EDIT: writing this high, made sense, reading this NOT high, made sense. Reading this HIGH, did not make sense. You'll understand by the end I think. Seriously though, I could use the feedback.
First I'd like to describe the control object and then the goal for the new design, I figure I needed an already exceptional areoponic system that has been proven to be superior, certainly with its draw backs, may not always be the best option, but probably rated the most effective. And they seem to be the spraying nutrient delivery methods. So For my regular control object, which is just a homemade tote, 10 gallons I beleive with 6 3" plant sites. The submersible pump is so old I dont know the GPH, though I will be measuring it later to determine, Im guessing 400-600 GPH connected to 3/4 pvc ran around the plant sites with 12 sprayers. I have a few issues with this system, but I wont go into too much detail, being that this is about fogging. 1) is heat in the reservoir, the ancient motor cooks hot with that much resistance and being old, again, I got it figured out. Actually, that was the only major issue. So I have a 6 site planter, in tote, with 12 sprayers, mounted somewhat high to the lid, and two air stones to make it all nice and bubbly sinse at some point the sprayer design gets utilized as a DWC system as well. Sinse Im not able to run the sprayers 24/7, or anywhere near it do to the temperature of the reservoir, this project wont start until next week when I master the art of simple task of trying to drop my water temperature 30 degree's.. Ice bags work for now, but I still cant run it near often as I want.
The spray timing will be set intermittent with the fogger. My understanding of the best fogger design thus far is one that intermittently fogs, and though there are still some arguments about what part of the root benefits best from the actual fog enriched nutrient (Not all root parts utilize 2-5 micron size nutrient sources), I think Nutramist's garden in design is the best to my knowledge. A drip system where the plants roots are separated from the reservoir and intermittent drip cycles with fog cycles, the product is a root system where 100% of the root system is suspended, (or kinda clumped up) in the nutrient enriched fog mixture. Then as the fog cycle ends, or there shortly after, the drip cycle begins. This is a system where the roots are nearly always being supplied with a fresh, oxygenated nutrient solution. Though during the regular drip cycle, the roots are not necessarily receiving nutrients in the most oxygenized environment, but I would say after the amount of articles I;ve read, that at least Im a beleive that this system can just rock the dog gone world. Those systems are not only expensive, they are mildly expensive to build, which is where hopefully I get some help or idea's. I'm making a similar design, though I'd like to use a spraying system instead of a drip. Not as much written out there about doing it, but what is, at least to me, suggests, a great direction to head towards.
So the design concept.... First off, in order to target an indoor growers group, though I can make cheaper design changes, but the object is too keep these plants as low to the ground as possible. And again, a benefit of dissipating some reservoir heat to the ground, thats a free temp. drop. I will screw up and have to make some changes so building material cheap and easy to get. Most is, but when it comes to a potentially marketable design, looks count. A little bit anyway. So 6" PVC seems to take the cake, traditional I know, but form factor is important and 4" fence post or PVC, though I loved the designs, in the end, the smaller area with 2" nets still did not leave good enough root growth room especially going into flowering. 6" with 3" nets, perfect. Many systems utilize this now, Im going with them. PVC tubin for sprayers, again cheap and its the easiest thing to work with. I dont even glue my joints or anything so I can strip down to individual parts for sterilizing, (Dishwasher does a great job), so I like the idea. Sprayers we can get anywhere, and are uber cheap.
I have noticed however that the spray heads thread in fine for a long time, but eventually the PVC plastic doesnt take the thread as much anymore, and actually, that can be a problem. Cheap to fix, just buy need 6' PVC tube, re-drill holes, install old sprayers. $6. The only solution I had for that thus far was to glue a nut on that fit the threading on the spray head so it threads right everytime, Or does anyone know of a two part sray system there you mount the sprayer receptacle and then just twist in the sprayhead? Not a huge deal either way,, but would like to know if anyone else runs into this.
So know we can spray the roots, awesome we'll need a way to fog them. I will just be using the Nutramist fogger for this example. If I decide the cost isnt worth is I will build one, I've seen 12 head foggers for $60 or so and a fan unit and setup for the reservoir can be done, but early it is so much eaoer to just buy it and see if it works. If it works, my next unit will have one home made, you gain great control when you make it yourself and undertand wht your making. I dont have enough complex knowledge on foggers or how they work....yet.. . I am not familiar yet with the heat a fogger head will create, though I can problem correct that if it was a real issue. Chances are that I will use a temperature controlled Ice Probe in both reservoirs just so the temperature is a) always exactly where I want it, and b) its important that all temperatures and solution mixes are identical to make this a true comparison. Fogger design more towards the end.
