Obama signs Monsanto Protection Act

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Don't bother being derogatory towards me, I will not engage slander. As I stated in my first post, GMO products are not labeled you can not vote with your wallet! That was also the point of my second post on this thread that we don't have that choice. My family makes a point of buying non processed foods as much as possible, and eating locally grown organic produces as much as possible. However as these GMO seeds are grown across the world the genetics WILL mix, and there will be no such thing as non GMO and truely natural gardens. Its not even that I feel all GMOs are automatically bad, but they need to be tested and they need to be proven safe over a long term period so that we aren't ending up with an epidemic of problems in 10-15 years. That being said, natural seeds and plants have been feeding people for thousands of years why do we need to screw with something that seems pretty perfect to me in the first place. Selective breeding is one thing, genetic modification, and radiating seeds and stuff like that just doesn't seem very natural to me.

Experiments on plant hybridizationGregor Mendel, who is known as the "father of modern genetics", was inspired by both his professors at the University of Olomouc (i.e. Friedrich Franz & Johann Karl Nestler) and his colleagues at the monastery (e.g., Franz Diebl) to study variation in plants, and he conducted his study in the monastery's 2 hectares (4.9 acres) experimental garden,[SUP][10][/SUP] which was originally planted by Napp in 1830.[SUP][8][/SUP] Between 1856 and 1863 Mendel cultivated and tested some 29,000 pea plants (i.e., Pisum sativum). This study showed that one in four pea plants had purebred recessive alleles, two out of four were hybrid and one out of four were purebred dominant. His experiments led him to make two generalizations, the Law of Segregation and the Law of Independent Assortment, which later became known as Mendel's Laws of Inheritance.
Mendel did read his paper, Versuche über Pflanzenhybriden (Experiments on Plant Hybridization), at two meetings of the Natural History Society of Brünn in Moravia in 1865. It was received favorably and generated reports in several local newspapers.[SUP][11][/SUP] When Mendel's paper was published in 1866 in Verhandlungen des naturforschenden Vereins Brünn,[SUP][12][/SUP] it was seen as essentially about hybridization rather than inheritance and had little impact and was cited about three times over the next thirty-five years. (Notably, Charles Darwin was unaware of Mendel's paper, according to Jacob Bronowski's The Ascent of Man.) His paper was criticized at the time, but is now considered a seminal work.
[h=3][edit] Life after the pea experiments[/h]After completing his work with peas, Mendel turned to experimenting with honeybees to extend his work to animals. He produced a hybrid strain (so vicious they were destroyed, but failed to generate a clear picture of their heredity because of the difficulties in controlling mating behaviours of queen bees.[SUP][dubious – discuss][/SUP] He also described novel plant species, and these are denoted with the botanical author abbreviation "Mendel".
After he was elevated as abbot in 1868, his scientific work largely ended, as Mendel became consumed with his increased administrative responsibilities, especially a dispute with the civil government over their attempt to impose special taxes on religious institutions.[SUP][13][/SUP] Mendel died on January 6, 1884, at the age of 61, in Brno, Moravia, Austria-Hungary (now Czech Republic), from chronic nephritis. Czech composer Leoš Janáček played the organ at his funeral. After his death, the succeeding abbot burned all papers in Mendel's collection, to mark an end to the disputes over taxation
 

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
And when they mix, evolution occurs.

Not exactly end of the world shit.
Its not "end of the world shit" if the genetics don't have problems, its very easily could be "end of the world shit" if the genetics start killing people and animals alike. It also can be a huge problem for the whole world when monsanto gets farmers hooked growing their hybrids and then adds a kill gene so that the farmers have to buy new seed every year at huge expense. Again why are these things getting done in secret if there is nothing wrong?
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
H. R. 933—35
SEC. 735. In the event that a determination of non-regulated status made pursuant to section 411 of the Plant Protection Act is or has been invalidated or vacated, the Secretary of Agriculture shall, notwithstanding any other provision of law, upon request by a farmer, grower, farm operator, or producer,immediately grant temporary permit(s) or temporary deregulation in part, subject to necessary and appropriate conditions consistent with section 411(a) or 412(c) of the Plant Protection Act, which interim conditions shall authorize the movement, introduction, continued cultivation, commercialization and other specifically enumerated activities and requirements, including measures designed to mitigate or minimize potential adverse environmental effects, if any, relevant to the Secretary’s evaluation of the petition for non-regulated status, while ensuring that growers or other users are able to move, plant, cultivate, introduce into commerce and carry out other authorized activities in a timely manner: Provided, That all such conditions shall be applicable only for the interim period necessary for the Secretary to complete any required analyses or consultations related to the petition for non-regulated status: Provided further, That nothing in this section shall be construed as limiting the Secretary’s authority under section 411, 412 and 414 of the Plant Protection Act
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
Its not "end of the world shit" if the genetics don't have problems, its very easily could be "end of the world shit" if the genetics start killing people and animals alike. It also can be a huge problem for the whole world when monsanto gets farmers hooked growing their hybrids and then adds a kill gene so that the farmers have to buy new seed every year at huge expense. Again why are these things getting done in secret if there is nothing wrong?
There is no kill gene, and if they're sterilised how can they pollenate other people's crops?

