Photoperiod for Larger Yields

Good stuff.

Im starting to get the urge to bail and run off with my tail between my legs. Hey Gypsy why dont u try it first and if it works well for you, ill give it a whirl. Hehe

I really doubt anyone could fool Ma Nature unless perhaps they deducted 3 minutes a night, as the average day length shortens in reality. I've tried most timing schemes in my 30+ years inside and it ends up just making the whole growing experience more difficult and prone to confusion. I don't believe it's likely one will increase harvest by enough to make the mental investment worthwhile. I suppose it's something to do while you're waiting, IF you're only growing a couple of plants.
Believe me . . . I wish I could report magical results, but nothing comes to mind.

I'll try a tray with 6 clones... but I will figure out new math so that the cycle lasts 7 days instead of 5 ...

They will go fom 24/0 to whatever/12... constant from start to finish...

It won't be until I get home in a couple of months... I refuse to waste flowering space in my hotel room... lol...

I'll post here when the time comes...

Till next time...

Be Well...

Gypsy...

Hotel? how do yo pulll that one off?

I think the 7 day would be 12/12.. haha

Why are you guys still talking about this? Techhead420 told you that less than 12 hours of light per day will result in less THC produced. He only cited the page number in Marijuana Botany for you to read. So here it is, like I've copied in threads on this board for years:

Marijuana Botany said:

Research has shown (Valle et al. 1978 ) that twice as much THC is produced under a 12-hour photoperiod than under a 10-hour photoperiod.

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(emphasis added)

Therefore, I give my plants as much light as I can give them, while keeping them in flowering.

HTH

flipsidesw said:

I think the 7 day would be 12/12.. haha

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isn't 100% of 100... 347??????

Sheeessh, this smoke must better than I thought.... ROLMAO at my own stupidity....

flipsidesw said:

Hotel? how do yo pulll that one off?

Click to expand...

Well, I have been here since Feb., when I mangled my leg...

Because of that, I have an abnormal amount of personal stuff in my room...

It was easy to convince management that it would better for them if I did my own cleaning... thus avoiding any potential ... miss understandings...

They loved the idea of not being responsible for my stuff...

I keep them small, micro if you will... at 5 weeks of flowering, the biggest one is 5 inches tall and 12 inches wide...

Take a peek at my sig... lots of pics ...

See you guys when I figure out exactly how many hours are in eleventeen days.... LOL

potroast said:

Why are you guys still talking about this? Techhead420 told you that less than 12 hours of light per day will result in less THC produced. He only cited the page number in Marijuana Botany for you to read. So here it is, like I've copied in threads on this board for years:




(emphasis added)

Therefore, I give my plants as much light as I can give them, while keeping them in flowering.

HTH

Click to expand...

Hi Potroast... we are actually talking about more than 12 hours of light per 12 hours of dark... like 20 light /12 dark...

Any thoughts on that?

Yes, my thoughts are exactly as has already been mentioned, that while it may increase yield some, but not potency, it's not worth the time. In the extra time that it takes for that crop to ripen, I can have another crop almost halfway through flowering.

HTH

OK... like Flip said... maybe it's time...

"Im starting to get the urge to bail and run off with my tail between my legs."

Thanks everyone... but if I do do it... I'll make sure to post it...

Gypsy...

No, any longer than 14/10 and the plant may not flower too well, but nothing near 10/14 will cause it to re-enter veg.. And the flowering hormone is triggered by dark period length, not light period..
Basically you're torturing your plant, breaking down its mental faculties its more impressionable to brain washing.. (Torture 101 obviously).. Then you let it rebuild physically for a week under relatively stress free conditions.. Then you tell it that if it wants its kids to survive its really gotta start producing FAST! Then finally, after a week of this, when the thing is in the routine of just breaking its back for 10hrs/day to reproduce, you trick it into working that hard for an extra two hours..
If plants ever unionize, we're screwed..

potroast said:

Yes, my thoughts are exactly as has already been mentioned, that while it may increase yield some, but not potency, it's not worth the time. In the extra time that it takes for that crop to ripen, I can have another crop almost halfway through flowering.

HTH

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Potroast, yeah, I totally get it... especially the part about another crop being halfway done...

If doing anything other than just one batch, it will plug your whole op...

And that you burn more electricity...

And the yield won't nearly make up for the difference...

But I am still curious... and soon I will be 100% steam powered... so electricity is a benefit of the fact that my wood stove does not go out for 9 months of the year... and the other 3 months average 19 hours of sunlight everyday....

Plus, born just showed up with a bunch of stuff I've yet to decipher...

Hey man... one of the main reasons I would like to research this further is due to the fact that I live in the Arctic, and we get a lot of changes in light cycles.... very unnatural to someone in a lower latitude... yet we adapt and thrive... and also I'm a dumb ass with nothing better to do... for now, I'll be walking good again in a few months...

