Temperatures, Humidity

Roseman said:

Someone needs to buy a newspaper and buy a book and read it!

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Yeah you. I read a lot, try reading a few a biolgy text books or a few professional reference books. At least a book or some research results written by a person with a degree in Horticultural Science. Or do you have some of those on the job training certificates too?

As far as Obama. Nick Shapiro, the white house spokesman made a stupid statement, "The president believes that federal resources should not be used to circumvent state laws," He stated it in reference to state abortion laws, and that he believes the president supports that federal resources should not be used to circumvent state laws in regard to abortion rights. Since that time many people have taken that as meaning it applies across the board to all differences between state laws and federal laws.

Neither Nick Shapiro, Obama or the white house has said the statement made by Shapiro references laws about medical marijuana, gay marriage, gun regulation or anything else. The White house has not confirmed anything stated by Shipiro and has instead reinforced Obamha's continued opinions/beliefs in full support of Roe versus Wade and the right to choice movement. This clearly means he supports ROe verus Wade so he supports Federal Supremacy ans the belief that the ferderal resources should be used aginst the staes to insure Roe vers Wade in carried out as law. This throws out Nick Shapiros statement and all speculation as to other differences between stae and federal laws. But everyone ale ready jumped on the band wagon and tried to say Obama's opinion as sated by Shapiro also applies to all other differences betwwen state law desires and federal laws. The only thing Obama or the whitehouse admits to is his abortion beliefs and they arecontrary to those sated by shapiro.

People have they have even give the new movement of false hope a name called Obama's "new federalism." And all that came out of Obama stating repeatedly during campaigning that he firmly supported Roe versus Wade and that he fully supported the right to choice movement. Thw white house and Obama have not backed up Shipiro's statement in any fashion and have even ignored direct questions in regard to how Shapiro's statement apples to state marijuana laws and state gun control.

As such, neither Obama nor the White House will back up the words of Shipiro and instead merely say that Obama stands behind campaign statements that he firmly supports Roe versus Wade the right to choice movement.

I read a lot.

JonnyBtreed said:

I think Rose was referring to last monday? Obama told federal prosecutors to stop arresting legal mmj patients. Not a huge obama fan, but at least it's something.

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But it did not happen.

Here is a link to the only thing Obama has ever said about medical marijauna. What few "feelings or opinions" he expressed are only limited and apply only to the leag use of mediacl marijuana. However there is no leagal use. He makes that clear also. And hos only words were recorded during his campaigning. He has made no statements since then, nor made any changes or asked for any changes, much alone directed any changes.

It is a total cop out interview where he basically says "if" new laws are written and " that he will not use any political clout to try to get the present laws changed. He stated that federal justice money won't be wasted on trying to curcumvent ssate laws. That is a huge cop out as law is law. He is merely an executive. He is powerless in respect to the laws. Congress writes the laws and police and the justice department enforce the laws. He as president has no power or authority to direct the justice department or any police agency not to enforce the law. He can express his opinions and desires is all. He has not done any such thing since being elected. He plainly states he does not support the home growing of pot or mom and pop shops selling pot etc. He states he would support laws written that treats pot like other controlled doctor prescribed drugs if the Federal laws were changed. He states new fedearl laws would have to be written first. He clearly states he will not waste his political clout on the marijuana issue and that it is a low priority to him.

He has not and can not direct the DEA or any other law enforcement agency not to enforce the law. Period. Besides, that interview was given over a year and a half ago. No new bills before congress to change federals laws in regard to marijana. Feds are still enforcing the laws as they wish. DEA agents are still working drug raids etc. Many states with medical marijauna laws still have drug teams that are joint force teams with DEA abnd FBI agents state and local police (city and county) combined that are still performing raids. Like he said. Low priority on his list. Actually not on his list at all would be more the truth according to what he actually said.

Roseman said:

During Flowering, we need a low humidity, especially to avoid Bud mold and bud rot.

Cheap De-Humidifier for closets and tents
$40 at amazon.com

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Hey great thread gives out allot of good info.

Was thinking of buying this one but noticed from the pic it does not look like you can set the humidity, so its just a turn on turn off manual ?? not sure if you know just wanted to see if you did or anyone else had one before i spent 100 plus on the digital gage one. Like you said controling the room is what we are trying to do and i dont have that much time to check my room every couple hours to see if i need to turn that one on/off or not ya know. Thanks for all the help. Keep Growing !!!

