Oxygen generator vs air stone? Concepts and DIY approaches.

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fancythat

Member

New Technology Dissolved Oxygen Micro Nano Bubble Generator - Buy Dissolved Oxygen,Nano Bubble Generator,Micro Nano Bubble Generator Product on Alibaba.com

New Technology Dissolved Oxygen Micro Nano Bubble Generator - Buy Dissolved Oxygen,Nano Bubble Generator,Micro Nano Bubble Generator Product on Alibaba.com
www.alibaba.com

Searching for a review would be wise, I'm not as concerned about reviews of their products as I am in the engineering/design of the product. Just like anything else I buy, seldom is someone elses experience the contributing factor to my purchase. Most often poor reviews are people using something incorrectly. That being said, I have spent 100s of thousands on chinese manufactured products and have had much more positive experiences than negative.
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
start a journal when you get it set up. i'd love to see a side by side comparison with a waterfall equipped dwc.
 
G

grass_fish

Active Member
fancythat said:
grass_fish, do you have any information you can share about your design? I'm currently talking to a company from china making these. Its about 2000usd for a system with an oxygen concentrator.
Click to expand...
Be careful, very careful. alot of bull out there. I have found great product on Ali but the Nano guys have been very careful to protect their products from theft. From my experiences Silicone with tiny holes does not make "nano" bubbles. I was able to see first hand the Gaia water system and was shown the outcome along with the requirements to use the product. I have alot more information but it is not all mine to share. It is not a flashy product with a sticker on the box. It requires a understanding of how to set up o2 or co2 systems along with other basic mechanical abilities.

Yes there are large US based farms using Gaia. I cant share everything I know as most sources of information are very very competitive and private. It is this competition and privacy that has slowed the sharing of this info/ knowledge.
I know of a fewish large companys/LPs that are now testing the use of Nano bubbles. Not sure how I know this but I know this.

The chiller kept the water at 74.f and the plants flew. As for Nano bubbles I am sure the system works and has value.

Even YouTube has open info.
Moleaer uses o2 tanks and as far as I know they still don't offer O2 concentrators. The concentrator is a whole other area to concern yourself with. For the most part any concentrator you use will not put out pure 100% o2. I prefer the 02 concentrator to tanks and if you look around you will find people doubling them up.

Send a e mail to these guys if you want to know what I am using. https://gaiawater.com/. Again they dont know I am sharing this and you cant get a deal becasue you mentioned my name or the name of any site. This is not a advert or anything like that.

I will attach a pic of my little 5l o2 Concentrator. I am running their smallest system and using a 55 gallon container as the res. I have been playing with hydro systems for years and one year with this Nano system. I prefer to push all the limits and see what can be done.
 

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F

fancythat

Member
grass_fish said:
Be careful, very careful. alot of bull out there. I have found great product on Ali but the Nano guys have been very careful to protect their products from theft. From my experiences Silicone with tiny holes does not make "nano" bubbles. I was able to see first hand the Gaia water system and was shown the outcome along with the requirements to use the product. I have alot more information but it is not all mine to share. It is not a flashy product with a sticker on the box. It requires a understanding of how to set up o2 or co2 systems along with other basic mechanical abilities.

Yes there are large US based farms using Gaia. I cant share everything I know as most sources of information are very very competitive and private. It is this competition and privacy that has slowed the sharing of this info/ knowledge.
I know of a fewish large companys/LPs that are now testing the use of Nano bubbles. Not sure how I know this but I know this.

The chiller kept the water at 74.f and the plants flew. As for Nano bubbles I am sure the system works and has value.

Even YouTube has open info.
Moleaer uses o2 tanks and as far as I know they still don't offer O2 concentrators. The concentrator is a whole other area to concern yourself with. For the most part any concentrator you use will not put out pure 100% o2. I prefer the 02 concentrator to tanks and if you look around you will find people doubling them up.

Send a e mail to these guys if you want to know what I am using. https://gaiawater.com/. Again they dont know I am sharing this and you cant get a deal becasue you mentioned my name or the name of any site. This is not a advert or anything like that.

I will attach a pic of my little 5l o2 Concentrator. I am running their smallest system and using a 55 gallon container as the res. I have been playing with hydro systems for years and one year with this Nano system. I prefer to push all the limits and see what can be done.
Click to expand...
Awesome man, thank you for your reply. I actually talked to a gaia rep today, just waiting for a quote. He did say that DO levels were night and day differences when using an oxygen concentrator vs atmosphere. What doesn't make sense to me is all the hush hush. He mentioned signing a nda, I've never had any rep mention an nda unless in meetings. If it's so hype then the patent application, if it's still patentable should be sufficient
 
G

grass_fish

Active Member
I have encountered this NDA issue with many new to market materials and products. Sometimes its like pulling teeth to get people to send material. I would ask them directly why the nda, I cant speak for them but I was able to meet them in person (Before Covid). Honest and open people and the product works as they advertised. Ask for a link to the latest podcast they were on. I am sure there are details on that podcast as well.
 