Respect...

born2killspam said:

No, any longer than 14/10 and the plant may not flower too well, but nothing near 10/14 will cause it to re-enter veg.. And the flowering hormone is triggered by dark period length, not light period..
Basically you're torturing your plant, breaking down its mental faculties its more impressionable to brain washing.. (Torture 101 obviously).. Then you let it rebuild physically for a week under relatively stress free conditions.. Then you tell it that if it wants its kids to survive its really gotta start producing FAST! Then finally, after a week of this, when the thing is in the routine of just breaking its back for 10hrs/day to reproduce, you trick it into working that hard for an extra two hours..
If plants ever unionize, we're screwed..

Click to expand...

Ok Born... here we go... I was ready to walk away... but you had to confuse the shit out of me even more... so you better stick around now... 'cause there's a few questions coming your way....LOL...

First of all, who are you answering "no" to??????? and what was the question??? (prob. mine.......lol)

So ok, we established that it needs at least 12 hours of dark for flowering hormone production... I can buy that...

And you also pose that anything with more than 12 hours of dark will not cause the plant to reverse to vegging... on a 24 hour day, I agree...

...but what if we gave her 20 hours of light, followed by 12 hours of dark...?
Would that cause to re-vegg??? as I read what you wrote, the answer is no... because as long as it is getting 12 hours of dark, there will be hormones being produced, which will keep it flowering...

From there bro... I lost you... I do understand all of the words that you wrote, but there is a lot lost in your meaning... sorry...

So you start the plant on 12/12... then switch to 10 light and 14 dark 10/14... so the plant freaks out ... Oh my god I'm gonna die... so it's working faster to mature the bud...?(if it were pollinated, the hurry would be for seeds?)

and when it is established in that schedule, you give it 12/12... and supposedly it will keep working just as hard as when it was under 10/14... but now for 2 extra hours...

I'm sorry man... along with the 39 screws in my leg, there is also a whole pharmacy of shit that makes me a little slow sometimes... and I'm stoned.... and I'm dumb too, let's be realll.. lol....

But that is basically what you described, eh?!

Do you do this yourself?

I understand the mechanics of this... and I see how it might work...

But this is still not what I am thinking...

So here is another question... If a plant is kept indoors it's whole life, does it know that there are 24 hours in a day?

Like encoded information in it's DNA that tells it "You are on Planet Earth"?

I can see it having info like... "you need "X" amount of dark to flower"... but I am not sure what all is there or not...

Every one makes reference to the 24 hour day, because that is what we know... and that is normal... but I am not normal... never been... and hopefully never will....

I guess my head is always out in space... and my imagination is always questioning reality...

What if ... I know I know...

What if we get away from that 24 hour cycle that enslaves us...

What if there were 27 hours in a day???? or 37 for that matter...

Indoors, we control the environment... we can modify how many hours in a day...

We've established that we need 12 hours of dark...

but what is the ratio of light and dark that will keep it flowering, while receiving unnatural amounts of light....?

If a plant is on a 24/0 schedule and we switch it to 20/12, will it flower?? slower? faster? is there a difference?

Someone mentioned it is possible to have too long a light period without extra CO2, but then, let's introduce the CO2 it needs in order to process that much more food... what now... is the photo period still too long??? for what reason???

I know, I am way too stupid o answer these questions... but I am going to research, but in theory and practical experiments.... there might be a place for this technique in my food garden as well...

So... before I get kicked out for making such a long post about something with so little importance to everybody... lol... I'll get out of here and circulate a bit....

Thanks!

Gypsy...

maybe even 24/24..... ok I'll STFU now....lol...

Ok, I was answering 'No...' to the notion that veg-cycle could occur when there is more than 12 hours uninterupted darkness.. The rant about torture, and conditioning was a hypothetical rundown of Dazed76's extreme shock flowering switch.. I've never done that, nor have I known anybody to do anything that extreme, but I have seen ppl play with parts of his technique with impressive results..
Plants don't necessarily need 12hrs of dark to flower, thats just a nice round guarantee.. This fact is evident in the fact that most outdoor growers see buds starting around mid August when there is still up to almost 14hrs of light in northern growing areas.. The budding outdoors typically isn't as explosive as it is indoors with a 12/12 instant switch, but speeds up as time goes on.. Its a hormone driven thing, light period defines the balance.. I have seen 11/13 cause more explosive initial budding, but I have not seen anybody revert that to 12/12 after the fact.. Logically you could atleast steal the extra production seen by the 2 extra hours of light given to the plant while its hormones are correcting themselves to 12/12.. Thats far from instantaneous as anybody whose ever reverted to veg will attest..
I know extreme shock of 48hrs dark at the end of flowering can throw the plant in a tailspin to produce as much as it can as fast as it can, Dazed76's claim seems to be that this can happen early too.. (The concepts seem to similar to not compare them)..
Regarding the light saturation, that is intensity dependant too.. Basically photosynthesis doesn't start off full speed in the morning at all, but speeds up as light gets more and more electrons elevated in energy.. In really bright conditions though, the process can get up into red-line territory though when there isn't enough CO2/Water/Nutes etc to use the energy as it should be used, and it ends up getting used in ways it shouldn't..
I have a really detailed pdf on Photosynthesis(I), (II), and the Calvin-Bensen cycle.. Those concepts are mainly from that.. I'd post the text directly if my pdf reader supported text capture, but it doesn't.. The file is about 1.2MB (30pgs), if you're up for a 'really' hardcore biochem read then let me know a good way to get you the file..

