dolloff was a contract agent, not a Pinkerton employee. The company did not reveal the name of the contract company Dolloff worked for.

“Pinkerton is fully cooperating with law enforcement authorities in their investigation of this matter,” it said.

Network news crews have taken security for years, especially overseas, said Dan Shelley, executive director of the Radio-Television-Digital News Association. In recent years, it’s become more common for television news crews amid increasingly corrosive political and ideological rhetoric, he said.

“It’s very unfortunate because journalists, while they’re not around to make friends, they are around to serve their communities by seeking and reporting the truth,” he said.

In some markets, like the San Francisco Bay Area, it’s become fairly routine, said Al Tompkins with the Poynter Institute for Media Studies. A private security guard there was shot and wounded when a crew on assignment was robbed of their camera outside a library in February 2019.

Typically, security guards are unobtrusive and step in simply to defuse situations, he said.

“The fact of the matter is, the intensity of doing the job of journalism keeps you from being as aware as you need to be in order to stay safe,” Tompkins said. “They’re going in there with one main goal, and that is to avoid problems.”

The brandnames people attach to themselves is ridiculous.
I get that I'm not in step with the court's definition of self defense. I get that Dolloff and Rittenfuckhead are probably going to get off the hook by using the argument that they got scared and so it's OK that they blew people away. It's not the kind of country I want but unlike gun nuts, I'm not going to get all violent about it, I'm just going to work with others to get the laws around gun violence changed. I don't agree with our gun laws. I think if you carry a gun you must be held to a higher standard than those who don't when you kill somebody with that gun. I think both Doloff and Rittenfuckhead are guilty of murder because the were careless in their decisions leading up to the situation. Kyle is guilty because he sought out the situation where he eventually got scared. Doloff because he didn't bother to get the proper training. There are other people around the situation who made bad decisions too.

Everybody involved in both of those murders are culpable to one degree or another.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Food for thought

A more relevant piece of media going back to the title of this thread

You really think he is not just as radicalized by the rhetoric based on what he is saying is the reality of these protests?

The fact that he states that 'Defund the Police' is what the propaganda Trump's trolls push says it is tells me what I need to know about this guy's opinion.

This guy is just spouting left-troll propaganda.

His talking about credit scores too in a lame attempt to dismiss the red lining laws and racist lending practices keeping black people out of better neighborhoods is more nonsense.

More right wing propaganda.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I thought he was a minor, not sure about law with that, he'll probably walk, they were beating on him with skateboards, high kicks and a gun, he still took two lives though and will live with that his entire life,, he should have stayed away and let Antifa & BLM melt that parking lot, where were his parents, who let's their kid go out as a defender at that age ffs.
How do you know "Antifa & BLM" were in that parking lot?
 
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