Stunted or Not, Male or Female

RayRay747 · Dec 19, 2017

Trying to get into the habit of posting a question or comment each day but I’ve been so busy with work I’m slackking.

Room Details:

Pots: 5gallon cloth pots wrapped in gnatty nets
Top Dressing: Gnat Nix
Top Medium: 5% Coco (to start seedlings out without shocking them with the soil)
Bottom Medium: 95% Stonington Blend “Super Soil”
Light: 600W LED
Intake: Passive Intake (1 bringing in outside air)
Exhaust: 6” Vortex S-Line
Filter: Phresh 6x16
Fans: 2 os fans - 1 on floor blowing on bottoms and 1 mounted on wall blowing over tops.
Humidity: 1 warm mist humidifier

My newest predicaments are #1, trying to determine if my autoF plants are stunted and/or growing as per average (if anybody really knows). Is there a guide showing average heights for plants/strains? This would be really helpful if we had some form of guide showing different stages of life of a particular grow. Maybe this is too hard to gather tho...

#2, is the Alien vs Triangle a male? I can’t really tell and I’m almost certain this one is stunted.

P.s. I did FIM (or what I think was a FIM) the Sour Diesel #1 and the two Dark Devils. I also have one more Dark Devil and Sour Diesel in soil now waiting for them to sprout and will not be doing anything to these new ones besides LST. I want to compare side x side FIM and LST vs just LST and see the results using my own growing technique. I also know a lot about the no-no-no dont top or FIM an auto perspective. I wanted to make sure I was able to see for myself and see if I can beat the odds using different training and feeding techniques.

P.s.s. I did wick off that water spot on the Sour Diesel seedling just so people know. Just did it right after the pic.

So questions:

1) is the Alien vs Triangle a male? And is it stunted? I believe it is stunted but not sure about sex. Sprouted on December 4.

2) Are the two dark devils stunted or look OK? I think they look ok but not positive. Sprouted on December 6.

3) The sour diesel sprouted on December 2. Why is the new growth lighter green compared to the dark devils for ie. Is it stunted?

Thanks much for all of your help. First time growing so really could use the pointers as I progress through this first one.

Budzbuddha · Dec 19, 2017

Topping can be done on autos .... Some autos ....

Some will not take the stress and stunt . This can effect yield at end .
Since the veg stage is short , it doesn't have the time to recover very much .
LST and some cropping ( flower ) can be done. I do these mostly but have done some topping on Humboldt autos ....

ACTUALLY what I do is Bud Back Building on the flowers ( especially Sativas ) to add girth instead of spear shaped buds. An 1/8 off the flower top ( week 3 ) then at week 6.
Makes some fatties.

LST : I like SHAPING the plants as to OPEN the middles. Since autos take a apical shape ( tree ) , it makes sense.

Also using BLURPLE lights will grow .... But you will find out that autos run under a single light will take a little longer to finish. Look at the FRINGE areas of your light footprint.
You will water less frequently ( plants don't transpire as much as other lights ) , feed will be less concentrated than plants that transpire more quickly. LED lights will sometimes take up to 30% feed ..... I run 18/6 continually ..... So harvest and grow cycles are the same .... New plants or ( seedlings ) are put in back , harvest plants in front ( to check triches. Be aware most " 8 week harvest " plants finish around week 10 or more , always go by the flowers triches , NOT GROWING TIME.

RayRay747 · Dec 20, 2017

Budzbuddha said:
Topping can be done on autos .... Some autos ....

Some will not take the stress and stunt . This can effect yield at end .
Since the veg stage is short , it doesn't have the time to recover very much .
LST and some cropping ( flower ) can be done. I do these mostly but have done some topping on Humboldt autos ....

ACTUALLY what I do is Bud Back Building on the flowers ( especially Sativas ) to add girth instead of spear shaped buds. An 1/8 off the flower top ( week 3 ) then at week 6.
Makes some fatties.