Got this from another forum not sure if its a repost but here you go:

dj short says (about lighting )

" After many years of first-hand experience breeding herb indoors as well as outdoors, I am of the opinion that the two most influential factors involving phenotypic variation and expression among current indoor herb breeding projects are the photoperiod (hours of light per day) and the angle of light in relationship to the growing plant.

Specifically, I find the single most powerful influence to the Indica dominant phenotype is the traditional 18/6 veggie cycle and 12/12 flowering cycle. The 18/6 veggie and 12/12 flower cycle is an attempt, however poor, to mimic the Indica-producing photoperiod. It is my belief that this light cycle strongly influences for Indica phenotypic expression.

Sativa phenotype characteristics will manifest under a more equatorial photoperiod, closer to a 13/11 veggie cycle and an 11/13 flower cycle. This is the light timing range to use to elicit more Sativa dominant expression from your plants.

As for the exact photoperiod formula that I incorporate into my growing/breeding regime, this will presently remain a trade secret. My advice is to experiment with different photoperiods, keep good notes and pay attention. Avoid the 18/6 and 12/12 photoperiods, while tweaking the times a bit differently with each breeding cycle until more desirable results in the finished product and their offspring are noted. Heres a hint: work in half-hour increments or a little less, and good luck! "

hi hi. im not an advanced grower by any stretch of the imagination and still make novice mistakes on occassion, but remember some of what i've read over the years and have had a couple three good indoor gardens over the years.... here's my two cents:

I don't got 24 On (vegging), i usually use like 18-20 On just because i've heard that plants like a little rest period and that growth difference between 18 to 24 isn't terribly significant, except that it can save significant costs on electricity.

For flowering i would never piss around with trying to mimic the 'changing of seasons' of Mother Nature, i just jump right to 12/12 or even 11/13. I've heard that indica vs. sativa can make one of these more advisable, but i forget which for which ... I DO go up to about 6 weeks of age before increasing the day period to 13 or even 14 hours On and 10 or 11 hours Off. Once again, I've heard that you can get away with this more so with Indicas (i believe) than Sativas. Yes it increases yield but at the expense of a longer flowering period. The question is, is the space needed? Or do you have time to eek some more out of the current crop. I am deffinitely going to try this 48-72 hour of darkness thing just prior to harvest, sounds intriguing.

As far as the whole... can we increase the daylight during flower period Query so long as the darkness stays at 12 hours when it comes: its my understanding that the 12 hours is needed to acheive sufficient hormone levels... but that these hormone will continue to decrease once the light comes back on... untill darkness comes again. Meaning the period between dark periods is also just as important when trying to trigger flowering. Which is why i'd wait until at least 5 1/2 weeks before upping the light cycle even a half hour or hour.

Also, as most already know I am sure, the age of the plant (as counted back to the real mothers age) will significantly affect how much darkness is required before flowering is triggered. A month old plant might well enough with a 12/12... but a 6 month old plant will probably start to flower just as quickly at 10off/14on because it is much more ready to do so.

These 'ideas' are somewhat my opinions but mostly just what the 'general knowledge' seems to be from the various sources that i have read.

I never here people here talk about it... but I was watching a video on youtube by I think it was delta-9 seeds, (not sure some seed breeder) and they gave you a tour of their place, and they said the last week or so they leave the lights on for 24 hours... I wouldnt do this... but it was a seed bank man! and they do it... so maybe something to it... I'll try and get the link!

here it is!!!!
I was mistaken, he said 14 hours light not 24 and its THC seeds
YouTube - THC Seeds - How To Grow Marijuana (1of4)
YouTube - THC Seeds - How To Grow Marijuana (2of4)
YouTube - THC Seeds - How To Grow Marijuana (3of4)
YouTube - THC Seeds - How To Grow Marijuana (4of4)
he says it about 1:45 in the 4th part!

I can understand giving a plant long dark periods to induce budding, but continuing to give less than 12 hours of light a day seems madness- "the more light the better",
so long as it is not enough to return the plant to vegetative growth. as far as i know some strains can be given 13 or 14 hours of light throughout flowering (increasing incrementally) to give it an extra few hours of light energy. But also keep in mind that an indoor plant in the last two weeks of flowering can be placed outdoors to finish under bright summer light (to free up space in the growroom, and your HPS can't beat the sun!). at this late in the game it wont be able to revert before harvest.

all reducing light will do is make the plant finish quicker its a natural process as the days get shorter