Newbie needs som confirmation that things look ok.

H

Hornstar

Member
Hey all,

I am a newbie. I am 22 days into my Nirvana Fem AK48 cab grow and I just wanted to know whether my babies look ok and as they should do.

They are in Bio Bizz All mix, germed in the medium.
They have been watered with just tap water until Thursday when I used Bio Bizz Grow for the first time (1ml/litre).
I had not PH'ed my water until this week when i discovered it was at 7.6. The last water I got down to 6.6.
I misted my plants when the lights were on and I think that burnt the leaves.
I got some of the water/feed on some of the leaves.
I have had gnats all around and so I laid a layer of Perlite and intend to use a neem oil spray on the foliage.
I am using 6400k CFL's (325 total wattage) on a 18/6 cycle.
Temps range from 65F during lights out to 85F lights on. RH ranges from 45% to 80%.
Some of the leaves at the bottom of the plant (that are shaded) have started to die and so I have removed them.
The plants are starting to stink quite a bit and actually smell like weed.
I installed a Screen as I intend to Scrog. The screen is 9" above the medium and the bigger plant is approx 6" high whilst the smaller is 4.5" high.

Thats the history and here are the pics from today. I just want to know that I am heading in the right direction. I hope I haven't wasted your time but I would really appreciate some ppointers of anything that seems out of place or wrong so that I can fix it prior to the scrog starting.
 

Attachments

F

frmrboi

Well-Known Member
looking good, I'd start flowering them now if you plan on using cfls through the whole grow.
 
jesus of Cannabis

jesus of Cannabis

:-)
maybe a touch overwatered due to the droopy leaves but they look fine. Love the scrog part with 2 plants, take some clones and make your next grow a real scrog with 25-50 plants :-)
 
H

Hornstar

Member
frmrboi said:
looking good, I'd start flowering them now if you plan on using cfls through the whole grow.
Click to expand...
Seriously think flowering now after only 22 days? I was under the impression that I would fill the screen 75% (so about 3 more weeks/6 weeks Veg total) then switch bulbs and cycle to 12/12.
 
gopherbuddah

gopherbuddah

Well-Known Member
I always say patience is a vertue. Some disagree and start a 12/12 cycle as soon as they can. I've used cfls for every grow and i let my girls veg for at least 3 mos.
 
F

frmrboi

Well-Known Member
Hornstar said:
Seriously think flowering now after only 22 days? I was under the impression that I would fill the screen 75% (so about 3 more weeks/6 weeks Veg total) then switch bulbs and cycle to 12/12.
Click to expand...
sorry, I never read the part about the scrog :oops:. yeah, definetly you'll want to let her run more. I suggest you switch over to more warm whites though so she starts stretching out sooner as you're really bushy already.
 
Snow Crash

Snow Crash

Well-Known Member
They look fine, I'd personally defoliate those big leaves and allow the side branches a chance to fill out a bit.

That's just me though, you can do whatever and it'll be fine.

Some shorties though.
 
H

Hornstar

Member
Thanks for all the tips guys. I have now noticed that alot of the undergrowth is starting to die, presumably because they are so bushy and the undergrowth is not getting enough light. I have 2 questions about this:

1) Is it really ok to trim them up a bit or is this likely to stress them out? The last thing I want is to stress them.
2) Are my plants too bushy? I don't even know if that can be the case or if its a bad thing. The bigger plant is 6-7" now whilst the shorter one is 5". They are 23 days old. Is this normal? Would it be a bad thig to move the lights away to encourage some stretch?

Any more advice would be really helpful.
 
Snow Crash

Snow Crash

Well-Known Member
There's a lot of information available for both methods.

One school of thought is that the large fan leaves are the primary energy providers for the plant. Removing these leaves will decrease the plant's ability to absorb radiation. These leaves also contain cells that generate growth hormones, and by decreasing the number of these cells present in the plant you also stunt its growth that way. This winds up in a net loss of growth that a plant would normally be able to add on with this leaf mass.

