Our Six Year Old Is Transgender.

M

mooray

Well-Known Member
If you could allow me to fall into the, "just have honest questions" category, I do have a couple...

Six being very young, most often too young to make such a definitive determination imo, how have you been able to differentiate between kids-being-kids, showing signs of being transgender, and being definitively transgender?

Whatever the signs were that has brought you to today, I'm curious to know about your response, as well as the response of your SO. I feel like the best response would be to not overreact, not give the impression of being for/against anything, but kind of ride this line of being neutral, yet supportive. How would you describe your response throughout?
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
Romulanman said:
Is this your child by birth or adopted? I'm kinda surprised at the age but not really. Was this something that was brought to your attention by your child? Its hard to think about a 6 yr old having these kinds of thots but what do I know? I didn't grow up with the internet and a phone in my hand.
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Birth. Yeah, so were we. This was not something we took lightly. Not at all. Far from it. She is a very intelligent child and was able to express her thoughts and feelings with a clarity, sincerity and consistency that forced us to take her seriously after about two years. The shit we heard would probably change anybody's mind if they went through it. It was pretty easy to see how it could turn to massive depression and suicidal thoughts as it does for so many transgender kids. She told us that her birth name, a male name, seemed like a stranger to her and began to exhibit some pretty startling depressive thoughts and some serious acting out. There's a lot more to the story. We lived it for a couple of years. We took the step of officially acknowledging it with a whole lot of trepidation knowing the shitstorm that she was wading into. Additionally, who the hell knows what a 4-5 year old is up to? Could it just be a phase? Oh hell yeah, but at a certain point, you have to assess the welfare of the kid and it was having very negative effects. I'll say this... the kid had absolutely no exposure to this issue. Everything was 100% organic from her own brain. This carried a lot of weight with us.

Just a little over a year ago, we sat down and talked it out. She chose a new name and we now treat her as a girl. Don't get me wrong, you change her clothes and ignore her name and you wouldn't know that she isn't a boy, or a girl - she's just a kid. Things have gotten better since then but there are continual problems with bullying and abuse by children and adults - literally all of them under the reasoning of their idea of christianity.

What does the future hold? Who knows? We'll be waiting to see. She's in a private school that respects her choice but it cannot protect her from the things that other kids parents are saying to them and it will have a lot more impact as she gets past kindergarten.

I am especially saddened that my own mother cannot cope with this and refuses to recognize it (ironically, my mom is a closeted self-loathing lesbian who has a long history of anti-gay behavior - if she were more intelligent it would tear her up. Instead she bathes herself clean daily with the word of the lord as expressed by her latest tv evangelist). She asks me all sorts of nonsensical questions that center on gender roles that just fail to make any sense to me. I find it really hard to understand that the woman that raised four children cannot understand that none of this matters to us. All that matters is that this is the very same child that I saw grow in my wife's belly, and that we have both loved more than anything since she was born.

Then I remember that she is a malignant narcissist that has destroyed every relationship she has ever had and thinks that Trump is a good man who god chose to usher us into the end times.
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
mooray said:
If you could allow me to fall into the, "just have honest questions" category, I do have a couple...

Six being very young, most often too young to make such a definitive determination imo, how have you been able to differentiate between kids-being-kids, showing signs of being transgender, and being definitively transgender?

Whatever the signs were that has brought you to today, I'm curious to know about your response, as well as the response of your SO. I feel like the best response would be to not overreact, not give the impression of being for/against anything, but kind of ride this line of being neutral, yet supportive. How would you describe your response throughout?
Click to expand...
I am hoping I answered your questions in the above post. They are good questions that we have spent a considerable time pondering.

There was no neutral possible. Her reaction to being called a boy or addressed by her birth name was extreme and getting worse. I know what you are saying about six year olds (she was four when she really started to articulate herself [she's a real smart kid]) having all sorts of magical thoughts. We spoke to a number of transgender adults about it and asked them when they became aware of their gender. Nearly all of them said they had known it from a very early age and the option of expressing themselves was squelched or just not realistic.

