LED's another take on things???

9inch bigbud

Well-Known Member
....What you are not understanding is that.... well theres alot of things ill make a list.

1. Plants never required soil just as I said earlier, hydro was no innovation or adaptation that had to be made. At a more basic level then I said earlier soil is a medium plants will grow in any viable medium as long as they are provided the other 3 essential things + nutes to thrive. Consider out there in nature where its grown naturally for millions of years. A seed roots itself in a pile of small rocks in a tiny stream, wallah hydro.

2. All of those links you show speak of plants adapting to their surroundings only within there own lifetimes, and having to adapt is going to effect yield and survival reguardless because it stresses the plant and stress = bad. But none of those links speak of anything at the genetic level passed on in its seeds. There is the 1 quote about phenotypes, but still it does not give a timeframe. Phenotypes change based on the Mother and Father plants generation after generation, but to make environmental adaptations at the genetic level passed on in a plants seed it would take like weve been saying thousands of years.

3. Think of nature and how slow things move and change, 50-60 years is nothing in the grand scheme of things when your talking in the millions of years, its a blip in the evolutionary history of the plant. Your lack of being able to grasp that largere scheme and the fact you think I would need to be a Biology professor or something to know about this stuff which would be common knowledge to anyone who paid a little attention in Highschool makes me think your probably just some kid trying to stir things up.

4. Do I really have to mention that evolutionary changes like that would require constant breeding in that environment for those thousands of years? What about the fact that HID growing only accounts for a small percentage or the Marijuana produced annually? Every guy tending to a field of 500 plants outdoors produces more by himself then probably 50-100 indoor growers, not to mention the small percentage of CFL growers as well.

5. The only reason LEDs work for other plants and not Marijuana at the moment is because in flowering Marijuana requires much more intense light to grow the fat buds we desire then it would to grow a tomato plant for example. That is the ONLY reason not some stupid adaptation shit. Thats why LEDs have worked just fine for Vegging but tended to produce stretchy skinny buds (but still produced 53g under 60w but we wont go into that again) when used to flower.

6. Basically light is just not something a plant does or would need to adapt to. If its the right spectrum and intense enough to flower the buds fat anything will work. As LEDs begin to put out more intense light from a smaller area they will begin to become viable.
1. Plants never required soil just as I said earlier, hydro was no innovation or adaptation that had to be made. At a more basic level then I said earlier soil is a medium plants will grow in any viable medium as long as they are provided the other 3 essential things + nutes to thrive. Consider out there in nature where its grown naturally for millions of years. A seed roots itself in a pile of small rocks in a tiny stream, wallah hydro.
yes-no plants need a balanced diet to grow well N-P-K just dont do it you need all the micro nutes we are talking about a artificial enviroment indoors where we give the plant the best that we can to help it to grow. fuck millions of years ago we are talking about what man can do to help grow better plants.

2. All of those links you show speak of plants adapting to their surroundings only within there own lifetimes, and having to adapt is going to effect yield and survival reguardless because it stresses the plant and stress = bad. But none of those links speak of anything at the genetic level passed on in its seeds. There is the 1 quote about phenotypes, but still it does not give a timeframe. Phenotypes change based on the Mother and Father plants generation after generation, but to make environmental adaptations at the genetic level passed on in a plants seed it would take like weve been saying thousands of years.
that goes for plants grown under HPS and LED's that is putting plants under stress the have grown under the sun as you have said for millions of years.

you quote "All of those links you show speak of plants adapting to their surroundings only within there own lifetimes, and having to adapt is going to effect yield and survival reguardless"

yes that right read my last post above this one. plants adapt very fast and the seeds from thouse plant flower sooner or later than the original seeds because of the enviroment they grew in. what does that tell you????

3. Think of nature and how slow things move and change, 50-60 years is nothing in the grand scheme of things when your talking in the millions of years, its a blip in the evolutionary history of the plant. Your lack of being able to grasp that largere scheme and the fact you think I would need to be a Biology professor or something to know about this stuff which would be common knowledge to anyone who paid a little attention in Highschool makes me think your probably just some kid trying to stir things up.
I have studied plants for the past 20 years or so of growing my own. i am not trying to stir things up on the contrary. i was looking at why some plants grow better under LED's than HPS lights even sun loving plants that like the sun the same as cannabis. I thought hard and may be the reson for it is most plant people grow indoors are breed under HPS what if the same plant was breed under LED's? is that the missing link? do you know have you tested it?

