Newbie Needs Sage Advice Please

Well, this was my first grow so it was almost expected that some of my plants, if not all, just wouldn't make it to maturity, but the roller-coaster of nonstop problems and mishaps completely blindsided this newbie. I was under the impression that given the right elements these plants, being a true weed and all, would thrive with little to no help. Now, I don't think that they're a Ronco (set it, and forget it!), by any means, but I had thought that once everything was set up for these babies they would flourish. I am pretty sure that my first batch can just be uprooted and chucked out the window, but I am eager to start anew and would very much appreciate any advice so that I won't have a repeat of my initial disaster.

The project was started eighteen days ago and the conditions were monitored multiple times a day, so I have an accurate report to share with you all. If anyone needs further details please don't hesitate to ask.

Conditions and Details:



  • "Grow-Box" is constructed of 3/4inch plywood (untreated and heavy as a bitch) and it's dimensions are roughly 4'x3'x2.5'
  • Lighting consists of two 20w Fluorescent Plant/Aquarium Wide Spectrum EcoFlux lights and the plants are always 3'' to 6'' from the lights at all times and are on a 24 hour light cycle
  • Fan is about 4'' in diameter and has been on the plants since sprouting and was periodically shifted throughout the box to provide even "strengthening" of the plants
  • Soil (with a tested pH of 5.5) began as Miracle Grow Organic Choice Potting Mix
  • Jiffy Peat Pots were used for germination until they were transplanted into 6'' pots thirteen days in
  • Temperature was taken daily and averaged from 78-82 degrees Fahrenheit
  • Water was filtered through a Brita filter system and left to sit out for at least twenty-four hours before use and the seedlings were watered a few tablespoons each day
I realize now that I probably over-watered the hell out of them, but they did well all things considered.

Four days in to the initial grow I had six seedlings (out of ten) peeking up when I noticed a fuzzy green mold on the edges of the pots. I did some research and learned that it wasn't harmful to my babies seeing as it was living on the pots and not the actual plants. Still, I wiped away as much of the mold as I could with a soft cloth and no new mold ever presented itself.

Eight days into the grow it was apparent that little bugs were flitting around inside of the box. Upon examination and more research it was determined that my babies had Fungus Gnats! I can only assume that these suckers were attracted to the aforementioned fuzzy mold that I thought I had eradicated. I misted each plant with a dish soap/water mix and curbed down the watering for a few days and that seemed to do just the trick on those little gnat buggers!

Thirteen days in the seedlings were getting way too big for the tiny Peat pots and were drying out quickly (which I assume shocked the roots at least a little) and so they were transplanted into bigger pots (about 6'' tall and wide).

Now, and this is important, I had read somewhere that those nasty Fungus Gnats probably came in the soil so I switched to Fox Farm Ocean Forest mix, which has a pH of 6.8, when the seedlings were transplanted. To add extra drainage I used some seashells at the bottom of each pot.

Fourteen days in and the babies got about 1/2 cup of Fox Farm Grow Big, which was diluted at 2 tsp to 1 gallon of water. I know that was probably an unwise choice since they had just received a nutrient overdose from being transplanted into the yummy new soil.

Seventeen days in I noticed that "the girls", as I started to hopefully call them, had these little specks moving around on the pots, and in the soil. I have really good eyes and I'm glad that I do because it was the beginning of a Spider Mite infestation. There were, and still are, only a handful of the jerks on the plants, but from what I've read this pretty much equals certain doom. I squished as many as I could see and then misted the plants with the same soap/water mix that solved the gnat problem.

Eighteen days and I wake up to find one of my girls completely toppled and her stem is dry and almost brittle, definitely way thinner than it used to be. I gave them another good misting with the soap and water mix and squished some more of the Spider Mites, but I'm ready to give up.

It would only be slightly heartbreaking to start all over again seeing as I'm only eighteen days in, but as I said before I would really appreciate any advice that you all are willing to dole out.

I've attached some pictures and they were taken at the eighteen day mark.

The general synopsis, if you don't feel like reading all of the above information is:

I think I over-watered them. I think they were a bit "nute burned" from the Grow Big. They had mold, gnats, and now Spider Mites.


  • Should I start over?
  • If/when I do start over what steps can I take to prevent these things from happening?
  • Any tips, hints, advice for this newbie?
  • How is my set-up?

I've already decided never to use the Jiffy pots and have purchased some cheap plastic flats like they use in the garden stores, and I heard that a little ground cinnamon at the base of each plant will deter Spider Mites. I plan to continue on with the Fox Farm soil, and will use the Grow Big much later in growth next time.

Thank you all in advance for your help!

:peace:
 

Attachments

Okay, I've sprayed the "Lost Causes" with a 1:1 Isopropyl Alcohol (70%) and water mix just to see if it will kill the mites. Fingers crossed! Still looking for advice/comments, please!
 

SCI

Well-Known Member
keep your lights closer to the plants to help keep them from stretching so much. if the spider mites continue, try spraying them with neem oil.
 

bigjesse1922

Well-Known Member
You need to conquer and maintain control over your environment.

