Saving a bad crop

Not sure where to begin, but basically I grew in coco 2 Purple Kush under 250W HPS. The buds were airy and light. Not enough Light or nutrients I read. They smelled good while growing, but after I harvested, the smell is extremely strong like hay, or bad hay. It's almost a bit sour/acidic in smell. The strongest wet hay you ever smelled maybe best to describe it.

Looking at the trichomes I saw all colours. Some had amber tones, many were cloudy, but I think many more were still clear. There were also a lot that looked greenish/milky green. There is about 50-60% red hairs or so if I had to guess.

I harvested because I knew my late habits of being in the grow room with leaking light was causing them to hermie. I found a number of seeds in my grow after I ground all the bud I had. They had 10 weeks of Flowering. I hung the buds upside down 5 days after cut, then went into 2 plastic juice bottles I had.

When you burn it, it smokes a dark ash. - Wasn't flushed right? But I ran strictly RO water for 2 weeks with about 1L watch given each day to each plant. It later went to 2L/day per plant. I also took both plants to the tub and ran them through a number of soakings. How could that not be enough water or time to flush coco? 5G pots with ~ 21L of RO and likely another 10L+ tap water over 2 weeks.

Would giving it molassasses in the last 2 days cause black instead of white ash when smoking weed?

Assuming my grow was possibly harvested early (looking at the # of clear trichomes), and the fact that you can't smoke it because it so harsh and taste awful, can this weed be saved and those negative effects lost if I make cannabutter or shatter for example?
 

firsttimeARE

Well-Known Member
Not sure what causes dark ash. I dont think it has anything to do with flushing or not. I do remember from nutrient deficiencies thread that harsh smoke is caused from a,molybdenum deficiency. You generally dont want to flush. Nutrients are stored in leaves not calyxes which is the buds. Your plant needs these nutrients. Ive never ran coco extensively but I know,it can build,up salts if you dont allow for runoff and overfeed.

Dark ash sounds like too wet of weed/improperly dried. I know wood when burned wet will have dark ash. Makes sense. Incomplete burn.

Molasses is usually meant to feed,beneficials in your medium. I dont believe the plants actually uptake them, I could be wrong tho.

Are you sure it didnt mold? Does it,smell like ammonia/cat pee?

Harvesting early can cause a hay smell
 
That's what I'm planning for now. I'll see what glass jars I have. I know the plastic juice jars are not the best, but is it going to make that big of a difference? My LP sends stuff in plastic containers lol :P. I keep it in a dark place, but it's at a temp of 25 degrees since that's where I spend my time and am growing a clone. I feel like my weed smells like it has a chemical smell along with the strong hay smell. I could even say it made me feel sick smoking a hit from the bowl ha ha. At the same time I would say I smell a much lighter and similar smell from weed I buy too so waiting a longer period of time is possibly all that is needed. I just didn't t/don't think that freshly harvested weed should smell like this. Should your leaves yellow? Is that strain, or grow medium dependant? My leaves were all green when I cut my 2 plants.

What I think I did was stunt the growth of the plants with lots of sloppy mistakes, and then it started hermies likely from the light leaking and it went much longer than needed. I'm excited for the next plant since I'm just growing one under the 250 and clone light this time, plus it has so many leaves in it's 6" stature where as my seed grew up as a string bean and didn't look thick at all.
 
Why do you think the plastic jars are not the best?
Just a guess based on how plastics leach into things and because everyone uses glass jars. As I said, my LP sends me my weed in plastic containers and it could sit for a while so I know it's not "bad", but for curing anything that helps more is the ideal solution.

My question still isn't really answered though. Has nobody done a harvest and after hanging it 5 days, couldn't smoke it because it was so harsh, bad tasting, and extremely strong smelling. The dispensary weed has the same smell in some strains, but it's just so much less potent to sniff. Tried smoking the keef, but it almost made me gag similar to the flower. Is this normal for recently cut, or are these common symptoms of not flushing properly which I'm also guessing was the case. Thanks for the tips and advice.
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
Just a guess based on how plastics leach into things and because everyone uses glass jars. As I said, my LP sends me my weed in plastic containers and it could sit for a while so I know it's not "bad", but for curing anything that helps more is the ideal solution.