If I run 2 lengths of the 6" PVC, whatever length, in my case, 3 ft, for 6 2" plant sites on each pipe, 12 sites total. The ends of the Pipe connect on one end. Easy to do with 2 Elbow connects and very little cut of pipe, if you cant find a "U" connector. We prop the ends up, that are not connected, only and inche or so, just so all the excess nutrient spray and runnoff all roll down the the connecting piece. There will be a drain there in the center. 3/4 Pipe was my first pic, cause I just have a bunch, but Im going to use transparent plastic hose, like the big fishtank cleaner hose kind. Actually, that exactly in this model. Then I can see the liquid drain, how much air, how fast, could even measure the GPH of runnoff during different cycles if I wanted to, but I dont really care bout any of that just yet. Now, the pipes are on the floor, they have the 3" plant sites cur out, PLENTY of room for root growth and a drainage. The end of the drainage pipe will just go into the reservoir, but mounted up as high as it can go, so its always above the reservoir water level, dont want water going the wrong way.
The reservoir, which can be anything airtight, I'll use 5 gallon bucket because I have a ton and their cheap. Again, the PVC pipes are on the floor and not draining into the resovior because in some low profile situations, the fact that your plants are growing from just less then 6" from the floor, yet are utilizing the one of the best grow methods discovered, its just enough to give me a chubby. Continuing.
(smoke break) Dont let me get off topic here.
So first thing is the 5 gallon bucket. They are airtight when sealed, pain in the rear to open, especially if filled with water, but they work. I would suggest getting a screw off lid that fits them. Thier online and cheap, now your lid just unscrews. I would mount two bulkheads that are going to fit my tubing and piping. Adapters are a dime a dozzen so Im not sure if I would run hose from the reservoir to the pipe or PVC like I do now. Doesnt matter really. As long as I can drill two holes in the lid, mount two bulkhead fittings to it, im good. I will run tubing from the pump output to the male end on the underside of the lid, and then run the output to the pipe we mounted the sprayers in. Now water is a flowing, the other AIRTIGHT fitting we installed in the lid we put the drain tube. Airtight is crucial here folks. We are reallying on the pump pushing out water, and bringing in air through the drain, only until the water gets there, to displace the water it pumped out. The only obsticle so far seems to be if the sprayers are running intermittently when the pump stops, whatever water hasnt been drained will sit in that pipe or tubing during the fogging cycle, probably wouldnt be much, but dunno yet. It works great on a 24 hour spray system. Everything stays pretty cool too, but again, heat in the reservoir can be a problem, but at least a $200 correctable one, its not cheap, but its at least passable.
Also, I didnt mention, I first thought that a single sprayer under each plant site in a piece of 3/4 or 1/2" pvc would suffice, it doesn't, directly under the roots and when roots grow... ut oh.... So I just 2 pipes, 1/2 in size this time and they will actually be mounted inside the 6" Pipe but on the sides with 180 sprayers, I use all 360 sprayers now, but thats because I have a ton. I like that with a turn of a wrench I can point them more downward if I like or focus them where ever. Easeasis mount for this was running it through the ends of the 6" pipe caps with rubber gromets to prevent spraying or leaking.Although I think I have a better solution for easier mounting also. That works in a 3 foot pipe, Would need to support it better if running 6 foot I think. (The new design fixes the support issue also) That was the ariginal thoughts anyhow. I think I have an easy way to acomplish the same thing just putting the 1/2 pipe together differently. So when it slides in, its already in place. When I take pictures it may make better sense.
Now the fogger, the fogger will love this design but you need fog going in both pipes from the part that was elevated. If you just buy the nutramist with a two hose adapter your set. My design is going to use just that, I have to change my resovior concept if I put a fogger in there. I cant have it air tight and pump out fog, and that resoviour concept is what makes this low profile, I dont have to build high to have gravity pull the solution to the reservoir, its more, being sucked in, uphill. You could make one like the nutramist, which after I disassemble I may be able to do at a much lower cost. But the way the nutramist connects to the reservoir makes everything work. I dont know if the tube going from the reservoir to the nutramist fogger has a check valve to allow one way flow, but if not, its not hard to find a fitting to do that. just so when the pump pushes water out, I wouldnt want it bringing solution out of the fogger either. But again, dont think this would be a huge deal. So Full root exposure to fog, full exposure to aerated solution, intermittently exchanged, the best timing to fog and spray will take much experimenting, as it seems to have for everyone, lots of opinions and discoveries out there. this is the new wave. So kindly, blow up my idea, tell me where its going to fail, suggest something that could work better. If I could find a low profile unit that worked this well (theoretically) I probably would have just bought it, but I didnt, so now I cut a bunch of stuff and kill inocent plants and get hollered at by the old lady that I cant run a saw at 1AM, so I need your help. Lets get involved people. Ultimate low profile design, take 1!!!!!