JonnyBtreed said:

Fatman, I just don't understand what you have against specific marijuana growing books. Why are these inferior to broad spectrum biology books? If your a horticulturalist you would know that every plants needs and properties are different, they react to different environments different ways. keep reading Biology Books.....

I prefer to specialize in one subject I'm researching as oppose to lumping all "plants" in together as one... Ever hear that phrase...

Jack of all trades, master of none....

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Beacuse there is no sound basis or proven scintific testing behind most of what is written in the majority of the marijuan books. They reare not specialized they are merely regurgitation of opinions passed around on the forums usually. there are no tests or reserchs done. There is no scientific methods involved. They are usually just old material dressed up with a few new fads that seldom pan out. Marijuna propagation has been already been extensively tested out by university researchers. There is scads of material available at universities. If you know how to look through Schloar sites you can obtain all kinds of refernce papers, texy ts, and pdf dats that you can get your local libraian to order shippied to your library or they will obtain electronic copies. Most of he material that applies to other plants also applies to pot. there have been and still are university tests done on growing pot andin genearl is better dat than you will find in pot growing books. Just the amount of information taught to biology and botany student in reference to the U.S . use of paraquat brought on mexican marijuana brought huge amounts of ,fully documented analylitacl testing on growing pot and on pot THC contents, information to the horticulturalists, and biologists. However the hacks writing marijuana books do not read that infornmation before declaring then selves experts and writing abook.

One of the problems with the U.S. politics means that there has to be some known reason for reserach to be done on pot before the universities can get grants or teach existing and new information freely. That is all good quality infornation. It is c scientific information obtained under rigid repeatebale testing paramters. pot growing books are merely what ever the person thinj ks or read on the forums etc put in a book with some good colored photos. Most of the old testing on marijuana stemmed out of the militaries desire to use it as a form of chemical warfare. Prior to that it was to discover better growe wing and breeding methods so as to use the fibers in the pot plants (hemp rope). So we would no longer be dependant on maniila for fibers for rope. All the information is still there on the shelves and in the computers. And it is all not n merely based upon opinions and repeated rumors and claims.

Roseman said:

with B.S. information like that, I see why you have to put the Caveat in your signature.

I own 14 books that say strive for no less than 45% up to 55% during VEG, (higher is better)in a hydroponic or soil grow. It helps transpiration.

why is Misting recommended in VEG? Why do they make Foilage spray and sell spray bottles and humdifiers in the Hydro shops?
Of course a much lower Humidty is desired in Flowering, to avoid Bud mold.

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wow were back to soil grows and poorly set up hydro grows again. This is a aeroponics thread. Can you spell aeroponics. The 45% to 55% is old data based upon overly ventilated grow areas as you say chiefly "soil" and a few sad poorly "hyroponic"systems grows.. In case you have not noticed CO2 and climate control is becoming very common. As is aeroponics. Remember this is chiefly a earo thread section. Your data and you certfied (OJT green house helper) friends data and opinions are old outdated methodology only applicable to old outdated growing methods. You are behind the curve. Your humidity info is fine for low tech sytems where over ventilation and circulation is used for temperature controll and CO2 renewal but it is just a bandaid and no more.

They sell anything in hydrostores they can get people to buy. Folair spraying is a method of applying fertilizers, and pesticides. Misting is also old dated practice used with old outdated growing methods. If the palnt is traspiring heavily as is best then there is no need to mist. Misting is a poor replacement for adequate transpiration and a bandaid only need with over ventilation and over circulation of grow room air. Even clones can do without a humidifier misting by usig aero cloners etc. Like ahead of the curve or riding the wave, not flailing in the shallows as are you wiy th your old advise and methodologies.

Once again you are behind the curve. Mold, mildew and fungi can happen at anytime not just during budding. Pot is just more prone to those things during budding. They are also prone diring any period of time of high humidity such 50% to 60%. Oh thats right your a low tech air blaster.

As far as an experienced horticulturalis, no I have no masters degree or Doctorates in horticultural science. I ahve three degrees. I have dozens of certifications as they are a dime a dozen. I have no need of a horticultural certificate absed upon no degree.

I can safely say I easily own over 2000 text books, reference books and manuals. I own file drawers full of copies of professional research papers and subscribe to over a dozen magazines realting to different science disciplines. And those are just what are in my home, not my office or the lab I am responsible for at a university. Nope I own no dime store grade pot growing books or magazines.

You ought to start and own your own thread about Temps and Humidity too.
You could post your opinions and get the arguements and debate that you desire there.

Roseman said:

You ought to start and own your own thread about Temps and Humidity too.
You could post your opinions and get the arguements and debate that you desire there.

