Led Users Unite!

ColoradoLove

Well-Known Member
So if you don't care about your warranty and are really careful you could get a little extra light by removing the plexi? I might in 5 years when my warranty is up
 

jdizzle22

Well-Known Member
Humidity is a enemy at times...
If humidity is a problem for your LED you need to get a dehumidifier/moveoutoftropics or return your defective unit

I agree that removing the glass is absolutely not worth any risks and especially voiding any warranty you have. With how much more efficient LED is at growing plants than say HPS, do you really really need to remove that glass? No, it will not make a difference you can repeat for it will be so minor to the plants compared to other growth factors.
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
If humidity is a problem for your LED you need to get a dehumidifier/moveoutoftropics or return your defective unit

I agree that removing the glass is absolutely not worth any risks and especially voiding any warranty you have. With how much more efficient LED is at growing plants than say HPS, do you really really need to remove that glass? No, it will not make a difference you can repeat for it will be so minor to the plants compared to other growth factors.
I meant in the context of taking off the glass, eventually it would take its toll on the diodes. Plants give off a lot of moisture that essentially rises upwards, assuming then the diodes would get some of it at least. I too see no point in taking the glass off.
 

Kaptain Kron

Well-Known Member
my blackstar is still kickin ass, i actually decided for the area it covers i like it better than my kessils. Gave me more nug off the same strain on identically set up tables. 3 kessils is probably better than 1 240w blackstar, but 2 kessils is more expensive than my 240w black star and doesnt cover the same footprint. All in all I love the kessils, i just think the price still needs to come down to be competitive with blackstar. To those of you who don't like them to each your own but i've grown some quality nug off of mine that has turned a hardcore HPS using friend of mine into an LED fanatic. He's never going back and he's seen the nug off of my kessils too and still likes the blackstars nug better.

Have a good day gents.
 

Gary Busey

New Member
I've been looking at those Kessils for quite a while now. But @ $200 + for just 36 watts.... I'd need like 3 of them for one of my small cabs.

It is one of the very few LEDs where I seen people exceed 1 gram per watt (though the gpw is not totally accurate way to determine yield, it still gives you an idea..). There's a thread on here somewhere with that grow, some Australian guy I believe. I'll have to see if I can't find it...

What kind of heat do the Kessils put off?

my blackstar is still kickin ass, i actually decided for the area it covers i like it better than my kessils. Gave me more nug off the same strain on identically set up tables. 3 kessils is probably better than 1 240w blackstar, but 2 kessils is more expensive than my 240w black star and doesnt cover the same footprint. All in all I love the kessils, i just think the price still needs to come down to be competitive with blackstar. To those of you who don't like them to each your own but i've grown some quality nug off of mine that has turned a hardcore HPS using friend of mine into an LED fanatic. He's never going back and he's seen the nug off of my kessils too and still likes the blackstars nug better.

Have a good day gents.
 

medicine21

Active Member
And if not then why are these manufacturers not making a larger more spaced panel, is the end user really thinking ahead of them in this aspect? It seems as though too much R&D is focussed on smaller panels.
Since the diodes are of different spectrums, spreading them further apart may not give you the optimal spectrum mix in all areas of the plant. At least, that's my guess.
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
Since the diodes are of different spectrums, spreading them further apart may not give you the optimal spectrum mix in all areas of the plant. At least, that's my guess.
But then by grouping the various diodes of different spectrums into clusters and then in turn placing those clusters along the lines of a grid on the board you might be able to create effective light mixing. If this worked you could build up exponentially, it may also decrease heat within the sink as the clusters would have plenty heatsink at a lower tempreture surrounding them to absorb the heat thus reducing heat overall. Fans could be placed directly over clusters assisting this. What are your thoughts?
 

medicine21

Active Member
But then by grouping the various diodes of different spectrums into clusters and then in turn placing those clusters along the lines of a grid on the board you might be able to create effective light mixing. If this worked you could build up exponentially, it may also decrease heat within the sink as the clusters would have plenty heatsink at a lower tempreture surrounding them to absorb the heat thus reducing heat overall. Fans could be placed directly over clusters assisting this. What are your thoughts?
I'm no engineer, but the cluster idea makes sense. You combine all the different wavelength diodes into these clusters, figure out how much a single cluster covers on its own at a certain canopy distance. That will allow you to figure out how far to spread them on the panel. I am not sure I agree on the heat management point, though. I think the heat will be more difficult to manage than evenly spread diodes across the panel. Fans over clusters would help, you're right.

