Plant metabolism & fan leaves

I am currently onto my second hydro SOG (clone straight to flower F&D). The first yield was bang on in quality but I only averaged 1.5kg off 4 x 600w HPS. The setup was fully tuned in without problems but I didn't hit that illusive 1g / watt.

1g / watt is my goal and pulling my hair out trying to figure out how I am gonna get there.

My question is for any Biology clever growers..... even straight from clone to flower gives a finished plant at about 2ft and the amount of foliage may be the issue. If half of fan leaves are stripped, can the plant feed directly from res or does the plant metabolise nutes then transfer to storage in leaves then ship it out for consumption and growth.

If anybody screams...... NO DON'T PULL FAN LEAVES, I swear I will track you down and eat your kidneys.

i rape my plants before going to flower and at days 15 and 36. my yields went up almost 20% and my trimming time went down. i believe that in a well controlled environment that provides everything a plant needs that trimming fans is not detrimental and i have seen no increase in flower time.

Hi guys. Im gona clip some clones and have what is prob a dumb ques. When i take clone should i go ahead and take fan leaf off from site too?

MrMeanGreen said:

I am currently onto my second hydro SOG (clone straight to flower F&D). The first yield was bang on in quality but I only averaged 1.5kg off 4 x 600w HPS. The setup was fully tuned in without problems but I didn't hit that illusive 1g / watt.

1g / watt is my goal and pulling my hair out trying to figure out how I am gonna get there.

My question is for any Biology clever growers..... even straight from clone to flower gives a finished plant at about 2ft and the amount of foliage may be the issue. If half of fan leaves are stripped, can the plant feed directly from res or does the plant metabolise nutes then transfer to storage in leaves then ship it out for consumption and growth.

If anybody screams...... NO DON'T PULL FAN LEAVES, I swear I will track you down and eat your kidneys.

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Hey misterMean Green.....

My experience with fan leaf removal........It all depends on the strain....I grow a real bushy Indica right now and I pick fans off everyday other wise the leaf production would get out of control.....

I have grown other strains that I don't have to trim any fans off.....The strains that grow fast and stretch real good don't need any fan leaf removal is my experience.....

I will post a pic of the Indica I pick fans off everyday and you will see it doesn't seem to hurt them any....IMO......nitro....

superstoner1 said:

i rape my plants before going to flower and at days 15 and 36. my yields went up almost 20% and my trimming time went down. i believe that in a well controlled environment that provides everything a plant needs that trimming fans is not detrimental and i have seen no increase in flower time.

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I suppose I got to ask what light to weight ratios your hitting to give your experience / info some credability so to speak. Also "Rape" is an open quantity, one mans rape is another mans 4 play. Can you expand on rape.

nitro harley said:

Hey misterMean Green.....

My experience with fan leaf removal........It all depends on the strain....I grow a real bushy Indica right now and I pick fans off everyday other wise the leaf production would get out of control.....

I have grown other strains that I don't have to trim any fans off.....The strains that grow fast and stretch real good don't need any fan leaf removal is my experience.....

I will post a pic of the Indica I pick fans off everyday and you will see it doesn't seem to hurt them any....IMO......nitro....

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Nice plants, could snuggle up in them big fluffy ladies. Is that box of leaf just from 1 trimming?

i started this a long time ago, around harvest # 7-8 and now at 100. it is something that i do every time to every one of my 14 strains. i start at the top and remove any fan that blocks light. plain and simple. my plants never show signs of stress from it and the lower buds get much more light. i run a 12 plant perpetual, so every three weeks i put 12 plants into flower room with 36 total under 3000w and i harvest 36-42oz every three weeks.

MrMeanGreen said:

Nice plants, could snuggle up in them big fluffy ladies. Is that box of leaf just from 1 trimming?

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The box of leaf trim is over a period of 4-5 weeks.......I will pick a leaf off here and there, not all at once.........nitro..

superstoner1 said:

i started this a long time ago, around harvest # 7-8 and now at 100. it is something that i do every time to every one of my 14 strains. i start at the top and remove any fan that blocks light. plain and simple. my plants never show signs of stress from it and the lower buds get much more light. i run a 12 plant perpetual, so every three weeks i put 12 plants into flower room with 36 total under 3000w and i harvest 36-42oz every three weeks.

