Should an Australian be concered posting his grow?

May I ask where you would go? While Abbotts policies will hurt the lower and middle classes mainly (what's new with a liberal government?) the medicare co payment for low income earners on centrelink benefits is waived and health care cards provide prescriptions at more than a 50% reduction, sometimes up to 90% of the recommended retail price. No dole to 30 and an additional six month wait to qualify is really going to hurt people, i agree, but in light of how some other countries structure their Social Security/Welfare system Australia is not the worst place to live, granted it is becoming harder, but the are organisations that can help our where centrelink cant...
Not sure yet, somewhere I can get a bargain plot of land if southern Europe, create my own food, breath in all that fresh air and shit :D And apart from the government, the other problem with this country is everything is a fucking ripoff. Property, vehicles, food, weed, electronics.

It's not just a 6 month wait for the dole, you have to wait 6 months EVERY YEAR. How are unemployed people supposed to feed themselves and put a roof over their head for that 6 months ;)

If all the victims of the shootings had guns too these massacres wouldn't have happened. When the criminals are the only ones with guns is when there are problems.
 
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HughDunit

Active Member
Australia is going through a massive period of ultra conservative ideals. The current government is setting up for some hard pain in the long term and are doing it without really caring and pressured by the good old lobby groups donations. BAsically we are selling democracy to overseas multi nationals and allowing the same corporations, the same business models which have fucked the US of A to enter Australian society. These big multi nationals and their toxic ideals see australia and australians as raw meat ready to cook just like they have done with americans.

its disgusting but australians were warned countless times but were too distracted by the infighting of the government of the day. If anything Kevin Rudd is to blame for all this, it was he who couldn't let go when he was kicked out for what is now apparent being a power hungry little man. He gave the neo-conservatives the keys to the country.

And because of all this dont expect cannabis to be close to being legal anytime in the near the future.
 

miccyj

Well-Known Member
If all the victims of the shootings had guns too these massacres wouldn't have happened. When the criminals are the only ones with guns is when there are problems.
I'm not sure if you're being serious or not, your saying children should be given guns?

Australia has a relatively low number of shootings, and almost no random acts of of violence like school shootings and massacres, so you think it would go down if everyone had easy access to guns?
 
I'm not sure if you're being serious or not, your saying children should be given guns?

Australia has a relatively low number of shootings, and almost no random acts of of violence like school shootings and massacres, so you think it would go down if everyone had easy access to guns?
No, I'm saying staff members should be given guns, or at least security guards.

Low number of shootings? See Western and Southern Sydney.

Instead of shootings there are just more fatal stabbings/beatings now so it makes no difference.

Shootings may go up but violent crime in general will go down. See Switzerland, they don't have any massacres.
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
I agree with this.

Wow there is a lot of complaining about in this thread but let's face it, Australia is a great place to live, sure, the govt make bad decisions and tell lies, but what government doesn't? It's not a few evil men hell bent on ruining your life, it is hundreds of people trying to operate every aspect of a country, it doesn't matter who is in power, they are going to piss people off.

The govt is not going to use back doors into your computer system to see if your growing weed, so take off the tin foil hats, smoke a bowl and relax, Lol.

As for gun control, while I think that some of the laws are a little overkill, I much prefer it to what they have in the USA where there are shootings in schools every month. I'm a fire arms owner and avid hunter, and I don't mind people needing a valid reason to own one, carrying a gun for self defence is just dangerous and unnecessary.
"The govt is not going to use back doors into your computer system to see if your growing weed, so take off the tin foil hats, smoke a bowl and relax, Lol."
"...needing a valid reason to own one, carrying a gun for self defence is just dangerous and unnecessary."

I vehemently disagree with these statements.
The only "reason" i need to own a firearm is freedom: "because i said so." As long as i don't violate anyone else's life/liberty/property, the gov't should have no reason to impinge mine. And really, they shouldn't have the authority to do so, even if they did invent a reason that was good enough for them, but not good enough for me.


"It's not a few evil men hell bent on ruining your life, it is hundreds of people trying to operate every aspect of a country, it doesn't matter who is in power, they are going to piss people off."

I agree with this one, except that when we say "a few," we really mean hundreds/thousands; comparatively speaking, they are but "a few," in relation to the total population.

Complaining about complaining is still complaining. Plus, it's anti-free-speech. I'll extrapolate that you don't want me to be free to speak my mind. ^^
 

spazatak

Well-Known Member
"The govt is not going to use back doors into your computer system to see if your growing weed, so take off the tin foil hats, smoke a bowl and relax, Lol."
"...needing a valid reason to own one, carrying a gun for self defence is just dangerous and unnecessary."