The other thing to play with in this design is of course the lens angles. I think with this cluster design, the panel should shoot for penetration rather than coverage. Coverage will be obtained with more clusters and consequently larger panels.
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
I'm no engineer, but the cluster idea makes sense. You combine all the different wavelength diodes into these clusters, figure out how much a single cluster covers on its own at a certain canopy distance. That will allow you to figure out how far to spread them on the panel. I am not sure I agree on the heat management point, though. I think the heat will be more difficult to manage than evenly spread diodes across the panel. Fans over clusters would help, you're right.

The other thing to play with in this design is of course the lens angles. I think with this cluster design, the panel should shoot for penetration rather than coverage. Coverage will be obtained with more clusters and consequently larger panels.
My understanding of heat transfer is that the more material mass to pass and spread the heat to the quicker it's dissipation. I may be wrong. I think clusters are a great idea, it would help coverage issues a lot and still potentially address penetration and light blending, in fact i see no reason why it would not work, the current placement of diodes seems to work so you are using existing tech to solve that.
 

puffenuff

Well-Known Member
There are companies around that cluster their diodes under their lenses. Can't remember exactly which ones, but most cluster three 1w diodes together and call them 3w panels, misleading. I also saw a company that clusters two or three 3w diodes under a single lens which could be interesting.
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
There are companies around that cluster their diodes under their lenses. Can't remember exactly which ones, but most cluster three 1w diodes together and call them 3w panels, misleading. I also saw a company that clusters two or three 3w diodes under a single lens which could be interesting.
I think Cammie has been pushing a cluster of sorts but i don't know if it is a full spectrum cluster or just the 3 diodes under a single lens type of thing. I have also seen a revolutionary lens that he purported to have on his website but have not seen much about it.
 

BlackMesa

Active Member
Are you talking about something like this:



This is a Blackstar but I I would guess that spreading the diode's out would be the way to go because your not actually even spreading them to begin with if you follow me. Say a 180W panel has a 8" X 17" section of diodes now notice how the next model up that has a higher wattage is only slightly larger at say 9" X 18" so rather then maintain the pattern and placement of the the 180W, they just end up tightening up the pattern by throwing more diode's in. So if the 180W has all the spectrums in the right place your not actually spreading anything further if you maintained the same diode pattern and placement.

In a nutshell: your not spreading your maintaining.
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
Are you talking about something like this:



This is a Blackstar but I I would guess that spreading the diode's out would be the way to go because your not actually even spreading them to begin with if you follow me. Say a 180W panel has a 8" X 17" section of diodes now notice how the next model up that has a higher wattage is only slightly larger at say 9" X 18" so rather then maintain the pattern and placement of the the 180W, they just end up tightening up the pattern by throwing more diode's in. So if the 180W has all the spectrums in the right place your not actually spreading anything further if you maintained the same diode pattern and placement.

In a nutshell: your not spreading your maintaining.
Each cluster would have to be balanced in terms of spectrum blend, intensity and core saturation, after that then the process of duplicating clusters over a spacing becomes easier, by getting the cluster right you are going to ensure the light spread is even no matter how many clusters providing they are equally spaced and the spacing takes into consideration overlapping of core coverage. I would also like to see cluster in a square shape which is better then circular, every grow room I have ever seen had corners....
 

Bad Karma

Well-Known Member
The newest version of that 500 watt Blackstar has the lights arranged differently.

It has also been reported to be noticeably dimmer then the previous 500W model.
All the new Blackstar models are reportedly dimmer then their previous iterations.
Sounds like Gotham Hydro isn't cranking the diodes as hard as they used to, which could be a good thing for the lifespan of these lights.
 
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