The other school of thought is that all plants naturally lose leaves in the wild so they are genetically programmed to produce more leaves than they need. By removing a single upper leaf the light can now reach several smaller leaves lower down. These over sized fan leaves have long stems and huge surface areas, which means quite a bit of transport is required to move elements and molecules from the leaves to other parts of the plant. As a result of their size the larger fan leaves are less efficient then smaller leaves that require shorter distances. Transport requires work, work requires energy. Removing excess foliage (leaves that only shade other leaves) the plant also reacts to the stress as does any other living being. What does not kill it makes it stronger and in just a short time the plant will recover the lost leaf mass and surpass the total canopy surface area of an plant that was not defoliated.

Both sides have totally rational explanations. I know growers that swear by defoliation claiming "What? I'm not growing lettuce am I?" (In response to growers that remove bud sites rather than fan leaves).

Personally I think there is a time and a place for all methods. Sometimes you top. Sometimes you LST. Sometimes you scrog. Sometimes you ReVeg a clone. And Sometimes you do all of this.
10/2: Defoliated for the 4th time and LST trained. Main stalk split...
IMG_2139.jpg
10/9 Post 5th Defoliation (4 day recovery, 3 day rebound)
IMG_2222.jpg
10/19: About a week before flowering prior to a defoliation
IMG_2244.jpg
11/6: about 10 days into flowering and just before a flushing (high ppm run off), it is now under a HPS (which is why the lighting is different).
IMG_2430.jpg

You're in that perfect moment to take a couple of those large fan leaves from the middle of the plant without doing any harm in the long run. The plant has hit its stride and doing this will have some consequence. Over the next 3-4 days you're going to lose a little bit of the explosion you would see. This will actually be a blessing as the plant stays compact and pushes hormones to generate new growth. 10 days after removing these leaves the side branches that were once shaded should have completely filled in any lost leaf mass, and you might be thinking of defoliating again.

Maybe you leave this plant alone but in the future you set yourself up to have a couple "practice" plants so you can experiment and see what works best for you in your own garden.
 
H

Hornstar

Member
Snow Crash said:
There's a lot of information available for both methods.

One school of thought is that the large fan leaves are the primary energy providers for the plant. Removing these leaves will decrease the plant's ability to absorb radiation. These leaves also contain cells that generate growth hormones, and by decreasing the number of these cells present in the plant you also stunt its growth that way. This winds up in a net loss of growth that a plant would normally be able to add on with this leaf mass.

The other school of thought is that all plants naturally lose leaves in the wild so they are genetically programmed to produce more leaves than they need. By removing a single upper leaf the light can now reach several smaller leaves lower down. These over sized fan leaves have long stems and huge surface areas, which means quite a bit of transport is required to move elements and molecules from the leaves to other parts of the plant. As a result of their size the larger fan leaves are less efficient then smaller leaves that require shorter distances. Transport requires work, work requires energy. Removing excess foliage (leaves that only shade other leaves) the plant also reacts to the stress as does any other living being. What does not kill it makes it stronger and in just a short time the plant will recover the lost leaf mass and surpass the total canopy surface area of an plant that was not defoliated.

Both sides have totally rational explanations. I know growers that swear by defoliation claiming "What? I'm not growing lettuce am I?" (In response to growers that remove bud sites rather than fan leaves).

Personally I think there is a time and a place for all methods. Sometimes you top. Sometimes you LST. Sometimes you scrog. Sometimes you ReVeg a clone. And Sometimes you do all of this.
10/2: Defoliated for the 4th time and LST trained. Main stalk split...
View attachment 1256211
10/9 Post 5th Defoliation (4 day recovery, 3 day rebound)
View attachment 1256212
10/19: About a week before flowering prior to a defoliation
View attachment 1256213
11/6: about 10 days into flowering and just before a flushing (high ppm run off), it is now under a HPS (which is why the lighting is different).
View attachment 1256214

You're in that perfect moment to take a couple of those large fan leaves from the middle of the plant without doing any harm in the long run. The plant has hit its stride and doing this will have some consequence. Over the next 3-4 days you're going to lose a little bit of the explosion you would see. This will actually be a blessing as the plant stays compact and pushes hormones to generate new growth. 10 days after removing these leaves the side branches that were once shaded should have completely filled in any lost leaf mass, and you might be thinking of defoliating again.

Maybe you leave this plant alone but in the future you set yourself up to have a couple "practice" plants so you can experiment and see what works best for you in your own garden.
Click to expand...

Great post and very helpful. +rep
 
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