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Ha, ha your funny.

Actually there should be no argument as most of what you say is wrong to higher tech grows so you should take your arguments and opinions to another area where it might be appropriatte. Say soil grows or maybe you should open a low tech or old tech thread for you old methodologies.

Wow, a tech snob on a personal grow journal! Interesting. Turns out they are weeds and will grow no matter what you do or don't do most of the time.

MostlyCrazy said:

Wow, a tech snob on a personal grow journal! Interesting. Turns out they are weeds and will grow no matter what you do or don't do most of the time.

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Define weeds. Weeds are plants that are considered undesirable, unattractive, or troublesome, especially one growing where it is not wanted. Pot hardly fits that desription. Marijana has been purposely grown for at lest hundreds of years. Anandoned fields once grown as an agricultural prodi uct that still grows unattended is merely an una ttended plant not a weed. Most strains grwn by growesr can hardly be comparable to abandoned hemp plants unless grown very poorly. Even then they are ignored or poorly growing plants not undesirable, unattractive, or troublesome plants growing where unwanted and there fore they are still not weeds. Sure but they do grow much better when provided with the better conditions rather than what low/old tech growers tend to recommend.

It is pretty hard to be a scientist and teacher of sciences that has grown indoors for over 35 years and not be a tech preferential person. Besides this is a higher tech forum section thread not a low/old tech forum thread. Go figure.

Well duh!

Where does it say this is a higher tech forum? It's in the hydroponics/aeroponics section! As I said a tech knob. How about we try to help someone who is trying to grow it in their closet for medical use or curiousity with limited resources?

MostlyCrazy said:

Well duh!

Where does it say this is a higher tech forum? It's in the hydroponics/aeroponics section! As I said a tech knob. How about we try to help someone who is trying to grow it in their closet for medical use or curiousity with limited resources?

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Hydro, and aero are high tech. What part of that statement can you possibly not understand. Misters, timers, solenoids, timers, pumps, air condioners, CO2 enrichment/ppm controllers, auto water top off systems, pH controllers, conductivity controllers, chemical nutrients, dehumidifiers are all aeroponic/hydroponic topics, and that indicates high tech. That does not seem like it could be much more obvious.

How many regular posters from this section go to the outdoor section and keep writing about aerogrows and conductivity anlyzers/controllers and pH analyzers/controllers or aeroponic/hydroponic nutrients and saying the out door soil growers need them. That equipment is typically written about here as they apply.

Humidifiers in an aeroponic or hydroponic grow room are not common, and usually not advisable with most such systems, so the suggestions for them typically does not apply here. If you think differently I suggest you just set up a pool thread and poll to see how many aeroponic and hydroponic growers use humifiers vesrus how many use air conditioners and dehumidifiers in their aeroponic grow rooms. Ie low humidity is usually not a problem with aeroponichydroponic systems but excess humidity is. One should desire to incease transpiration not decraese it with by supply excessive unbeneficial high humidity.

fatman7574 said:

Hydro, and aero are high tech. What part of that statement can you possibly not understand. Misters, timers, solenoids, timers, pumps, air condioners, CO2 enrichment/ppm controllers, auto water top off systems, pH controllers, conductivity controllers, chemical nutrients, dehumidifiers are all aeroponic/hydroponic topics, and that indicates high tech. That does not seem like it could be much more obvious. How is hydro high tech? It's been around for thousands of years. So is a plant outside in a planter with soiless mix, organic nutrients and a wick system high tech? Just because it's hydro?

How many regular posters from this section go to the outdoor section and keep writing about aerogrows and conductivity anlyzers/controllers and pH analyzers/controllers or aeroponic/hydroponic nutrients and saying the out door soil growers need them. That equipment is typically written about here as they apply. DUH because most people don't leave their Aeroponic systems outside.... And I know plenty of gardeners who use pH testing devices in their outdoor gardens.

Humidifiers in an aeroponic or hydroponic grow room are not common, and usually not advisable with most such systems, so the suggestions for them typically does not apply here. If you think differently I suggest you just set up a pool thread and poll to see how many aeroponic and hydroponic growers use humifiers vesrus how many use air conditioners and dehumidifiers in their aeroponic grow rooms. Ie low humidity is usually not a problem with aeroponichydroponic systems but excess humidity is. One should desire to incease transpiration not decraese it with by supply excessive unbeneficial high humidity.

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I'm sure 80% would say they use air conditioners for COOLING purposes as I do, not to reduce moisture. Unless they're flowering in which case it serves both purposes dually.