4. Do I really have to mention that evolutionary changes like that would require constant breeding in that environment for those thousands of years? What about the fact that HID growing only accounts for a small percentage or the marijuana produced annually? Every guy tending to a field of 500 plants outdoors produces more by himself then probably 50-100 indoor growers, not to mention the small percentage of CFL growers as well.
you qoute "What about the fact that HID growing only accounts for a small percentage or the marijuana produced annually?"

HID growing makes it possable to grow cannabis where otherwise it may not be grown or grown all year round

when you look for seeds in a seed bank you look for what you want i.e indoor or outdoor strains it does not matter how much anually is grown indoors or out doors.

5. The only reason LEDs work for other plants and not marijuana at the moment is because in flowering marijuana requires much more intense light to grow the fat buds we desire then it would to grow a tomato plant for example. That is the ONLY reason not some stupid adaptation shit. Thats why LEDs have worked just fine for Vegging but tended to produce stretchy skinny buds (but still produced 53g under 60w but we wont go into that again) when used to flower.
tomato plants are a sun loving plant the same as cannabis LED still grow tomatos even though the light intenstity is noware near that of HID's? I use HPS's lights and would not use LED's again just to dissmiss them when no true tests have been dont i.e where did the original seed come from was it indoor or out door seed?

what im asking is if someone who grows under LED's to try it out im not saying its better than HID's but to experiment with seeds that are not breed under HPS.

6. Basically light is just not something a plant does or would need to adapt to. If its the right spectrum and intense enough to flower the buds fat anything will work. As LEDs begin to put out more intense light from a smaller area they will begin to become viable.
you qoute " Basically light is just not something a plant does or would need to adapt to." there you go again talking bollocks! so if i put a fresh cutting under a 1000 watt HID it will just take off no matter what hight i hang the light? even uder the sun you need to harden off plants when you grow indoors to get them ready for full sun.
 

hazetastic808

Well-Known Member
I'm not posting in this thread anymore your just too ignorant...

"you qoute " Basically light is just not something a plant does or would need to adapt to." there you go again talking bollocks! so if i put a fresh cutting under a 1000 watt HID it will just take off no matter what hight i hang the light? even uder the sun you need to harden off plants when you grow indoors to get them ready for full sun."

Idk how many times I can reiterate the fact that your still talking about adaptational changes over a single plants lifespan which has nothing to do with evolutionary changes in its genetic makeup passed on too its offspring.
 

AmStaffnsharpei

Active Member
Selective breeding does create quick changes...ie breeding plants that thrive under hid lights, but evolution is an altogether different matter...kiss and make up
 

9inch bigbud

Well-Known Member
I'm not posting in this thread anymore your just too ignorant...

"you qoute " Basically light is just not something a plant does or would need to adapt to." there you go again talking bollocks! so if i put a fresh cutting under a 1000 watt HID it will just take off no matter what hight i hang the light? even uder the sun you need to harden off plants when you grow indoors to get them ready for full sun."

Idk how many times I can reiterate the fact that your still talking about adaptational changes over a single plants lifespan which has nothing to do with evolutionary changes in its genetic makeup passed on too its offspring.
you call me ignorant?? you are the ignorant one just like my self that said LED's are shit for growing then i had a splif and thought?? hang on may be there is somthing in growing shit under LED's I was looking at why it may not grow so good i agree with you about the intensity m8 im not knocking you, but "maybe" ??? there could be an explanation why LED's can grow some sun loving plants better than HID's.may be with in the next 50-60 years of growing under them they will be just as good?? i was only trying to help LED growers who might get a bit pissed off with the results they are getting at the moment and to try too experiment with other seeds and not seeds grown under HID's am i ignorant because of that?
 

hazetastic808

Well-Known Member
Sorry for being bitter earlier just playing my part in the argument lol, well if you are interested in my little setup to help with the intensity issues with LEDs. Its a hexagonal box I'm going to be using to LST a plant in. 2 3w reds on each wall and a center column I rigged up with 6 3w side emitting reds with a 3w side emitting blue and 3w regular blue above totalling 60w of LED light all in a small 1.25'1.25'x2 reflective box. The wall mounted ones are adjustable so I can adjust them to shine right on the buds while I'm training it around. I'm working on making it absolutely lightproof now but it is already bright as a mother in there with all that light reflecting around in there hurts to look right into it lol.
 