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That's some pretty good production......I can't have anymore than 6 plants blooming at any one time.....I use 4000w for 6 plants....and if all goes well I will get 40/50+ Oz's.........and that will take me 14/15 weeks to achieve that......keep up the good work........nitro...

i think the key is not all at once. leaves fall off in nature due to weather, insects, animals, disease, whatever. they usually don't fall off all at once. trimming everything back doesn't seem ideal. when i did this, everything stalled for about 3 days, then picked back up again. i will say that the fan leaves (for silver haze, sativa) accounted for about 80% of the daily water and nute consumption, so if you're having problems with volatile pH, ppms, water level, etc., maybe reduce some of the biomass by plucking the bigger fan leaves. it will help to stabilize your system.

things did get crazy after that (swollen calyxes, trich production, new pistils), but i can't say definitively that it was from the pruning. it could've just be "that" time. i will say that lack of fan leaves doesn't seem to have slowed things down at all (after the initial stress). the lower growth is getting a lot more light penetration and seeing a lot more growth. in previous grows with a heavy canopy of fan leaves, lower growth just stopped growing.

i'm almost sure i saw a RIU post/journal in which someone did a side-by-side controlled experiment. i believe the pruned plants had smaller buds, but more of them (from the lower stuff that would've never seen the light of day). the unpruned plants produced bigger buds, but fewer of them. if i remember correctly, yield and potency was nearly equal for the control group and the experimental group. and, yes, i'm sure your mileage may vary depending on strain and setup.

so if you want a few big fat colas, i suppose not pruning is the way to go. if you want more buds with a smaller but more consistent size, then pruning is probably the way to go. i'm still undecided. hoping to get a consistent batch of clones next time to do my own experiments.

Last grow I got 4lb 5.25oz dry bud out of 6 plants in hydro set up under 2 1000w HPS and every day when doing the normal tending I'd do a super-crop pinch here and there where needed and I'd pluck any light blocking fan leaves while I was at it and I never noticed any added bloom time or ill effects on the plant. I use my judgment on the strain as to pluck or not, some strains have massive amounts of huge fan leaves and need to be plucked...some don't. I'm a firm believer in plucking them when doing hydro. The plants don't have to seek out any nutes they are bathing in them so I see no added stresses from plucking IMO when doing hydro..now dirt on the other hand I tend to be a bit more Conservative with the plucking.

I pluck a couple handfuls almost every time I open my tent.

So plucking fan leaves on well veged plants seem to cause no problems, what about in a SOG. I veg for litterally 2-3 days to give roots time to work down to the flood level. I have 28 plants under each light, can anyone chirp in who has worked in similar conditions and likes a good pluck. You boys with the bigger palnts have plenty of leaf reserve so to speak where as my finished plants are only 2ft tall.

MaineWeed said:

Last grow I got 4lb 5.25oz dry bud out of 6 plants in hydro set up under 2 1000w HPS and every day when doing the normal tending I'd do a super-crop pinch here and there where needed and I'd pluck any light blocking fan leaves while I was at it and I never noticed any added bloom time or ill effects on the plant. I use my judgment on the strain as to pluck or not, some strains have massive amounts of huge fan leaves and need to be plucked...some don't. I'm a firm believer in plucking them when doing hydro. The plants don't have to seek out any nutes they are bathing in them so I see no added stresses from plucking IMO when doing hydro..now dirt on the other hand I tend to be a bit more Conservative with the plucking.

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I did a soil SCROG and pulled a fair few fan leaves as well as lollipopping, the little sweet leaves production went nuts and the buds weren't huge. Great for making oil but the weed itself was decidely average.

MrMeanGreen said:

So plucking fan leaves on well veged plants seem to cause no problems, what about in a SOG. I veg for litterally 2-3 days to give roots time to work down to the flood level. I have 28 plants under each light, can anyone chirp in who has worked in similar conditions and likes a good pluck. You boys with the bigger palnts have plenty of leaf reserve so to speak where as my finished plants are only 2ft tall.

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I agree that is very true......I don't pluck much when they are smaller..........nitro..

nitro harley said:

I agree that is very true......I don't pluck much when they are smaller..........nitro..

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^X's 2....yeah I agree when they are smaller it seems they are more apt to be effected by any messing around.

I don't know why everybody is talking about fan leaves in relation to nutrient uptake. Aside from storage and providing the osmotic process, they have very little to do with nutrient uptake. They do, however, have a lot to do with photosynthesis, which is something you don't want to mess with. Personally, I tuck my leaves.