G

grass_fish

Active Member
fancythat said:
grass_fish, do you have any information you can share about your design? I'm currently talking to a company from china making these. Its about 2000usd for a system with an oxygen concentrator.
Click to expand...
Not "my" design. Gaia water makes the unit I bought. Easy to use. The other product I am looking at is the ceramic carbon based product.

Send me a link to the Chinese company, could work but I bought the Gaia system knowing the guy was within my reach. I have had mixed results from China, not always bad, more 50/50 when getting new product that has claims. Gaia water is based in a country that has laws protecting consumers from fraud. I liked the odds. I cant prove Gaia is what I have experienced and I have not set up a comparison. I may do in the future. Don't buy something just becasue I said it worked for me. Do your own research and learn from your own knowledge.

All that said the first time I saw o2 systems using cavitation was in china for fish farming.
 
G

grass_fish

Active Member
What I can prove is the machine I bought from Gaia increases the o2 in the water. The Gaia unit does not white cloud the water with micro bubbles. The water stays mostly clear. I check it with a Hanna instrument that is independent of Gaia water. Lots to learn but if you just do the basics its not long before you are up and running. I attached a crappy pic so you get an idea. The spray coming out of the unit is white but the whole res is not clouded. I have my assumtions as to why but I am not an authority on this.

It does however create a microwave effect. I am now used to the plants growing faster and not having to worry about the temp the way I once did. So far no pyth. and no bad slime. You can get white slime if you dump in the wrong goop, I tried it all. A product made by some "doctor" makes instant white slime, funny to watch. Microbial mass worked well with it. The issue is you cannot walk away like with soil. Three days can mean hours of catch up work in a medical sized grow.

Honestly I think the greatest difference is with soil growers. I have seen roses that were crazy big and grew fast relative to normal soil. I know the inventor of the Gaia unit is a all natural kind of grower and not into sterile grows. He built it for soil. I no longer run sterile but can run basic GH, no need for Hygrozyme.

I have a local guy who I built a tote system for and he is willing to do a side by side when the unit is free...Some time in May.

The picture provided is a small 55 gallon container that has the surface water moving fast, almost imposible to get this shot. IMG_0041.JPG
 
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G

grass_fish

Active Member
fancythat said:

New Technology Dissolved Oxygen Micro Nano Bubble Generator - Buy Dissolved Oxygen,Nano Bubble Generator,Micro Nano Bubble Generator Product on Alibaba.com

New Technology Dissolved Oxygen Micro Nano Bubble Generator - Buy Dissolved Oxygen,Nano Bubble Generator,Micro Nano Bubble Generator Product on Alibaba.com
www.alibaba.com

Searching for a review would be wise, I'm not as concerned about reviews of their products as I am in the engineering/design of the product. Just like anything else I buy, seldom is someone else's experience the contributing factor to my purchase. Most often poor reviews are people using something incorrectly. That being said, I have spent 100s of thousands on Chinese manufactured products and have had much more positive experiences than negative.
Click to expand...
I noticed many units produce more micro bubbles when they try and produce Nano Bubbles. The unit you linked to does more micro than nano bubbles. I cant however say if the final goal is not reached or if it is better or worse. I also think the chinese unit is much bigger, less versatile. The Gaia unit can be picked up in one hand and moved from tank to tank. In 5 min I can switch my setup from o2 to run co2.
 
M

MrRv

Member
Sorry for reviving this post, has anyone tried putting an emitter inside the reservoir and air stones right underneath each plant?
I guess that's what I'll try soon with a R-DWC system. Seems like good combo, plus I can ventilate the reservoir with some simple 5cm fans to get rid of the excessive hydrogen to avoid and imaginary explosion which will never happen from a 100L reservoir...
 
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rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
MrRv said:
Sorry for reviving this post, has anyone tried putting an emitter
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not to turn you off, but this post was 5 years old. if these emitters were really that great, they'd be way more popular and many commercial grows would use them by now.

but if you try them, start a grow journal here.
 
C

cfstan85

Member
J Henry said:
I’ll bite! Interesting thread…

Why do you really think you need more DO, do you know your DO is too low or just want more DO because more DO sounds good? There is probably no more than 1 out of 1,000 growers that ever have root rot and fungal infestations caused by low DO’s. At least that theme seems to be quiet consistent on forums, no fungi problems, never in 20 years of DWC pot grows.