View attachment 4060646 View attachment 4060647

LST : I like SHAPING the plants as to OPEN the middles. Since autos take a apical shape ( tree ) , it makes sense.

Also using BLURPLE lights will grow .... But you will find out that autos run under a single light will take a little longer to finish. Look at the FRINGE areas of your light footprint.
You will water less frequently ( plants don't transpire as much as other lights ) , feed will be less concentrated than plants that transpire more quickly. LED lights will sometimes take up to 30% feed ..... I run 18/6 continually ..... So harvest and grow cycles are the same .... New plants or ( seedlings ) are put in back , harvest plants in front ( to check triches. Be aware most " 8 week harvest " plants finish around week 10 or more , always go by the flowers triches , NOT GROWING TIME.

Great stuff. I will try the bud back building on one of the autos once they get to that point. Do confirm you do this on your autos - BBB?

LST definitely I think has helped with growing more growth areas and opening up the middles. Each time I pull the branches down to allow light in, by mid day the middle fills up. I do the same thing the next day and same thing. Its working very nicely.

Im curious as to your thoughts on the heights on the plants based on the age (days from breaking soil/sprouting)...Since I am new I dont have any type of gauge to go off on. It makes it very hard to know you are doing the right thing.

I also put new seedling plants off to the side and make sure the main plants (vegging right now) are directly under the light. I will also have the harvesting plants in front and the veggers in back.

legalcanada · Dec 20, 2017

what specific light do you have? is it 600w actual power draw or "600w" equivalent? how close do you have it to your seedlings? you probably won't know sex until it starts showing preflowers - at that point you will be able to tell.

if your plants are stunted it could be because of too much light. seedlings don't need a lot of light, raise it up as high as you can and if they start to stretch lower it 6" a day until they stop. you can always bury the stem when you transplant to fix any stretch that happened.

what type of microbial life do you have in your soil? if you have lots of microbes you won't need to PH as they will buffer it. if you are just feeding "organic nutrients" without any compost teas or microbes/bacteria in your soil you should probably PH it. or at least double check it's in the correct range for soil (6.5-7? idk i use coco)

it's only been like 2 or 3 weeks man they look like they're doing fine. the worst thing new growers can do is over care for them and kill them with love. make sure the pots are drying out properly between waterings and just leave them alone for 2 or 3 days, i promise they'll look bigger when u see them afterwards!

RayRay747 · Dec 20, 2017

legalcanada said:
what specific light do you have? is it 600w actual power draw or "600w" equivalent? how close do you have it to your seedlings? you probably won't know sex until it starts showing preflowers - at that point you will be able to tell.

if your plants are stunted it could be because of too much light. seedlings don't need a lot of light, raise it up as high as you can and if they start to stretch lower it 6" a day until they stop. you can always bury the stem when you transplant to fix any stretch that happened.

what type of microbial life do you have in your soil? if you have lots of microbes you won't need to PH as they will buffer it. if you are just feeding "organic nutrients" without any compost teas or microbes/bacteria in your soil you should probably PH it. or at least double check it's in the correct range for soil (6.5-7? idk i use coco)

it's only been like 2 or 3 weeks man they look like they're doing fine. the worst thing new growers can do is over care for them and kill them with love. make sure the pots are drying out properly between waterings and just leave them alone for 2 or 3 days, i promise they'll look bigger when u see them afterwards!

Hey there - its the viaspectra 600w so im sure its not true 600w. Its now at 24" from canopy level (according to viaspectra during veg). I was going to lower it but just dont want to burn the plants. and yep its been about 2 weeks now for all of them and I guess im just being inpatient. lol.

They dont seem like they are stretching too much and the other day I lowered the lights to 22" and the Dark Devils starting praying so I figured it was a good thing. But today I moved the lights back up to 24" because I have a two new seedlings that just popped out of soil I dont want to stunt with the light.

I am in 5G cloth pots and will not be transplanting (i am running autos now).