It's one or the other.

Also, if the genetics are "bad", the plant generally dies.

Do you think they just engineer one "super-plant" and that's it?

You think they do no testing of any kind?
 

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
I didn't say there was a kill gene I said it could be introduced down the road. A kill gene also would not steralize the plants, it would cause the genetics to collapse after x number of generations.

I didn't say anything about one "super-plant" either, or that they didn't do any testing. The testing that is being done is proving that GMOs can cause problems in animals, so until that is resolved yes I am skeptical of the value these bring to the world. What is wrong with the plants that have been being grown for hundreds of years.

And again I emphasis I am not sitting here trying to say all GMOs are automatically bad. I'm saying open your eyes to whats happening behind our backs. They would not be hiding these laws, trying to trick people, and doing their best to keep the truth off the labels of our food. You don't think its fishy that the former exec from monsanto was appointed to a high position on the FDA? I'm sure these guys are totally on the up and up...........just like Eric Holder and the whole fast the the furious bullshit that man belongs in prison!
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
I didn't say there was a kill gene I said it could be introduced down the road. A kill gene also would not steralize the plants, it would cause the genetics to collapse after x number of generations.

I didn't say anything about one "super-plant" either, or that they didn't do any testing. The testing that is being done is proving that GMOs can cause problems in animals, so until that is resolved yes I am skeptical of the value these bring to the world. What is wrong with the plants that have been being grown for hundreds of years.

And again I emphasis I am not sitting here trying to say all GMOs are automatically bad. I'm saying open your eyes to whats happening behind our backs. They would not be hiding these laws, trying to trick people, and doing their best to keep the truth off the labels of our food. You don't think its fishy that the former exec from monsanto was appointed to a high position on the FDA? I'm sure these guys are totally on the up and up...........just like Eric Holder and the whole fast the the furious bullshit that man belongs in prison!
Read the text of the Bill, it's a couple posts up ^^

It merely grants permission to farmers to grow unregulated plants until the plant's final legal determination can be made.

Ahh, the genetically modified sky is falling!!!!!!!!
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
I didn't say there was a kill gene I said it could be introduced down the road. A kill gene also would not steralize the plants, it would cause the genetics to collapse after x number of generations.

I didn't say anything about one "super-plant" either, or that they didn't do any testing. The testing that is being done is proving that GMOs can cause problems in animals, so until that is resolved yes I am skeptical of the value these bring to the world. What is wrong with the plants that have been being grown for hundreds of years.

And again I emphasis I am not sitting here trying to say all GMOs are automatically bad. I'm saying open your eyes to whats happening behind our backs. They would not be hiding these laws, trying to trick people, and doing their best to keep the truth off the labels of our food. You don't think its fishy that the former exec from monsanto was appointed to a high position on the FDA? I'm sure these guys are totally on the up and up...........just like Eric Holder and the whole fast the the furious bullshit that man belongs in prison!
Cite your sources, princess.
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Read the text of the Bill, it's a couple posts up ^^

It merely grants permission to farmers to grow unregulated plants until the plant's final legal determination can be made.

Ahh, the genetically modified sky is falling!!!!!!!!
And, perhaps, in other words, it means, no nut case group can browbeat some old lonely farmer and get a nut case judge to put an injunction on the entire planting season.
 

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
I'm sure non of these sources are valid enough for you, however I'm done with this discussion since your not remotely paying attention to what I've been saying in the first place. You seem to think calling names and hiding your head in the sand of denial will keep the world going around. I never said the sky was falling or that the world was ending read what I write in stead of just assuming you understand what I'm trying to express. :peace: I hope your garden is as green as the fields of GMO corn.
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
And, perhaps, in other words, it means, no nut case group can browbeat some old lonely farmer and get a nut case judge to put an injunction on the entire planting season.
So basically it's to remove the bullshit laws effecting farmers by adding yet more laws.

I love how the legal system works.
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
So basically it's to remove the bullshit laws effecting farmers by adding yet more laws.