My question still isn't really answered though. Has nobody done a harvest and after hanging it 5 days, couldn't smoke it because it was so harsh, bad tasting, and extremely strong smelling. The dispensary weed has the same smell in some strains, but it's just so much less potent to sniff. Tried smoking the keef, but it almost made me gag similar to the flower. Is this normal for recently cut, or are these common symptoms of not flushing properly which I'm also guessing was the case. Thanks for the tips and advice.
That harshness is actually the chlorophyll as opposed to salts/synthetic nutrients as people commonly believe, although the latter can in fact have a similar effect. It'll also produce the black ash and hay scent you're currently experiencing. As someone else said, throw them in glass jars and re-evaluate in another handful of weeks to a month. Grab some 63% humidity boveda packs to help with the curing if you're not confident in it yourself.
 
That harshness is actually the chlorophyll as opposed to salts/synthetic nutrients as people commonly believe, although the latter can in fact have a similar effect. It'll also produce the black ash and hay scent you're currently experiencing. As someone else said, throw them in glass jars and re-evaluate in another handful of weeks to a month. Grab some 63% humidity boveda packs to help with the curing if you're not confident in it yourself.
Thanks for the info. I figured it was either not flushing nutrients, or the plant wasn't ready to be cut because it was still green (full of yummy chlorophyll as you mentioned). So basically a plant with yellow leaves can be smoked much faster than one that is cut down green? Would make sense if the rate of yellowing implies the rate of chlorophyll leaving the plant - and that it also applied to the bud. More yellow = less curing time correct? My stuff isn't smokeable at all (joint/bong). Not even smellable it's so strong. I did try to vape it and it's a little smokeable, but doesn't give much of a high. I ground the weed up and placed it in a plastic shake container. Now it's in an empty glass (spaghetti) jar as suggested. HA HA HA, my 2 plants produced about 1/3 of a 650mL spaghetti jar :wall:. Maybe 20g's.

My clone is ready for flower soon, but placing it in a different room this time than where I work at all hours of the night, leaking light on my plant while it sleeps. Growing 2 plants that got 3.5' tall under 250W light and taking off fan leaves was the majority of my issues. I had airy buds with small and large seeds eventually appearing. Tried to grow those seeds, but none cracked open in water. They likely won't sprout, but put them in a rooter anyways. It's ok, because I plan to make 2 new clones before going to flower with the current clone. I don't know enough about plant genetics yet to know the best approaches so I'm just life hacking my way through this stuff as I get to it and just learning from my own mistakes. Wondering if genetics get weaker from consistent cloning a clone, or if hermies (likely what my first had happen) effects the next generation of plants. Some people just clone from the mother that remains in Veg forever. Others seem to make clones from clones.
 

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kratos015

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the info. I figured it was either not flushing nutrients, or the plant wasn't ready to be cut because it was still green (full of yummy chlorophyll as you mentioned). So basically a plant with yellow leaves can be smoked much faster than one that is cut down green? Would make sense if the rate of yellowing implies the rate of chlorophyll leaving the plant - and that it also applied to the bud. More yellow = less curing time correct? My stuff isn't smokeable at all (joint/bong). Not even smellable it's so strong. I did try to vape it and it's a little smokeable, but doesn't give much of a high. I ground the weed up and placed it in a plastic shake container. Now it's in an empty glass (spaghetti) jar as suggested. HA HA HA, my 2 plants produced about 1/3 of a 650mL spaghetti jar :wall:. Maybe 20g's.