Maybe we should make a poll...

So what you're saying is that if you don't have thousands of dollars to set up a perfect grow room then you will fail? I'd say Roseman's cheap, mostly DIY grow closet is pretty damn impressive!! Everyones situation is different. Small time, stealth growers like me benefit greatly from being able to use easily accessible, everyday items to achieve good growing conditions. At the end of the day, I've realized the TRULY experienced grower will take their cues from the plant, and results don't lie. If your method works for YOU, great, but making blanket statements about something that thousands of growers practice everyday, with great success i might add, hurts your credibility. You sound well read, and as such should know that while all plant life has similar needs, their specific needs can vary not only from tree to weed, but from strain to strain. This has also been proven.

I can safely say I easily own over 2000 text books, reference books and manuals. I own file drawers full of copies of professional research papers and subscribe to over a dozen magazines realting to different science disciplines. And those are just what are in my home, not my office or the lab I am responsible for at a university. Nope I own no dime store grade pot growing books or magazines.

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If this is true, which I do believe it is, then what drove you to rollitup?

Seriously? If you have so much knowledge, why aren't you the one posting tutorials and such?

Did mommy not hug you enough as a child?

diggitydank420 said:

If this is true, which I do believe it is, then what drove you to rollitup?

Seriously? If you have so much knowledge, why aren't you the one posting tutorials and such?

Did mommy not hug you enough as a child?

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I am getting PMs saying he is here only to be an arguer and debater and to go look at his other posts. He apparantly loves to argue.

Bump, Bump

fatman7574 said:

Hydro, and aero are high tech. What part of that statement can you possibly not understand. Misters, timers, solenoids, timers, pumps, air condioners, CO2 enrichment/ppm controllers, auto water top off systems, pH controllers, conductivity controllers, chemical nutrients, dehumidifiers are all aeroponic/hydroponic topics, and that indicates high tech. That does not seem like it could be much more obvious.

How many regular posters from this section go to the outdoor section and keep writing about aerogrows and conductivity anlyzers/controllers and pH analyzers/controllers or aeroponic/hydroponic nutrients and saying the out door soil growers need them. That equipment is typically written about here as they apply.

Humidifiers in an aeroponic or hydroponic grow room are not common, and usually not advisable with most such systems, so the suggestions for them typically does not apply here. If you think differently I suggest you just set up a pool thread and poll to see how many aeroponic and hydroponic growers use humifiers vesrus how many use air conditioners and dehumidifiers in their aeroponic grow rooms. Ie low humidity is usually not a problem with aeroponichydroponic systems but excess humidity is. One should desire to incease transpiration not decraese it with by supply excessive unbeneficial high humidity.

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Wow bud you have some problems, big PROBLEMS .some people just can't handle being wrong

I dont and the reason for it is my humidity was in the 30's and I had a problem with the leaves. Once i got the humidity up with a humidfier my problem went away. See my thread. https://www.rollitup.org/newbie-central/255945-leaf-spot-problem.html
Now that I have been keeping it higher now look at it.https://www.rollitup.org/introduce-yourself/255568-websluef.html
And I am just a beginner taking the advice of others.

I am not saying what I do or what I suggest or recommend is best for everyone. I am saying after 35 yeras of indoor growing merely what works best for me and people I know. I am also not going to agree that everything Roseman says or recommends is right for everyone. I have been straight forward he whole time in saying with a well balanced system there is no gain by a humidity of 40% that outweighs the possible disadvantages. If you choose closet grows and bubble grows and such that is fine. With many of those system due to the over ventilation needed to provide ample CO2 and due to poorer nutrient water delivery systems, less control of water pH and a higher humidity might be to your advantage and that is fine. I also say though when all other climate controls and nutrient delivery systems upgrades are being used a higher humidity just slows tranpiration and therefore growth. Because of that reasoning I would rather suggest people bring everything else under better control rather than to see them slow down transpiration and therefore growth because of not adjusting or improving other parmeters that makes high humidity necessary/beneficial. If you choose high humidities instead then don't be surprised by lower yields. Less capital investment, cheaper operation, more room for allowable error without bad plant losses, very likely with higher humidity being used. But if your on top of things and don't mind the higher initial capital costs then your yield will increase with the lower humidity system comprised of: CO2, higher temps, and a top end nutrient/water delivery system. IMHO

If my opinion does not matter as much to you as old myths and Roseman's opinions, thats fine as I lose not what ever you believe as I am not selling books, seeds or products so I gain nothing either way.