If you had asked me several years ago if there was anything that my kid could say to convince me that they were another gender I would have looked at you like you were feeble and said "no". But here we are.

Reaction of me and my wife? Pretty much ignored it at first. But you can only ignore it so long, especially when faced with what we faced.

Do I hope she changes her mind? You bet your ass I do, but only to spare her from the cruelty of others.

What were our feelings about trans people in general? Very accepting, we know several and have for a long time. We never looked at it as an option for our kid though. It was totally unexpected and we were slow to adapt - as we should be. We are the sort of people who, if our post sexual awareness child came to us and told us he/she was gay, we would have said "that's nice honey". But we didn't count on this. It broke our paradigm.

I just want to point out that trans has nothing to do with sexual preference. We have no idea who our kid is going to be attracted to. We don't really care either.

Edit, she was actually about three and a half when she really started expressing herself.
 
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Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
is there some Karen vid of your neighbor somewhere?
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Nah. This would be the closest. Its real damn close, but she was about 15 years older.


She originally started attacking my kid when my wife was out with our girl, then my wife got into it with her. When I got home, they were out. When they returned I was sitting on their porch waiting. It went off. Police were called. She literally reported me for being of the devil. That poor cop. Let's just say that she never said a word or made eye contact with me until her unfortunate medical setback. She has not returned and it is said that she is in a nursing home. Their house is vacant now. Every now and then I see her husband and kid packing things.
 
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M

mooray

Well-Known Member
It did, thanks, couple of good posts there.

Two more questions...

I know you're always going to worry about your kid, but are you in an area where things are at least...ok....in the trans community, safety-wise?

If not, do you guys lean more towards the "fight" of trying to pave the way so they can live safely, or are you more on the "we gotta get the fuck out of here" side of things?
 
printer

printer

Well-Known Member
A guy that worked in our shop has changed his son's identity to a girl (or whatever you do, I never talked with him about it) and lets her wear and do girl things she wants. It is not like she is a confused teen looking for an identity. He is an amazing parent, the wife not so much, only had the kid because he wanted it. He is one of the nicest, kindest people I have known. What he saw in his wife is a wonder to me, he has chick-magnet good looks. The thing that stopped them from being all over him was he was from a small town.

Seeing the pictures on his desk from before they decided on the change, yeah you can see it in him (her) in the earlier pictures. So what is the big deal? As long as the kid grows up reasonably well adjusted what is it to others? A niece of mine just realized she is better with girls than men at the age of 30. Treated both the live in boyfriends she had well, they were nice guys. She finally brought the girlfriend over to meet the immediate family, dad was a little perturbed to see them share a kiss. She said, "But you felt the same way when you seen me and my boyfriends kiss." I am guessing I will meet her one day. Who really cares, as long as you have loving relationships to help each other get through life.

Have a cousin on the West Coast that has gone through the operation and all. My mother, who was in her 80's, still treated him as a member of the family when he came visiting. She sort of understands but the main thing is (s)he is my mother's sister's child no mater what changes took place. And she will always be family. She is a damn big girl though, nobody at a truck stop better cause a fuss. When she was a he, he did spend a few years in the army. And she is not a gentle flower.
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
printer said:
A guy that worked in our shop has changed his son's identity to a girl (or whatever you do, I never talked with him about it) and lets her wear and do girl things she wants. It is not like she is a confused teen looking for an identity. He is an amazing parent, the wife not so much, only had the kid because he wanted it. He is one of the nicest, kindest people I have known. What he saw in his wife is a wonder to me, he has chick-magnet good looks. The thing that stopped them from being all over him was he was from a small town.

Seeing the pictures on his desk from before they decided on the change, yeah you can see it in him (her) in the earlier pictures. So what is the big deal? As long as the kid grows up reasonably well adjusted what is it to others? A niece of mine just realized she is better with girls than men at the age of 30. Treated both the live in boyfriends she had well, they were nice guys. She finally brought the girlfriend over to meet the immediate family, dad was a little perturbed to see them share a kiss. She said, "But you felt the same way when you seen me and my boyfriends kiss." I am guessing I will meet her one day. Who really cares, as long as you have loving relationships to help each other get through life.