My clone is ready for flower soon, but placing it in a different room this time than where I work at all hours of the night, leaking light on my plant while it sleeps. Growing 2 plants that got 3.5' tall under 250W light and taking off fan leaves was the majority of my issues. I had airy buds with small and large seeds eventually appearing. Tried to grow those seeds, but none cracked open in water. They likely won't sprout, but put them in a rooter anyways. It's ok, because I plan to make 2 new clones before going to flower with the current clone. I don't know enough about plant genetics yet to know the best approaches so I'm just life hacking my way through this stuff as I get to it and just learning from my own mistakes. Wondering if genetics get weaker from consistent cloning a clone, or if hermies (likely what my first had happen) effects the next generation of plants. Some people just clone from the mother that remains in Veg forever. Others seem to make clones from clones.
Just because the leaves are yellow doesn't mean the chlorophyll is gone, that just means the plant is sucking water/nutrients from it causing it to eventually die off. Try putting it in legit Ball/Kerr/Mason jars and waiting a good 3-4 weeks doing a proper cure, that should hopefully fix your issue.

How is the potency and how far away was your light from the canopy? I found this lesson out the hard way, but having your light too close to the canopy will actually bleach the buds, destroy resin glands, and just make things harsh overall.

And as for your plants/seeds, I wouldn't use them if they hermied really bad on you. Trust me, go on attitude/herbies/etc and get yourself some legit genetics. Yeah it can get pricey and you have to wait quite a bit, but not doing this is almost always a mistake because you're taking a huge risk using bag seed. I've had some killer phenos come up from bag seed of various strains, but if you're growing your own meds I wouldn't mess with bag seed because it isn't as consistent. Sure, 1/10 seeds will be fire, but the rest will be hermies/seeded and just over all lacking. Trust me, go online and get yourself some good seeds and go from there. You'll be happy that you did.

HTH
 
So the final story of this thread and "Edward Scissorhands" (https://www.rollitup.org/t/edward-scissorhands.952777/page-2#post-13910364) I created, is that I basically tossed the weed/ruined it and tossed it. It was not smoke-able after weeks of being in both a plastic blender container, then a glass salsa jar. I think my issue was drying it upside down on the branches 5 days. It was dry as F&*)< by then and that likely dried out the trichomes making them harsh and less potent. I took what I had and remove a bunch of the seeds. Small ones and large ones. Put them all in water for a few days. A few cracked, a bunch appeared to be split but not opening enough, and some were duds. I then decided to cover them with cloning gel till it dried lol. Then put the seeds in rooters and gave them the same nutrients as my clone taken from the first grow in flowering. 5 of the 7-8 seeds sprouted so I'll take those numbers :weed: Clearly I'm not following the recommended steps and basically learning as I go and from bits and pieces everyone online advises. I read someone used cloning gel on seeds and it worked 90% of the time on seeds sprouting. Others advised against doing anything but water. I used gel, 5mL/L DNF Grow and Super thrive at 2drops/L.

Back to how I ruined my weed. Couldn't use a bong, couldn't vape it. I then used 70% isopropyl alcohol (read later I should have only used 99%). Soaked it for about 3 minutes. Likely 2.5 minutes too long? I double bowl boiled the alcohol off, but found I had an amber oil and dark green/black small droplets 50/50 mixture. I wasn't sure if the dark was impurities or (RSO forming). The amber was like shatter/rosin when it cooled. I didn't have a way to really smoke it with a nail. Treid it on a joint - was a no go. Learned and retained a lot whether it went well or not. I'm looking to do better with my new baby - 5 branch beast hopefully. I was trying to "knuck" the branches which I understand is to press and damage them a bit to bend them knowing they'll rebound back with a knot at the point. Typically stronger than before? I ended up damaging it and it split the stem vertically, but to my surprise, the branch and leaves are doing fine. The area is all dried out obviously. I pulled out some electrical tape to see if it helps create an area where some moisture can be restored. Likely too late, but it doubles as support. It will go into flowering pretty soon. I'm probably in week 5 of veg + 5 weeks of being a clone (Flower back to veg cycle) if that makes sense to you.

I don't plan to cut 50 fan leaves in the 3rd week of flower with this one either :lol:

20180118_180304.jpg
 
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The orange rope is me tying down the branches (obviously) just by going around the box tucking the rope under it's weight. I think LST is safer than "knuckling" from my experience.
...and yes I'm a mad scientist with these plants. I've comet to see with my owe eyes you can abuse marijuana quite a bit and it will still grow or recover which is great for beginners. I had pet hair in my bud too. Never walk in front of your fan or allow pets in the flower room.