First I'd like to describe the control object and then the goal for the new design, I figure I needed an already exceptional areoponic system that has been proven to be superior, certainly with its draw backs, may not always be the best option, but probably rated the most effective. And they seem to be the spraying nutrient delivery methods. So For my regular control object, which is just a homemade tote, 10 gallons I beleive with 6 3" plant sites. The submersible pump is so old I dont know the GPH, though I will be measuring it later to determine, Im guessing 400-600 GPH connected to 3/4 pvc ran around the plant sites with 12 sprayers. I have a few issues with this system, but I wont go into too much detail, being that this is about fogging. 1) is heat in the reservoir, the ancient motor cooks hot with that much resistance and being old, again, I got it figured out. Actually, that was the only major issue. So I have a 6 site planter, in tote, with 12 sprayers, mounted somewhat high to the lid, and two air stones to make it all nice and bubbly sinse at some point the sprayer design gets utilized as a DWC system as well. Sinse Im not able to run the sprayers 24/7, or anywhere near it do to the temperature of the reservoir, this project wont start until next week when I master the art of simple task of trying to drop my water temperature 30 degree's.. Ice bags work for now, but I still cant run it near often as I want.
The spray timing will be set intermittent with the fogger. My understanding of the best fogger design thus far is one that intermittently fogs, and though there are still some arguments about what part of the root benefits best from the actual fog enriched nutrient (Not all root parts utilize 2-5 micron size nutrient sources), I think Nutramist's garden in design is the best to my knowledge. A drip system where the plants roots are separated from the reservoir and intermittent drip cycles with fog cycles, the product is a root system where 100% of the root system is suspended, (or kinda clumped up) in the nutrient enriched fog mixture. Then as the fog cycle ends, or there shortly after, the drip cycle begins. This is a system where the roots are nearly always being supplied with a fresh, oxygenated nutrient solution. Though during the regular drip cycle, the roots are not necessarily receiving nutrients in the most oxygenized environment, but I would say after the amount of articles I;ve read, that at least Im a beleive that this system can just rock the dog gone world. Those systems are not only expensive, they are mildly expensive to build, which is where hopefully I get some help or idea's. I'm making a similar design, though I'd like to use a spraying system instead of a drip. Not as much written out there about doing it, but what is, at least to me, suggests, a great direction to head towards.
So the design concept.... First off, in order to target an indoor growers group, though I can make cheaper design changes, but the object is too keep these plants as low to the ground as possible. And again, a benefit of dissipating some reservoir heat to the ground, thats a free temp. drop. I will screw up and have to make some changes so building material cheap and easy to get. Most is, but when it comes to a potentially marketable design, looks count. A little bit anyway. So 6" PVC seems to take the cake, traditional I know, but form factor is important and 4" fence post or PVC, though I loved the designs, in the end, the smaller area with 2" nets still did not leave good enough root growth room especially going into flowering. 6" with 3" nets, perfect. Many systems utilize this now, Im going with them. PVC tubin for sprayers, again cheap and its the easiest thing to work with. I dont even glue my joints or anything so I can strip down to individual parts for sterilizing, (Dishwasher does a great job), so I like the idea. Sprayers we can get anywhere, and are uber cheap.
I have noticed however that the spray heads thread in fine for a long time, but eventually the PVC plastic doesnt take the thread as much anymore, and actually, that can be a problem. Cheap to fix, just buy need 6' PVC tube, re-drill holes, install old sprayers. $6. The only solution I had for that thus far was to glue a nut on that fit the threading on the spray head so it threads right everytime, Or does anyone know of a two part sray system there you mount the sprayer receptacle and then just twist in the sprayhead? Not a huge deal either way,, but would like to know if anyone else runs into this.
So know we can spray the roots, awesome we'll need a way to fog them. I will just be using the Nutramist fogger for this example. If I decide the cost isnt worth is I will build one, I've seen 12 head foggers for $60 or so and a fan unit and setup for the reservoir can be done, but early it is so much eaoer to just buy it and see if it works. If it works, my next unit will have one home made, you gain great control when you make it yourself and undertand wht your making. I dont have enough complex knowledge on foggers or how they work....yet.. . I am not familiar yet with the heat a fogger head will create, though I can problem correct that if it was a real issue. Chances are that I will use a temperature controlled Ice Probe in both reservoirs just so the temperature is a) always exactly where I want it, and b) its important that all temperatures and solution mixes are identical to make this a true comparison. Fogger design more towards the end.