I love how the legal system works.
Yeah, it's all woven together and I've come to appreciate it. So, I see it as a refinement in the appropriations bill, to protect farmers, not Monsanto. The Section 735 appears to me to be an improvement or a closing of a loophole in the Plant Protection Act (said loophole, surely put there on purpose, for some purpose, to favor some lobby or other)

And this is how it works. It's wild but tends to balance. But, look how long it took us us to bother to read it. It can't be fair to stop all farmers from planting something just because some focus group thinks there is money to be made. An Injunction. Media Attention. The Entire Planting SeaSON. will be DOOOMMMMED!!

So, if I'm a proud member of the Monsanto family of Agricultural Producers, I'm part of the food chain. I will have entire Sections under till and hundreds of employees.

These are the folks that have the vested interest. Now that old fool down in S. Co. that got took by his relatives and sold out to Mother Jones....he should have read the big bold print when he signed up for Monsanto Corn. Now, Earth First and Sean Penn and the Mugmunp Tribe (tm) are pouring in money, and the Corn futures are going nuts.

Well to avoid all that, the good folks in real Ag spent millions of $$ to stay ahead of the game. They didn't mind if Monsanto took the hit. They probably set is up that way. These giant Ag Associations made up of the Big Guys with their hands in the dirt, and their Lobbies, horse traded the votes across a bunch of States.

735 is in there! This is how it works, not pretty and not bloody; just very expensive with so much at stake. You notice how they never just say Out with the old laws. No, it's all woven and only carefully modified....we hope.
 

Corso312

Well-Known Member
Monsanto created agent orange and DDT, I trust them to put my health and well being over profits when it really comes down to it. ($arcasm)
 

echelon1k1

New Member
So if they "think" something is dangerous they can't ban it without proof...?

Why have you people got such a raging hate boner for Monsanto? Don't buy GM if you don't like it.

Vote with your wallet, crying online holds little real capital.
Monsanto & co have put up millions to make sure that doesn't happen. If everything was safe labelling wouldn't be an issue nor would scientific scrutiny.

Here's a bunch companies that also vote with their wallets to oppose anything that would give consumers more choice. Now they want immunity in federal courts.

If only the tobacco companies thought about that years ago... Do you have warning labels on cigarettes in Ireland yet?

https://www.noprop37.com/donors/

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Doer

Well-Known Member
GHHHHHH!!! I give up. You post this hate spew and call it a reference. And it goes on and on, pages of spews. And the personal dirt on people I don't know, don't care. Then they reference other hate spew, cannabis sites. Long live the silly Hippies.

Any Stephen King novel is more entertaining than this, and I hate wading through Stephen King.

I would be glad to show you how wrong you are if you get me text of the Proposition.

On the Mexico landrace question, more evil hand wringing. No evidence. Just fear. Even the title is a stretch. Considerations to try to detect.

The Constitution protects us from hippies, a point I failed to grasp when I was one.
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Monsanto created agent orange and DDT, I trust them to put my health and well being over profits when it really comes down to it. ($arcasm)
Oh please, fooled by the silly hippies you are. In the late 1950, at Yale, two chemicals were mixed an Agent Orange was created. Arthur W. Galston, a plant biologist, is credited.

And DDT? You didn't make it up, but you swallowed. You've heard of the straw dog, the whipping post, the easy target. Yeah, blame Monsanto like it was the guy across the street??? Funny.

DDT was first made by Othmar Zeidler in 1874. The properties as an insecticide were not discovered until 1939 by a Swiss scientist Paul Hermann Muller. He was awarded the 1948 Nobel Prize in Physiology and Medicine for his efforts. SWISS!

So, when DOD wants something made up in bulk, do they ask the hippies? NO. They contract with large producers like Dow, Monsanto who are Defense Contractors.

Monsanto is public company run by US citizens and WE contracted them for Agent Orange. WE blame ourselves for that, because it is self rule.

I swear if the world was as simple as most can grasp it, we would have no problems. It would all be solved. Just listen to the hippies. :) But, obviously most folks won't admit that the problems are not someone else at fault. Not the "government" the "corporations" All that is false devils. No, we have met the Devil, and it us.

WE the people, run this place. It's ugly. A lot of people just can't watch it, and they don't have to. They are still responsible.
 

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
Doer its amazing how well brainwashed you are. We the people havn't ran this country in a long time, so whether you think I'm passing the blame to the corporations and government or not its true. The politicians with the aid of these giant corporations have been pulling the stings way too long. You need to stop resorting to calling names and ignorant stereotyping, and really look at the world around us and what is happening behind closed doors. The media is a joke and its been proven DOES NOT ACCURATELY and unbiased report the news.