9inch bigbud

Well-Known Member
Sorry for being bitter earlier just playing my part in the argument lol, well if you are interested in my little setup to help with the intensity issues with LEDs. Its a hexagonal box I'm going to be using to LST a plant in. 2 3w reds on each wall and a center column I rigged up with 6 3w side emitting reds with a 3w side emitting blue and 3w regular blue above totalling 60w of LED light all in a small 1.25'1.25'x2 reflective box. The wall mounted ones are adjustable so I can adjust them to shine right on the buds while I'm training it around. I'm working on making it absolutely lightproof now but it is already bright as a mother in there with all that light reflecting around in there hurts to look right into it lol.
thats o.k m8 i dont call it an argument i call it debate. I hope your grow is successful
 

dub007

Active Member
Well I got into LEDs late into the game, never trusted it like you guys, for good reason. I never trusted the LEDs to provide enough of the spectrum that plants need to grow. Well I'm so happy that I got into LEDs LATER and saved a whole bunch of $$ on technology that just wasn't there yet.

Then I found these 5th generation LEDs that use the HighDefinition LED lights. These are the LED lights they use to turn a whole wall into a big screen into an HDTV. So I picked up 3 of the UFO lights, two for bloom and one for veg, and WOW I'm impressed. These are powerful enough to replace a 400-600W HPS OR MH OR fluorescent.

Google what spectrum plants need to grow. This is what spectrum my lights are:
Wavelength on the grow lights: Red light 620-660nm; Blue light: 440-470nm; white 4,500 Kelvin.

I wish I could convince everyone with the inefficient systems (HPS/MH/CFL) that they don't need the high energy bills, all the heat and headache...

About the pics, they were taken 21 days into bloom and are all Grand Daddy Purple indicas..
 

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jigfresh

Well-Known Member
Well I got into LEDs late into the game, never trusted it like you guys, for good reason. I never trusted the LEDs to provide enough of the spectrum that plants need to grow. Well I'm so happy that I got into LEDs LATER and saved a whole bunch of $$ on technology that just wasn't there yet.

Then I found these 5th generation LEDs that use the HighDefinition LED lights. These are the LED lights they use to turn a whole wall into a big screen into an HDTV. So I picked up 3 of the UFO lights, two for bloom and one for veg, and WOW I'm impressed. These are powerful enough to replace a 400-600W HPS OR MH OR fluorescent.

Google what spectrum plants need to grow. This is what spectrum my lights are:
Wavelength on the grow lights: Red light 620-660nm; Blue light: 440-470nm; white 4,500 Kelvin.

I wish I could convince everyone with the inefficient systems (HPS/MH/CFL) that they don't need the high energy bills, all the heat and headache...

About the pics, they were taken 21 days into bloom and are all Grand Daddy Purple indicas..
Good Fuckin Timing bro...

I'm just starting think about my next grow. My whole world just opened up thinking about LED's.

I always said before... "they are too expensive"... BUT, I'm spending $80/ month on electricity, to run fans, lights, airpumps, etc. I know that electric bill would be SOOOO Much less with leds... and not having to run the big ass fan when lights are on.

Anyways, I hadn't even thought of LED's for months. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.

Your buds are looking AMAZING.

You have a specific brand you use and like?

Great stuff. :mrgreen:
 

dub007

Active Member
Good Fuckin Timing bro...

I'm just starting think about my next grow. My whole world just opened up thinking about LED's.

I always said before... "they are too expensive"... BUT, I'm spending $80/ month on electricity, to run fans, lights, airpumps, etc. I know that electric bill would be SOOOO Much less with leds... and not having to run the big ass fan when lights are on.

Anyways, I hadn't even thought of LED's for months. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.

Your buds are looking AMAZING.

You have a specific brand you use and like?

Great stuff. :mrgreen:
First of I'm REALLY excited about these HD LED lights. The same thing happened to me when I stumbled across the website. "My eyes were opened" and they were really opened when I turned the lights on! lol They are a brand new design to the market. THE PLANTS LOVE EM and I'm now saving 75-90% on electricity, its like an early Christmas! Oh BTW there is a Holidays sale going on now, you should definitely swoop up a few of the 90 W quad band UFOs with white spectrum like I did!

The company is called Pendragon's Treasures INC. Contact the guy if you have any questions and he will answer them all for you. TELL HIM THAT I (dub007) REFERRED YOU TO THE SITE! It is the ULTIMATE +REP to let a new company w/ a great product know you are helping them out!

The website is www.pendragonstreasuresinc.us
 

archaeo

Member
Besides the valid points mentioned above about evolution taking hundreds of thousands of generations to 'adapt' (these ain't fruit flies, mind you!) your argument is based on an assumption that current cultivars are somehow evolving to grow in so called 'artificial' light conditions...You seem to suppose that artificial light is somehow different than natural light. The thing is, current artificial grow lighting so closely matches the spectrum of natural day light, that there really is no difference. Therefore, the plants haven't 'evolved' to grow in some special sort of light. Light is Light, in this case.
 
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