Have a cousin on the West Coast that has gone through the operation and all. My mother, who was in her 80's, still treated him as a member of the family when he came visiting. She sort of understands but the main thing is (s)he is my mother's sister's child no mater what changes took place. And she will always be family. She is a damn big girl though, nobody at a truck stop better cause a fuss. When she was a he, he did spend a few years in the army. And she is not a gentle flower.
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The idea of surgery or hormone treatment is not easy for us. We are doing all we can to foster body acceptance. We are both thankful that we have quite some time before anything needs to be addressed.
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
mooray said:
It did, thanks, couple of good posts there.

Two more questions...

I know you're always going to worry about your kid, but are you in an area where things are at least...ok....in the trans community, safety-wise?

If not, do you guys lean more towards the "fight" of trying to pave the way so they can live safely, or are you more on the "we gotta get the fuck out of here" side of things?
Click to expand...
No, it is very dangerous here. We are planning on moving. I am less worried about her getting beaten up than I am about her getting sexually molested by one of the fine christians around.

Nah, we shall bail. Fuck these people. My wife was from here. I am from a city. This is my in-laws only grandchild and my wife is the youngest of five. Being near the grandparents and establishing a sense of family was our goal. We have pretty much fulfilled that desire. We have no other roots here and I will likely never return after we leave. Frankly, I hope to see a small meteorite hit it from my rear view mirror.

Contrary to my expectations, her parents have adapted. Her father was a tough nut and I know he is not sincere. Her mother is more accepting. They had a choice of having a grandchild or not. There was no halfway. My daughter will not allow anybody to call her a boy - ever.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Unclebaldrick said:
Birth. Yeah, so were we. This was not something we took lightly. Not at all. Far from it. She is a very intelligent child and was able to express her thoughts and feelings with a clarity, sincerity and consistency that forced us to take her seriously after about two years. The shit we heard would probably change anybody's mind if they went through it. It was pretty easy to see how it could turn to massive depression and suicidal thoughts as it does for so many transgender kids. She told us that her birth name, a male name, seemed like a stranger to her and began to exhibit some pretty startling depressive thoughts and some serious acting out. There's a lot more to the story. We lived it for a couple of years. We took the step of officially acknowledging it with a whole lot of trepidation knowing the shitstorm that she was wading into. Additionally, who the hell knows what a 4-5 year old is up to? Could it just be a phase? Oh hell yeah, but at a certain point, you have to assess the welfare of the kid and it was having very negative effects. I'll say this... the kid had absolutely no exposure to this issue. Everything was 100% organic from her own brain. This carried a lot of weight with us.

Just a little over a year ago, we sat down and talked it out. She chose a new name and we now treat her as a girl. Don't get me wrong, you change her clothes and ignore her name and you wouldn't know that she isn't a boy, or a girl - she's just a kid. Things have gotten better since then but there are continual problems with bullying and abuse by children and adults - literally all of them under the reasoning of their idea of christianity.

What does the future hold? Who knows? We'll be waiting to see. She's in a private school that respects her choice but it cannot protect her from the things that other kids parents are saying to them and it will have a lot more impact as she gets past kindergarten.

I am especially saddened that my own mother cannot cope with this and refuses to recognize it (ironically, my mom is a closeted self-loathing lesbian who has a long history of anti-gay behavior - if she were more intelligent it would tear her up. Instead she bathes herself clean daily with the word of the lord as expressed by her latest tv evangelist). She asks me all sorts of nonsensical questions that center on gender roles that just fail to make any sense to me. I find it really hard to understand that the woman that raised four children cannot understand that none of this matters to us. All that matters is that this is the very same child that I saw grow in my wife's belly, and that we have both loved more than anything since she was born.