All you guys need to stop blindly arguing that its all ok and Monsanto isn't hurting anyone and just look at the big picture and at all the evidence. You can't sit here and just say over and over that oh those sources aren't any good, and those studies are flawed and repeating all the rhetoric any more then the other side of the argument. The funny thing is that I haven't been "arguing" about the GMO thing in the first place but rather the sneaky, behind the back way that monsanto does business( and its not hardly just them this law is just kind of a president).
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Doer its amazing how well brainwashed you are. We the people havn't ran this country in a long time, so whether you think I'm passing the blame to the corporations and government or not its true. The politicians with the aid of these giant corporations have been pulling the stings way too long. You need to stop resorting to calling names and ignorant stereotyping, and really look at the world around us and what is happening behind closed doors. The media is a joke and its been proven DOES NOT ACCURATELY and unbiased report the news.

All you guys need to stop blindly arguing that its all ok and Monsanto isn't hurting anyone and just look at the big picture and at all the evidence. You can't sit here and just say over and over that oh those sources aren't any good, and those studies are flawed and repeating all the rhetoric any more then the other side of the argument. The funny thing is that I haven't been "arguing" about the GMO thing in the first place but rather the sneaky, behind the back way that monsanto does business( and its not hardly just them this law is just kind of a president).
Dude I am giving names and dates. And I refer to it as the newz-joke. I don't very often see the need to post News drivel.

Just give facts. Your accusations are silly Hippy. "blindly arguing" "say over and over..." "you need to stop...."

Give facts as best they can be dug up. And go read your post here, to yourself in the mirror. You don't seem to be talking to me.
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Also, WE still run the place. You are in the hippy dream, which I helped to create. I woke up.

Do you see an Assault Weapons ban? I joined WE and WE are against you. WE think, and I think you are still sadly confused to see it's so simply and as just a blame game of the straw dogs.

Facts, not your opinions and name calling, wring hands etc. WE run it. There is just an awful lot of us to consider now.

You will not have your way, you checked out of the process of WE.
 

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
lol your ignorance is so obvious its a true shame you think that you represent the "we" in society, though sadly in America such ignorance has become common place amongst people like yourself. You also know nothing about me to be lumping me with any group! Its rare I talk about anything on this site other then MJ because of the closed mindedness which always appears quickly. I haven't really made any accusations I can think of, and I don't need to read my post in the mirror as I know who I"m talking to. You( but not just you others like you) ARE blindly arguing, and then resort to personally attacking myself, and attacking the segment of society that you call silly hippies cleary lumping others into a stereotype because they don't see the world "your" way. I don't think the world is simple or that I have all the answers. I live by the attitude of "live and let live", and "mind your business and I'll mind mine". If the whole world did so it would be a much simpler place. If the politicians weren't up on capital hill voting on gay marriage and abortion instead of focusing on actual problems in this country we wouldn't be in the total mess we are now. Its been 4 years I believe since america has had any sort of national budget, they cut funding to our military because the government is broke, and yet the politicians are still collecting paychecks....really....thats OK?

Anyway I'm getting of topic. I never attacked you, or called you any names (please show me where I did)and yet you resort to that with me? Please tell me that your ok with corporations paying to get laws passed in their favor. Or that its ok to sneak laws into bills behind the public's back to protect someone ( no matter who) that may OR MAY NOT have done anything wrong. However why do they need a law releasing them from liability for their products if their products doesn't cause problems. I suppose if your fine with this stuff then I suppose America probably seems about perfect to you in its current condition, but I'd love to see the country thrive again some day like it once did so my daughter has something to grow up to enjoy.

Thankfully we don't currently have an assualt weapons ban as a nation, nor would I ever support one. I own multiple firearms, most of which would be deemed "assualt weapons" though that is not an accurate term in the first place. Most of my firearms also have standard capacity magazines which hold more then 15 rounds and in turn I would not support a silly mag capacity law. I will not associate with or consider myself a member of any political parties as most are all crooks. I also think its a real shame the way the media has been using people emotions to try to push the anti gun legislation.

I am not sure what you even mean by " you will not get your way, you checked out of the process of WE", I am a part of this country, I work a 9-5 everyday. I'm not some "dead beat, stoner", I (until my motorcycle wreck) was the assistant manager of a national auto parts retailer as well as a father, husband, and all around nice guy. I choose not to affiliate myself with politics, however that does not make my opinion and contributions any less valuable then any other American.

I hope some day your eyes can be opened and you can learn to live alongside others rather then trying to rise above them. This world has no future on its current path of greed and waste and only can this change when we all accept our part in things!

:PEACE: TC
 
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