I vehemently disagree with these statements.
The only "reason" i need to own a firearm is freedom: "because i said so." As long as i don't violate anyone else's life/liberty/property, the gov't should have no reason to impinge mine. And really, they shouldn't have the authority to do so, even if they did invent a reason that was good enough for them, but not good enough for me.


"It's not a few evil men hell bent on ruining your life, it is hundreds of people trying to operate every aspect of a country, it doesn't matter who is in power, they are going to piss people off."

I agree with this one, except that when we say "a few," we really mean hundreds/thousands; comparatively speaking, they are but "a few," in relation to the total population.

Complaining about complaining is still complaining. Plus, it's anti-free-speech. I'll extrapolate that you don't want me to be free to speak my mind. ^^
because you "said so" isnt a reason jimbob..


can I get a yeehaww!!!!
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
because you "said so" isnt a reason jimbob..


can I get a yeehaww!!!!
Of course it is. It may not be a reason you like, but it is a reason, nonetheless. I could even elaborate that reason: why do i say so? Because i Want to. As a human being, i have the right to do whatever i want, whatever makes me feel however i want to feel, as long as i don't do something that impinges the life or property of another.

If i "just want to" own firearms, there is no legitimate reason why i should not be allowed, unless i have demonstrated the intent to initiate aggression towards others.

Contrarily, you could make the argument that "TPTB" or whatever gov't entity asserting authority to control its citizens, is afraid that i will use weapons to cause harm to others, or, more importantly, that i will reject their assertion of authority to dictate my choices, and resist any and all attempts by them, to impose control through aggression and use of deadly force.

In other words: the gov'ts want us not to have guns, because they're afraid we will refuse to be controlled. They assert themselves as "above regular people," and they want us to submit to that assertion, and comply with their commands.

Lots of people find that unacceptable, and this is often due to what i've only recently become aware actually has a name, which is "the non-aggression principle." As long as no one instigates aggression toward me, why would i need to harm anyone? Especially since i already know that "violence begets violence," and that instigating undue harm almost always results in exacerbated consequences. If i don't want to provoke someone into harming me, i should avoid harming them first. But if, while adhering to the non-aggression principle, someone instigates, provokes, and imposes undue aggression upon me... then i have every right to retaliate with whatever amount of force is required to prevent them from harming me, or anyone else, unduly, any further.

They try to legislate away our right to defend ourselves from injustice, by arbitrarily "criminalizing" resistance... but they refuse to earn their privilege to do so, by adhering to the non-aggression principle. Instead, they invent laws that they claim allows them to violate the non-aggression principle, for any reason they deem valid, including non-violent, non-destructive, non-harmful, non-dangerous things, like partnering with natural plants, such as cannabis. But this is inherently invalid, because growing and consuming cannabis does not violate any part of the non-aggression principle, and does not legitimately cause detriment to anyone at all.
 

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Power, Mao famously said, comes from the barrel of a gun.

THAT is why people in power do not want those without it to own them.

The Republican Party of Amerika and its conservative sycophants worldwide have a basic failure of philosophy on their hands; they want to take away the very freedoms they tell their constituents they stand for. While talking about guns, they do everything they can to increase the gini coefficient.

It IS about the 99%. There are hundreds of times more of us than them, so they'll need to learn how to give everyone their fair share- or lose ALL of their power, status and privilege.
 

spazatak

Well-Known Member
In other words: the gov'ts want us not to have guns, because they're afraid we will refuse to be controlled. They assert themselves as "above regular people," and they want us to submit to that assertion, and comply with their commands.
LOL.. you are being controlled everyday and every minute...you may think you aren't but you very much are... so having a free market on guns so far has done fuck all to stop you being controlled

The fact is that most people obey the law.. but some don't hence why they aren't actually trying to take your guns away, they are trying to make it more difficult for those who are unfit to obtain then.. if you aren't unfit to carry a gun then you shouldnt be worried but why would you be against those who are unfit to carry guns being able to access them

the question must be asked....do you value the free and unregulated possession of firearms over the life of a father, mother or child...?
Power, Mao famously said, comes from the barrel of a gun.

THAT is why people in power do not want those without it to own them.

The Republican Party of Amerika and its conservative sycophants worldwide have a basic failure of philosophy on their hands; they want to take away the very freedoms they tell their constituents they stand for. While talking about guns, they do everything they can to increase the gini coefficient.