The humidity on this clone grow is 30% and 25-28c temp. Not what it's supposed to be, but plant's growing fine in veg. How will humidity effect flowering though? I read in one article the temps being hot is one reason why you want humidity. So if my plants are not hot, do they need all that humidity? Didn't run a fan on this plant either. Shame on me I know :)
 
Just because the leaves are yellow doesn't mean the chlorophyll is gone, that just means the plant is sucking water/nutrients from it causing it to eventually die off. Try putting it in legit Ball/Kerr/Mason jars and waiting a good 3-4 weeks doing a proper cure, that should hopefully fix your issue.

How is the potency and how far away was your light from the canopy? I found this lesson out the hard way, but having your light too close to the canopy will actually bleach the buds, destroy resin glands, and just make things harsh overall.

And as for your plants/seeds, I wouldn't use them if they hermied really bad on you. Trust me, go on attitude/herbies/etc and get yourself some legit genetics. Yeah it can get pricey and you have to wait quite a bit, but not doing this is almost always a mistake because you're taking a huge risk using bag seed. I've had some killer phenos come up from bag seed of various strains, but if you're growing your own meds I wouldn't mess with bag seed because it isn't as consistent. Sure, 1/10 seeds will be fire, but the rest will be hermies/seeded and just over all lacking. Trust me, go online and get yourself some good seeds and go from there. You'll be happy that you did.

HTH
I bought 5 feminized purple kush and grew 2 which were the garbage grow I just mentioned. I took a clone which is my new plant doing really well. Pretty sure it's a female since I don't see anything unusual showing it's a male. I can't find my other 3 seeds in the package. I think I hid them when I parents visited and forgot where. The buds on the plant smelled and looked good, but I should have sweated them in a bag vs hanging them like I did. They were dry in a day and I kept them there 4 more since everyone says 5-7 days hanging. Harvesting/Curing is definitely the hardest part.

Also I noticed I had a lot of clear trichomes still, a lot were cloudy too and a few amber, but I saw seeds and knew I had to harvest. The seeds were likely from all the excess light after 12hr cycle I exposed them too. They were 4' tall and both didn't fit under a 250W light well either honestly. The light is about 18" from my clone now.
 

raggyb

Well-Known Member
You lost me. But seeds don't mean it's time to harvest. I think you also need to solve your darkness issue. Not even a pinhole of light is allowed not even for a second during dark time. I don't know why it's like that given outside there is a moon, but it's just the way it is.
 
You lost me. But seeds don't mean it's time to harvest. I think you also need to solve your darkness issue. Not even a pinhole of light is allowed not even for a second during dark time. I don't know why it's like that given outside there is a moon, but it's just the way it is.
Seeds on a feminized plant means it's gone into hermes stage or something no? There was no male plant so no seeds should exist. That's how I understand it. If 0 light is allowed then that was a huge issue for my plants. Their buds were airy, but I understand that to be not enough light or nutrients most of the time. They were 2' going into bloom, where as this clone is less than 1' under LST. I haven't put it in Veg because I don't have a total dark room setup yet and would need to make it more humid as well. I used to watch movies 3hrs after lights out and figured moon light was natural so some turned dim PC monitor wouldn't be that big of a deal.
 

raggyb

Well-Known Member
Seeds on a feminized plant means it's gone into hermes stage or something no? There was no male plant so no seeds should exist. That's how I understand it. If 0 light is allowed then that was a huge issue for my plants. Their buds were airy, but I understand that to be not enough light or nutrients most of the time. They were 2' going into bloom, where as this clone is less than 1' under LST. I haven't put it in Veg because I don't have a total dark room setup yet and would need to make it more humid as well. I used to watch movies 3hrs after lights out and figured moon light was natural so some turned dim PC monitor wouldn't be that big of a deal.
Oh I see. Yeah, maybe the seed came from self pollinating. I'm not sure if it can happen any other way but used to wonder where the occasional seed came from in an all female setting. So you had reason to pick then. On the light, see if it gets you high then. Can you at least try to curtain them off somehow. I'm pretty sure you should. One good thing about being in the same room as where you hang is your breathing puts off a lot of CO2. So at least you got that going for you.
 