Perhaps the soil was infested with gnats and mites. Is there anything that would suggest they could have came from your house/op?

Dump the lights you have. If you can't afford an HID system then get some 26 watt CFL's. Get the kind with blue light (usually 6500k or so, anything above 5000k is ideal for vegging).

Start there.
 
keep your lights closer to the plants to help keep them from stretching so much. if the spider mites continue, try spraying them with neem oil.
Thanks for the quick response! When they were just sprouting they were much closer to the lights and I have had a bit of a problem getting them close enough so I will definitely try getting them much closer next time!

I've heard a lot about Neem Oil, and I was going to try that in combination with either Fox Farms "Bug Off" (I think that's what it was called), or some Doktor Doom. Has anyone tried either of these?

You need to conquer and maintain control over your environment.

Perhaps the soil was infested with gnats and mites. Is there anything that would suggest they could have came from your house/op?

Dump the lights you have. If you can't afford an HID system then get some 26 watt CFL's. Get the kind with blue light (usually 6500k or so, anything above 5000k is ideal for vegging).

Start there.
Thanks for the quick response!

The gnats definitely came in the MG soil, no doubt about it, and when I transplanted them there was a bit of MG soil around the roots that I didn't flush off (BIG mistake), but none of the gnats seemed to reappear after the transplant/soap treatment. Is it possible for the Spider Mites to come in the soil and then show up so late in my grow? I read somewhere that they have a very quick reproductive cycle which is part of the reason they're such a nuisance.

I'm sad to hear the lights I have are no good! The bulbs were a tad bit pricey (for me) and HIDs are probably far too expensive for me. Are 26w CFLs the curly ones? I just have straight tubes - I figured since they said plant/aquarium that they'd be decent enough!

Know I know - and knowing is half of the battle!
 
you also need to get a fan on them.....it maybe too late......they are way too stretched for such small plants
Thank you for replying! Yeah, I have had a fan on them since about day four and on, but they are a lost cause now. I woke up this morning to find them completely shriveled up (not dry or brittle, just limp and thin).

I'm definitely going to start over, keeping them closer to my crappy lights, and see how that works. I'm just growing from bag seed, so other than time/soil, it's not a big loss to experiment with the plants and have them die.

I'm trying a 1:1 of Isopropyl Alcohol and water to combat what I believe are Spider Mites, but I don't think it's doing much good. Heck, I don't even know that they're Spider Mites! They're small, kind of quick moving, and they look like every picture I've seen (the clear/white variety, not the red), but I never see them on the plants! Weird, right?
 

jats

Well-Known Member
that doesn't sound like spider mites.....you can barely see them with the naked eye on a leaf...which is where you find them .....maybe you have fungus gnat larvee ?
 
that doesn't sound like spider mites.....you can barely see them with the naked eye on a leaf...which is where you find them .....maybe you have fungus gnat larvee ?
See, I was thinking that originally, but they don't look remotely larvae-like at all! They look like itty bitty white ticks. Let me see if I can dig around for a photo of what closest resembles them! And thanks again for the help! You rock!
 

Mr.Therapy Man

Well-Known Member
Spider mites would be all over the leaves.Sounds like heat problems too.Dont use any nutes till third week of veg and then only use one teaspoon per gallon.Water only twice weekly and nutes once a week.
 
Spider mites would be all over the leaves.Sounds like heat problems too.Dont use any nutes till third week of veg and then only use one teaspoon per gallon.Water only twice weekly and nutes once a week.
Thank you for the quick response! Yeah, I agree about the Mites, and I've never seen these little guys on the leaves. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what they are. It boggles the mind!

I definitely gave them their nutes too soon, especially since a lot of people say the soil I use might be too many nutes already for the little gals and I had a problem with over-watering when I started (I was playing the overly concerned parent!).

As far as heat goes, do you mean that my temperature may be too high? I've never seen it get above 80 degrees Fahrenheit, but if they want it to be a bit cooler that won't be any problem!
 
Hey man, here's a site I picked up from another thread around here. http://www.naturescontrol.com/ It has some pics in there that might help you figure out what you got crawling around in there and some natural fixes if that's the route you wanna take.
Thank you for the link!

80 degres is fine with plenty of air flow
I have one small (4'') fan in there, but it's not a large box, and of course I open the door to water/check on them.

Also, I have been digging around and while they look like Spider Mites they also look like Mealy Bugs! But they're not fuzzy ... although I am looking with the naked eye (and eyeglasses lol) so who knows if they are fuzzy.

Again, though, if they are Mealy Bugs or even Spider Mites they don't seem to go near the plants! It's completely plausible that I just haven't seen them on the plants, but I see them jamming around the rims of the pots so they are there!

P.S. Everyone who has replied so far has been super helpful and you have all received a well-deserved Reputation+! I just wish I could give you even more rep!
 

Mr.Therapy Man

Well-Known Member
I did not mean use this exactly just giving him some sort of an idea of about what I have to do.Hes watering too much
 
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