I am using coast of maine "super soil" growers blend. I am only feeding it organic plant food, molasses, aloe vera juice and coconut water and of course plain water. I dont do teas. I hate tea. lol. Soil pH from what I understand is best between 5.8-6.5. I try to shoot for 6.0-6.2ish area, but I have stopped adjusting pH since so many peeps say dont bother adjusting your pH if using organic soil.

My foilage sprays are plain water with epsom salt and agave and another bottle with organic plant food, molasses, aloe vera juice and coconut water. Every time I "just" water, its water with with molasses, AV and CW. When I use the organic plant food, I just add it to water, let it sit 24 hours and then remove the liquid and use that. My feed schedule is water, water, nutes.

Last time I watered was on Sunday. So I typically dry them out pretty good and work hard to not overwater. I always water in a circle around the plant to help the roots search for the water source. I do normally check the room at least twice daily tho (more because of the 2 new seedlings) I have in there growing. I dont want the top of the soil to dry out so I am spraying it with water to keep it moist. I also have a sensorpush in the room, so I use that more as my overwatch vs going down to check on them. If temps and RH are fine I dont bother even going to check on them. I cant wait to they get looking even more like the finished product.

Also - I really do think I stunted the Alien vs Triangle and maybe the sour diesel early on when (i know i know) I gave them plant food way way tooo early. Was just being a newb eager grower and thought I would be helping it but the soil I have is supposed to be very good and not need much until later on if any. I also had heat issues in the beginning as I didnt have my vortex running yet.

The room is now dialed in at 75-77F and 50-55% RH with lights on AND 65-70F and 50-60% RH with lights off. I have my vortex running from 10am-5am, and off and on in between 5am to when it comes back on at 10am. I do this to help with keeping the temps a little warmer and the RH a little higher during veg. I will take out the water trays and humidifier and run the vortex 24/7 during flower so I can get the RH and temps to drop to ideal #'s.

Thanks for your advice. Greatly appreciated.

legalcanada · Dec 21, 2017

RayRay747 said:
Hey there - its the viaspectra 600w so im sure its not true 600w. Its now at 24" from canopy level (according to viaspectra during veg). I was going to lower it but just dont want to burn the plants. and yep its been about 2 weeks now for all of them and I guess im just being inpatient. lol.

They dont seem like they are stretching too much and the other day I lowered the lights to 22" and the Dark Devils starting praying so I figured it was a good thing. But today I moved the lights back up to 24" because I have a two new seedlings that just popped out of soil I dont want to stunt with the light.

I am in 5G cloth pots and will not be transplanting (i am running autos now).

I am using coast of maine "super soil" growers blend. I am only feeding it organic plant food, molasses, aloe vera juice and coconut water and of course plain water. I dont do teas. I hate tea. lol. Soil pH from what I understand is best between 5.8-6.5. I try to shoot for 6.0-6.2ish area, but I have stopped adjusting pH since so many peeps say dont bother adjusting your pH if using organic soil.

My foilage sprays are plain water with epsom salt and agave and another bottle with organic plant food, molasses, aloe vera juice and coconut water. Every time I "just" water, its water with with molasses, AV and CW. When I use the organic plant food, I just add it to water, let it sit 24 hours and then remove the liquid and use that. My feed schedule is water, water, nutes.

Last time I watered was on Sunday. So I typically dry them out pretty good and work hard to not overwater. I always water in a circle around the plant to help the roots search for the water source. I do normally check the room at least twice daily tho (more because of the 2 new seedlings) I have in there growing. I dont want the top of the soil to dry out so I am spraying it with water to keep it moist. I also have a sensorpush in the room, so I use that more as my overwatch vs going down to check on them. If temps and RH are fine I dont bother even going to check on them. I cant wait to they get looking even more like the finished product.