My leaves are green at harvest and I don't experience what you are going through
Ok..just thought of this as I read your reply. I already mentioned I dried them upside down and I think it happened way too fast. Because they were super airy buds, they did dry out faster than most, so the instructions for me would have been to hang them for maybe a day, if at all. I'm curious about the swiso I tried. Besides using 70%, when I was boiling it off, it started forming droplets of the black oil, and the amber separated. Not sure what I was getting there, but thought all the black was just chlorophyll waste. I also thought maybe it was RSO, but I think the amber was all the good stuff. It cooled and was like shatter but didn't have a way to really smoke it properly. I'd like to make oil I can smoke next time in my refillable vape pen.
 

BigHornBuds

Well-Known Member
If it smells like hay you dried to fast.
If it’s lite n airy, colder temps & higher humidity will slow down drying,
If it’s lite n airy, your ether not giving it enough light or it’s to hot, or both .
Bulbs don’t last forever and should be changed out, long before they burn out.
STAY OUT OF YOUR ROOM DURING LIGHTS OUT, (sleep less or schedule your time better)
If your ash is black and hard, that’s because
You stopped feeding n flushed , then gave it a bunch of sugar at the end, this went into the bud, you can introduce sugars at the end but you need to really pay attention to the cure, and need a long slow cure to break it down. (I’m playing with this now)

Here is something to read
http://catnews.org/FREE Pot Books/Curing Marijuana.pdf

Turn it into oil, and keep trying
Reading good books will help your learning curve ...
 
If it smells like hay you dried to fast.
If it’s lite n airy, colder temps & higher humidity will slow down drying,
If it’s lite n airy, your ether not giving it enough light or it’s to hot, or both .
Bulbs don’t last forever and should be changed out, long before they burn out.
STAY OUT OF YOUR ROOM DURING LIGHTS OUT, (sleep less or schedule your time better)
If your ash is black and hard, that’s because
You stopped feeding n flushed , then gave it a bunch of sugar at the end, this went into the bud, you can introduce sugars at the end but you need to really pay attention to the cure, and need a long slow cure to break it down. (I’m playing with this now)

Here is something to read
http://catnews.org/FREE Pot Books/Curing Marijuana.pdf

Turn it into oil, and keep trying
Reading good books will help your learning curve ...
THat's awesome. Great reply and it matches most of what I concluded. I gave it molasses (like some thick shit I put on my crepes) the last 2 days - Just because I read that it adds flavor I cut 50 fan leaves in the 3rd week of flower. I always had light leaking after hours. Sometimes up to 4-5hrs past lights out as I would be on my PC (i even hid under a blanket to try and cut the light down lol). I did dry it 5 days upside down and it was airy so it likely was dry in 1/2 a day. It did burn black and super harsh, but I thought this was due to drying it too quickly trapping the chlorophyll. I'm going to cure with 68% humidity packs someone mentioned earlier next time in glass jars. and I think I will sweat my weed vs hanging it. What do you think of that? ALso, I'm vegging without any issues on my 2nd grow - 1 plant vs 2 under a 250W. I'm running about 24-26 degrees and 30% humidity. Plants doing great. No fans either. But I'm going to switch to flower and I think these #s will need to change right...More like 50% humidity and likely a fan on low? It's got 4 large branches in each direction and a few smaller ones underneath growing up. Any other tips here would be appreciated as this one I"m going to baby a little more ha ha. Some of the low small inside leaves I noticed are dried up. I'm assuming that's completely normal and just because the rest of the plant is soaking up the light and nutrients. Currently feeding 2L 6ph water unfiltered and 6ml A&B DNF Grow and 3 drops super thrive. I plan to stop using the ST as of today though and likely won't go higher than 7 or 8ml on the nutrients . Light is about 24" off canopy. Using LST on branches with some string.20180129_223417.jpg
 
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