It IS about the 99%. There are hundreds of times more of us than them, so they'll need to learn how to give everyone their fair share- or lose ALL of their power, status and privilege.
Do you think that the civilian population would really over throw the US Govt and military with basic firearms... SMH...

you've been watching too many Yosemite Sam cartoons
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
LOL.. you are being controlled everyday and every minute...you may think you aren't but you very much are... so having a free market on guns so far has done fuck all to stop you being controlled

The fact is that most people obey the law.. but some don't hence why they aren't actually trying to take your guns away, they are trying to make it more difficult for those who are unfit to obtain then.. if you aren't unfit to carry a gun then you shouldnt be worried but why would you be against those who are unfit to carry guns being able to access them

the question must be asked....do you value the free and unregulated possession of firearms over the life of a father, mother or child...?


Do you think that the civilian population would really over throw the US Govt and military with basic firearms... SMH...

you've been watching too many Yosemite Sam cartoons
Do you really think the entire military will follow orders to massacre the very people they believe they are supposed to be protecting, due to those same people demanding the same "freedom" those soldiers are told they risk their lives to protect?

Not gonna happen. Some of them, the psychopaths, who have no conscience, will indeed fire on citizens without questioning their orders... but not all of them, probably not even most of them.

A violent revolution would result in massive casualties, but the end result would be the end of the U.S. Gov't, and/or the whole country.

I won't bother w/ your strawmen.
 

spazatak

Well-Known Member
nice avoidance of my question..

LOL You think the Govt is going to attack its citizens and your gun laws will protect you...how cute...

No wonder they call pro gun lobbyist "gun nuts" ... if that cap fits and not just the tin foil one..
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
nice avoidance of my question..

LOL You think the Govt is going to attack its citizens and your gun laws will protect you...how cute...

No wonder they call pro gun lobbyist "gun nuts" ... if that cap fits and not just the tin foil one..
False. Like i said, i'm not going to take your bait into an impossible argument.

My point is valid and i know it, and other people know it. If your only counter is to create a false premise and attempt to force me to defend it, while obfuscating any possibility of the natural progression of debate, then it's useless.

BTW, tinfoil wouldn't work if anyone was actually trying to control anyone's brainwaves, just FYI.

Maybe instead of trying to misrepresent my position by inventing a false frame of reference, you should explain yours. Mine is pretty much self-evident. Yours seems completely irrational to me... because all i've seen of your position is that you want to convince everyone that only the gov't and police should own guns. That makes you sound like a statist, which means you don't adhere to, and probably don't even understand, the non-aggression principle... which means you should perhaps educate yourself, prior to instigating any argument over related subjects. ^^
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
The only reason to own a gun is to seriously hurt or kill, no if no buts. None of this protection crap that is used as a strawman.
So clearly police should never have guns, because they are all about forced compliance. Ergo: police intend to hurt and/or kill everyone.

That's good enough logic, right?


edit: if someone (or more than one) wielding a firearm fully intends to harm or kill me, but refuses to listen to reason, and cannot be talked down... how do i protect myself from them?

Yep, you guessed it: i'd have to kill them, in order to PROTECT MYSELF from Their Aggression.

Violence is never the first option; it's the last.

If someone with guns comes to "get me," my only chance is to kill them first, because they have already chosen aggression and violence, and they will not give me the chance to do anything but submit to their unjust, undeserved, arbitrarily imposed demands.
 

HughDunit

Active Member
The Republican Party of Amerika and its conservative sycophants worldwide have a basic failure of philosophy on their hands; they want to take away the very freedoms they tell their constituents they stand for. While talking about guns, they do everything they can to increase the gini coefficient.
We know that the right throughout history is about mass control, manipulation on a grand scale, about absolute power and about oppressing humanity for their own gain. History is littered with right wing lunatics who have killed millions of people yet we continually vote in right wing governments.

Humans are just pathetic parasites at the end of the day. Oh how i wish other species caught up and learnt to use mass weapons.
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
Guns were made to kill. Nothing more nothing less..argue semantics all you want but guns are produced with one single objective.
Yes, guns are made to kill.

And when someone who already has a gun, decides to kill you, without any intention of having a discussion about who is right or wrong, how do you stop them? I already explained this. This is not "arguing semantics."

If i know i'm outnumbered and outgunned, and my only option is to either submit to the unjust ruination of my life, or try to take some of the bastards down with me... guess which i think is the better choice.

Maybe you would prefer everyone be easily rounded up and thrown in cages, but that violates the "i'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees" protocol.
 

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
We know that the right throughout history is about mass control, manipulation on a grand scale, about absolute power and about oppressing humanity for their own gain. History is littered with right wing lunatics who have killed millions of people yet we continually vote in right wing governments.

Humans are just pathetic parasites at the end of the day. Oh how i wish other species caught up and learnt to use mass weapons.
Ah, so you're one of those misguided people who thinks "it's the right wing who are bad."

Newsflash: both sides are what is known as "controlled opposition."

Neither "side" has your best interests in mind. Both "sides" of the upper echelon want you either controlled or eliminated.
 
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