Also - I really do think I stunted the Alien vs Triangle and maybe the sour diesel early on when (i know i know) I gave them plant food way way tooo early. Was just being a newb eager grower and thought I would be helping it but the soil I have is supposed to be very good and not need much until later on if any. I also had heat issues in the beginning as I didnt have my vortex running yet.

The room is now dialed in at 75-77F and 50-55% RH with lights on AND 65-70F and 50-60% RH with lights off. I have my vortex running from 10am-5am, and off and on in between 5am to when it comes back on at 10am. I do this to help with keeping the temps a little warmer and the RH a little higher during veg. I will take out the water trays and humidifier and run the vortex 24/7 during flower so I can get the RH and temps to drop to ideal #'s.

Thanks for your advice. Greatly appreciated.

yes it looks like that soil contains mycos fungi and lobster compost. compost tea is just compost and water run with an air pump for 24hrs or so, it adds beneficial bacteria and stuff to your soil, but you do have some already. LEDs generally cause less stretch and tighter node spacing. you could always keep raising the lights until you see them start growing up if you want, or keep it where it is and get a real tight bushy plant. i think they're doing fine man all you need to give them is time

RayRay747 · Dec 21, 2017

legalcanada said:
yes it looks like that soil contains mycos fungi and lobster compost. compost tea is just compost and water run with an air pump for 24hrs or so, it adds beneficial bacteria and stuff to your soil, but you do have some already. LEDs generally cause less stretch and tighter node spacing. you could always keep raising the lights until you see them start growing up if you want, or keep it where it is and get a real tight bushy plant. i think they're doing fine man all you need to give them is time

Very reassuring bro. I just went down to check and LST the stem of one of the Dark Devils and sprayed the soil of the two young just sprouted seedlings. Man what a few hours of not checking makes a big difference in viewing pleasure.

Yeah the COM Growers Blend seems like its a decent soil to use vs having to make my own super soil. I just didnt want the hassle and wait time tbh. I just put COM soil in pots, top the soil with 5% coco, add my epsom salt and agave and drop the germed seed into the coco about 1cm deep, cover the seed with and spray with epsom salt, aloe vera and coconut juice water. The seeds normally sprout the soil within 1-2 days of dropping them. One thing I started doing differently with germming the seeds is the second I see the seed pop and the taproot starts showing I plant the seed right away. I have found this is much easier for me to avoid fucking up the taproot by letting it grow a 1/4 inch like I did the first 3 seeds I germed.

Being a perfectionist by nature is tough when growing. Even when I grow my veggies and fruits outside I swear I am getting paid to garden based on the intensity of my gardening. With our babies, I definitely will be paying less attention to them and just letting them do their thing. I do have a few tasks such as: change the water trays, add more water to the humidifier and spray the new seedlings daily so Ill try to limit my check-in times to just max 3 times daily. Once in the morning, once in the evening and once before I head off to bed. I am sure I can commit to that so I can get rid of the baby them mentality.

Ps. It may not look like it but I FIMMED the 2 of dark devils, 1 of the sour diesel and 1 of the Alien vs Triangle. I will not top the 3rd dark devil, the 2nd sour diesel and the 2 Alien vs Triangle to compare growth and yields for all 3 strains. The fimmed dark devils seem like they didnt skip much a beat and looks like I may have 4 tops now for one and 3 tops for the other. The 1st Sour diesel, looks like two tops came from the fim/top (I actually think maybe I ended up topping it vs fimming it). The 1st Alien vs Triangle, has been a slow grower since the beginning and tbh was contemplating just pulling it about a week ago. So I just said screw it and I topped it. Figured its already stunted so what will the FIM do to it. lol. Looks like its finally starting to pick up but not even close to the dark devils growth. Those fuckers are some heavy hitters compared to the sour diesel and alien vs triangle.

Sorry about the ramble but I get excited when I hear positive things about my grow and that I am making progress. I have seen so many issues newbies have, I have been fortunate so far to get past a few of the bad humps in the beginning.

Stunted or Not, Male or Female

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