Isn't it a beautiful day.. to get F*CKED? Anyone feeling stimulated yet?

medicineman

New Member
And what about the people that accepted these loans. Reading a loan agreement is not rocket science. Understanding the difference between ARMs, IO, and Regular (Traditional) Mortgages is not rocket scientists.

It seems that you are trying to absolve the idiots that signed the mortgage agreements of their guilt and complicity. Those same idiots that listened to the media go on and on and on about how houses were a sure investment. Those same idiots that bought into all the hype about home prices always going up. Hype that was pushed by advertisers of mortgages, and thus was clearly biased.

Free market, keep on thinking that Med, sooner or later history will flatten you. The crisis was the result of government interference in the markets. Feel good legislation that dictated that banks must make loans to people that could not afford them. When those loans were turned into securities, hedged, traded, insured, re-insured, and then had a massive derivatives market created, the entire foundation of the market was compromised.

Greedy bankers?

I don't see the bankers being any greedier than they were 400 years ago when the idea of Fractional Reserve Banking was created (another problem.)

Of course, the fact that banks are no longer allowed to invest depositor funds is also a contributing factor. Another place where the government interfering in the market has caused problems.

Add onto the fact that it became illegal or difficult for banks to own investment firms and you have another contributing factor in the crisis. Banks have changed their revenue models over the last several decades, but the investment firms haven't. With out access to the millions in revenues that the banks had the investment firms were incapable of covering their losses.

Losses caused by Greed, but the question is what spurred them to act in the fashion that they did. The answer to that must be government regulation.

Inflationary Money Policies that add 3 - 5%/year to returns required just to maintain purchasing power.

Taxes, which also add another 1 - 2% or more to the returns required to just maintain purchasing power.

Of course the bankers also want a real return of 5- 10%, so ontop of the 4 - 7% that the bankers need due to the interference of the government, they need an additional 5 - 10%. Which means they were searching for returns of 9 - 17%. Add overhead, and you probably add requirements for another 3 - 5% in returns, which boosts the total up to 12 - 22%.

There are no safe investments that can return that much. So the banks were forced to invest in higher risk items.

Government Interference in the markets caused this problem.
Look TBT, how many people do you think actually read those 40-60 pages of loan docs? Did you read all the fine print. That's what we pay all those loan fees for, to be assured we're not getting fucked, all the while the greedy bastards are sticking it right up our asses. You find me one person that read all his loan docs, and I'll find you 10,000 that didn't. I made sure to read the part about the interest and payments, and made damn sure it wasn't an ARM. But you see, I have an over 800 credit score, so they werent trying to sell me an ARM. BTW, if there would have been more government interference in the form of regulations, we wouldn't be where we are now. You know I'm right about this.
 

ViRedd

New Member
Vi, you are a fucking Idiot. I'm not leading you anywhere. When I get to be the neighborhood CZAR, I'll use my pull to get you transfered out of your Gulag to be under my supervision, so be nice now while you can or I may have to use creative intelligence gathering techniques on you.
Signed Comrade Medman
Sorry, Med ... but by supporting the Marxists in our government, you ARE leading the way into economic slavery.

Hey man ... you should move back to KommieFornia again. You'd love it here. The Governor just signed the pink slips to lay off 20,000 government workers in a manner that would suit your unionist mentality ... he's laying off those with the least sonority ... not the least efficient, mind you ... the ones with the least seniority.

Again ... WAKE THE FUCK UP!

Vi
 

ResistanceIsFertile

Well-Known Member
That's weird, because I'm listening to Limbaugh, and it was strange to see his words pop up on my screen.
They aren't Marxists, anymore than Bush is a nazi. They're moderate US politicians, the only kind that get elected. Their first job is to coddle corporations and anything they do for the majority is to keep us pacified. That's why FDR pushed the new deal (I wish I could find the quote) because people wanted a whole revolution, so he got them to settle for half of one with him as its leader.
 

ViRedd

New Member
That's weird, because I'm listening to Limbaugh, and it was strange to see his words pop up on my screen.
They aren't Marxists, anymore than Bush is a nazi. They're moderate US politicians, the only kind that get elected. Their first job is to coddle corporations and anything they do for the majority is to keep us pacified. That's why FDR pushed the new deal (I wish I could find the quote) because people wanted a whole revolution, so he got them to settle for half of one with him as its leader.
You think Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Maxine Waters, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd and Barry O'bama are "moderate politicians?" Have you ever considered stand-up comedy? :lol:

And, please don't start posting revisionist history regarding FDR. Some of us who post here know our history ... and subsequently, know the truth.