If I run 2 lengths of the 6" PVC, whatever length, in my case, 3 ft, for 6 2" plant sites on each pipe, 12 sites total. The ends of the Pipe connect on one end. Easy to do with 2 Elbow connects and very little cut of pipe, if you cant find a "U" connector. We prop the ends up, that are not connected, only and inche or so, just so all the excess nutrient spray and runnoff all roll down the the connecting piece. There will be a drain there in the center. 3/4 Pipe was my first pic, cause I just have a bunch, but Im going to use transparent plastic hose, like the big fishtank cleaner hose kind. Actually, that exactly in this model. Then I can see the liquid drain, how much air, how fast, could even measure the GPH of runnoff during different cycles if I wanted to, but I dont really care bout any of that just yet. Now, the pipes are on the floor, they have the 3" plant sites cur out, PLENTY of room for root growth and a drainage. The end of the drainage pipe will just go into the reservoir, but mounted up as high as it can go, so its always above the reservoir water level, dont want water going the wrong way.
The reservoir, which can be anything airtight, I'll use 5 gallon bucket because I have a ton and their cheap. Again, the PVC pipes are on the floor and not draining into the resovior because in some low profile situations, the fact that your plants are growing from just less then 6" from the floor, yet are utilizing the one of the best grow methods discovered, its just enough to give me a chubby. Continuing.
(smoke break) Dont let me get off topic here.
So first thing is the 5 gallon bucket. They are airtight when sealed, pain in the rear to open, especially if filled with water, but they work. I would suggest getting a screw off lid that fits them. Thier online and cheap, now your lid just unscrews. I would mount two bulkheads that are going to fit my tubing and piping. Adapters are a dime a dozzen so Im not sure if I would run hose from the reservoir to the pipe or PVC like I do now. Doesnt matter really. As long as I can drill two holes in the lid, mount two bulkhead fittings to it, im good. I will run tubing from the pump output to the male end on the underside of the lid, and then run the output to the pipe we mounted the sprayers in. Now water is a flowing, the other AIRTIGHT fitting we installed in the lid we put the drain tube. Airtight is crucial here folks. We are reallying on the pump pushing out water, and bringing in air through the drain, only until the water gets there, to displace the water it pumped out. The only obsticle so far seems to be if the sprayers are running intermittently when the pump stops, whatever water hasnt been drained will sit in that pipe or tubing during the fogging cycle, probably wouldnt be much, but dunno yet. It works great on a 24 hour spray system. Everything stays pretty cool too, but again, heat in the reservoir can be a problem, but at least a $200 correctable one, its not cheap, but its at least passable.
Also, I didnt mention, I first thought that a single sprayer under each plant site in a piece of 3/4 or 1/2" pvc would suffice, it doesn't, directly under the roots and when roots grow... ut oh.... So I just 2 pipes, 1/2 in size this time and they will actually be mounted inside the 6" Pipe but on the sides with 180 sprayers, I use all 360 sprayers now, but thats because I have a ton. I like that with a turn of a wrench I can point them more downward if I like or focus them where ever. Easeasis mount for this was running it through the ends of the 6" pipe caps with rubber gromets to prevent spraying or leaking.Although I think I have a better solution for easier mounting also. That works in a 3 foot pipe, Would need to support it better if running 6 foot I think. (The new design fixes the support issue also) That was the ariginal thoughts anyhow. I think I have an easy way to acomplish the same thing just putting the 1/2 pipe together differently. So when it slides in, its already in place. When I take pictures it may make better sense.
Now the fogger, the fogger will love this design but you need fog going in both pipes from the part that was elevated. If you just buy the nutramist with a two hose adapter your set. My design is going to use just that, I have to change my resovior concept if I put a fogger in there. I cant have it air tight and pump out fog, and that resoviour concept is what makes this low profile, I dont have to build high to have gravity pull the solution to the reservoir, its more, being sucked in, uphill. You could make one like the nutramist, which after I disassemble I may be able to do at a much lower cost. But the way the nutramist connects to the reservoir makes everything work. I dont know if the tube going from the reservoir to the nutramist fogger has a check valve to allow one way flow, but if not, its not hard to find a fitting to do that. just so when the pump pushes water out, I wouldnt want it bringing solution out of the fogger either. But again, dont think this would be a huge deal. So Full root exposure to fog, full exposure to aerated solution, intermittently exchanged, the best timing to fog and spray will take much experimenting, as it seems to have for everyone, lots of opinions and discoveries out there. this is the new wave. So kindly, blow up my idea, tell me where its going to fail, suggest something that could work better. If I could find a low profile unit that worked this well (theoretically) I probably would have just bought it, but I didnt, so now I cut a bunch of stuff and kill inocent plants and get hollered at by the old lady that I cant run a saw at 1AM, so I need your help. Lets get involved people. Ultimate low profile design, take 1!!!!!