If the cost is too high for you up front, this supplemental oxygenating device will never be a viable option for you regardless of any reason you want it. No disrespect intended. Like having a knock-out looking woman for a wife, you lover her, but you cannot afford her ways and the relationship is doomed to failure, but the Judge says you will pay child support and alimony at the end of the road at the Court House. That’s another one of life’s torturous adventures that cost too much, was not affordable and we bought it anyway.

But first, why do you think you need supplemental oxygen, have you ever tested, measured your DO to determine if you DO is low, unsafe to root balls and Bennies? 2nd if you have actually tested your DO and found that it is low and unsafe and you need a higher DO that is within the “safe range, well you may need supplemental oxygen? 3rd, just how much money are you prepared to pay/invest in supplemental oxygen equipment that insures a continuous supply of O2 24/7 for months during the grow season that will insure a continuous “safe DO range?” Just wondering why, that’s all.

Electrolysis of water (O2Grow) does produce pure 100% O2, but the hidden, never spoken issue is… just how much 100% O2 gas does the O2Grow electrolysis oxygenator really produce when the electrolysis generator is in the “on cycle.” It produces no O2 in the “off cycle.” Is the cost and H2 explosion hazard worth the benefit you hope for?

Actually there are far better supplemental oxygen technologies available than electrolysis of water if you’re interested in or need to increase your Dissolved Oxygen saturation greater than the limitations and restrictions of ambient air and or O2Grow technology limitations. O2 Grow does have some serious limitations other than producing 2 X as much Hydrogen gas, an explosive gas.

Oxygen (elemental O2 gas) is not ambient air and unlike air, O2 gas is not free. Supplemental O2 gas technology will cost you a few bucks.
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I’m definitely interested in other ways to help increase my DO. Can you give me a list or some links? Right now, all I use is an airstone, and was looking into electrolysis, but don’t like the amount of hydrogen that it can produce. I know it’s 7 years since this has been posted, so I hope you still get notifications on this.
 
Drop That Sound

Drop That Sound

Well-Known Member
O2 grow is still in business, after all these years. I take it no one has died from explosions, or from toxic byproduct poisonings? :cool:
 
Drop That Sound

Drop That Sound

Well-Known Member
You can split an HHO cell with a membrane, so one side produces the hydrogen, and the other pure oxygen, instead of just mixing both gasses together btw. So, what if you rigged it up so only the oxygen side interacts with the res, and the hydrogen side gets exhausted outside through a tube, or burned off back into water. Would one side create more unwanted byproducts than the other though? Could the membrane help to filter out any toxic contaminates, and keep the oxygen side more clear. Or, would it be vice versa?

1711383076572.png

^ This is more how I imagine a proper hydroponic o2 cell being created, than just tossing a regular stacked plate in the res and making browns gas.
 
C

cfstan85

Member
Drop That Sound said:
You can split an HHO cell with a membrane, so one side produces the hydrogen, and the other pure oxygen, instead of just mixing both gasses together btw. So, what if you rigged it up so only the oxygen side interacts with the res, and the hydrogen side gets exhausted outside through a tube, or burned off back into water. Would one side create more unwanted byproducts than the other though? Could the membrane help to filter out any toxic contaminates, and keep the oxygen side more clear. Or, would it be vice versa?

View attachment 5380817

^ This is more how I imagine a proper hydroponic o2 cell being created, than just tossing a regular stacked plate in the res and making browns gas.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, I’m not a chemist, so I don’t know if that would work. In my mind it would. But I’m not 100% sure.
 
Drop That Sound

Drop That Sound

Well-Known Member
If what the O2 grow guys say.. about having their "super special" patented plates stacked apart from each other at the perfect specs (which helps mitigate otherwise toxic gasses from being formed), then I guess I got my answer if it's really true.. A split cell wouldn't really work like that, afaik. They would be spread a lot further apart than what they claim to be the sweet spot. Not sure how you could fit any kind of membrane between the plates that close together...
 
C

cfstan85

Member
Drop That Sound said:
If what the O2 grow guys say.. about having their "super special" patented plates stacked apart from each other at the perfect specs (which helps mitigate otherwise toxic gasses from being formed), then I guess I got my answer if it's really true.. A split cell wouldn't really work like that, afaik. They would be spread a lot further apart than what they claim to be the sweet spot. Not sure how you could fit any kind of membrane between the plates that close together...
Click to expand...
You would have to make the container divided in some way, and have the wall a rubber membrane (which would also be a challenge to figure out). I’m thinking about trying a way using screws, to see how true the toxicity issue would be. I don’t know, yet, how I’d measure the toxicity levels in the water. But I’m sure there’s a test kit you can get. Or even send the water into your local water facility. I believe mine does free testing for toxins and metals.
 
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