Vi
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
Look TBT, how many people do you think actually read those 40-60 pages of loan docs? Did you read all the fine print. That's what we pay all those loan fees for, to be assured we're not getting fucked, all the while the greedy bastards are sticking it right up our asses. You find me one person that read all his loan docs, and I'll find you 10,000 that didn't. I made sure to read the part about the interest and payments, and made damn sure it wasn't an ARM. But you see, I have an over 800 credit score, so they werent trying to sell me an ARM. BTW, if there would have been more government interference in the form of regulations, we wouldn't be where we are now. You know I'm right about this.
Actually I think it was just a bit more than 15 pages, maybe as many as 25. It did seem like a thick stack and I did read it. It wasn't about purchasing my own home. I was going to help my parents purchase a home.

I read through, caught some BS about Adjustable Rates, and when between my parents and myself we were not able to resolve the issue (getting the Fixed Rate Mortgage we had told the Real Estate Broker to get) we told the brokers to go to hell.

Now, the funny thing is, that while I did have access to my parents expertise. The documents weren't possible for them to see. So I had to go over them. If I hadn't taken the time to read them, then that BS about an AR wouldn't have been caught, and I'd probably be in the same boat as a lot of idiots (despite having the income to pay for the house, and a guaranteed purchaser.)

Actually, had it panned through I might be better off...

Anyway, the point is that I have no one but myself to thank for reading the documents, instead of blindly accepting the BS that the Broker was feeding me, just as I would have had no one to blame but myself for failing to catch the BS about an Adjustable Rate.
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
Hey HSM... What is Obama supposed to do if the Republicans are going to use Taliban methods as they said... they didn't want to pass the bill for homeowners, yet the Lord Bush Bank Aid gets a swift passage... I wouldn't have given them a minute to read shit.. they wouldn't agree to anything no matter how good it is.. I can't wait till this does actually works and the Republicans get slaughtered at the polls next time around.. this is the perfect example of the politicians being more worried about giving ground than helping people...
the only thing that is going to happen by the government printing money is INFLATION.
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
Look TBT, how many people do you think actually read those 40-60 pages of loan docs? Did you read all the fine print. That's what we pay all those loan fees for, to be assured we're not getting fucked, all the while the greedy bastards are sticking it right up our asses. You find me one person that read all his loan docs, and I'll find you 10,000 that didn't. I made sure to read the part about the interest and payments, and made damn sure it wasn't an ARM. But you see, I have an over 800 credit score, so they werent trying to sell me an ARM. BTW, if there would have been more government interference in the form of regulations, we wouldn't be where we are now. You know I'm right about this.
bush wanted more regulation of the democrat thiefs at fannie mae and freddie mac.the dems but a stop to that shit.and yea..if you have a brain and you are signing a mortgage worth hundreds of thousands of your dollars i would think you have a DUTY to read it if you are not a complete idiot.
 

medicineman

New Member
Sorry, Med ... but by supporting the Marxists in our government, you ARE leading the way into economic slavery.

Hey man ... you should move back to KommieFornia again. You'd love it here. The Governor just signed the pink slips to lay off 20,000 government workers in a manner that would suit your unionist mentality ... he's laying off those with the least sonority ... not the least efficient, mind you ... the ones with the least seniority.

Again ... WAKE THE FUCK UP!

Vi
Vi, Vi, Vi, That's how a fair system works. The ones that were hired last are the first to go in a downturn. It gives the employees something to look forward to, the fact that the longer they are there, the more secure their jobs are. I guess you've had some bad experiences with unions. I have had some moments, of course, but overall, unions have been very good to me. I always worked like my job depended on it, and in the unions I was associated with, there were very few if any that were slackers. To express the illogical idea that all unions are bad is very juvenile. That's like saying all bosses are bad, or that all real estate salesmen are crooks, although that may be closer to the truth than all unions are bad. It may be you that needs a dose of awakeness.
 

ResistanceIsFertile

Well-Known Member
You think Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Maxine Waters, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd and Barry O'bama are "moderate politicians?" Have you ever considered stand-up comedy? :lol:

And, please don't start posting revisionist history regarding FDR. Some of us who post here know our history ... and subsequently, know the truth.

Vi
I know actual Marxists and they are all far too doctrinaire and boring (not to mention creepy looking) to be the kind of multimillionaire popularity contest winners, that you parrot from the right-wing radio comics you get your facts from. I"m disabled and therefore part of their target audience and laugh at jokes like that all day long. They used to make me mad until I realized it's comedy.

As an anarchist, I have no reason not to see the democrats for the moderate republicans they are. Bill Clinton's policies make Nixon look like a pinko.

Sorry it took me awhile to dredge up the FDR quote
I was convinced we’d have a revolution in [the] US and I decided to be its leader and prevent it. I’m a rich man too and have run with your kind of people. I decided half a loaf was better than none - a half loaf for me and a half loaf for you and no revolution.” - Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
I hope that doesn't mess with your version of troof.
 
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