Then I remember that she is a malignant narcissist that has destroyed every relationship she has ever had and thinks that Trump is a good man who god chose to usher us into the end times.
Click to expand...
The only thing I can suggest is that you try to find a mindful elementary school in your area, there are several organizations that promote this and have extensive programs. The attached site will help you to find one or perhaps promote one in your district.

This can help a lot with both her emotional strength and resilience, and to have a loving empathetic community to learn and flourish in. There are more organizations than this, but this is the largest and there might be a school near you. This can help any child to be happy and flourish and keeps teachers from burning out and inflicting their issues on the children. If you want better citizens, you invest for the long haul, but in this case you don't need to invest much money, just love and caring.

Corinthians 13:4-8
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Have a peek Baldrick, share it with your wife and child and see what they think.
Mindful Schools | Mindfulness for Your School, Teachers, and Students
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
DIY-HP-LED said:
The only thing I can suggest is that you try to find a mindful elementary school in your area, there are several organizations that promote this and have extensive programs. The attached site will help you to find one or perhaps promote one in your district.

This can help a lot with both her emotional strength and resilience, and to have a loving empathetic community to learn and flourish in. There are more organizations than this, but this is the largest and there might be a school near you. This can help any child to be happy and flourish and keeps teachers from burning out and inflicting their issues on the children. If you want better citizens, you invest for the long haul, but in this case you don't need to invest much money, just love and caring.

Corinthians 13:4-8
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Have a peek Baldrick, share it with your wife and child and see what they think.
Mindful Schools | Mindfulness for Your School, Teachers, and Students
Click to expand...
Thanks. I am not associated with a church anymore but was very surprised to find that we have one here with a trans minister. Not only that, but he transitioned while being the minister. Lost half his flock. He has been a good asset. I respect the teaching of Jesus and feel the desire to show my child what Jesus taught rather than letting her be exposed to it by these Trumpian cult members. I think it is important since they are the ones that have the biggest problem with her.

I teach her about Jesus. I teach her about "christians". First I had to teach her what hypocrisy means.

The school is OK but we cannot get past what her classmates' parents believe. We will be leaving before long.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Unclebaldrick said:
Thanks. I am not associated with a church anymore but was very surprised to find that we have one here with a trans minister. Not only that, but he transitioned while being the minister. Lost half his flock. He has been a good asset. I respect the teaching of Jesus and feel the desire to show my child what Jesus taught rather than letting her be exposed to it by these Trumpian cult members. I think it is important since they are the ones that have the biggest problem with her.

I teach her about Jesus. I teach her about "christians". First I had to teach her what hypocrisy means.

The school is OK but we cannot get past what her classmates' parents believe. We will be leaving before long.
Click to expand...
This is secular and evidence based and is professionally implemented and taught. The bible quote was a piece of general wisdom, unrelated to mindful schools, which is not religious at all but psychological and sociological. Have a look at the site then make a value judgement.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Unclebaldrick said:
Thanks. I am not associated with a church anymore but was very surprised to find that we have one here with a trans minister. Not only that, but he transitioned while being the minister. Lost half his flock. He has been a good asset. I respect the teaching of Jesus and feel the desire to show my child what Jesus taught rather than letting her be exposed to it by these Trumpian cult members. I think it is important since they are the ones that have the biggest problem with her.

I teach her about Jesus. I teach her about "christians". First I had to teach her what hypocrisy means.

The school is OK but we cannot get past what her classmates' parents believe. We will be leaving before long.
Click to expand...
I'm an atheist and I do not promote religion, I do promote evidence based things grounded in science. Wisdom can come from many sources, there's even the rare gem in the Bible and much in Buddhism, which is more a systematic mental training and philosophy than a religion. It is a religion to many ethnic Buddhists, but a secular practice to westerners and many of them are scientists. Mindfulness is a western invention and has been stripped of any vestiges of religion or superstition, think of it as ET Emotional training and it works like PE, it too is an exercise.
 
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