I need some advice for how to best use my small grow space

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PacoDegato

Active Member
Hi, I recently bought a condo and had it gutted and renovated. It is only a 1 BR unit, so, as you can imagine, space is limited. However, I do have a storage area in one private corner that is roughly 30" Deep, 72" Wide, and 84" High. So, about 2 1/2' x 6' with a 7' ceiling.

15 square feet seems like it should be enough space for personal use, but I'm wondering how I can best utilize that space. Later on I might be able to scrounge up another few square feet somewhere if I need to keep a mother somewhere or to start off some clones, but I think I'm going to have to do everything else in this area.

I was originally thinking of trying out some type of NFT setup using PVC, but after doing some more reading I think I'd be better off starting with an Ebb/Flow (Drown & Drain) system as it seems easier for someone new such as myself.

I've mostly been trying to research what I should do for lighting, and I think I'm going to start off just getting some CFLs, but I do plan on getting an HPS rig later. I'm in no rush to flower anything, and I'd actually like to get my practice in on the veg side for a while to make sure everything's working right with that side of it anyway.

I'm also going to be starting from seeds, so if someone could give me some tips on what I need to do before they'll be ready to put in the Ebb/Flow setup I'd appreciate that (or can they start off in there with a weak nute and go from begin to end in the ebb/flow)?

My main issue regarding the space is what I can do when I reach the point of flowering. Since I'll have some plants that need to be on a 12/12 light cycle and others that I'll want to keep on 18/6, I'm not sure what would be the best way to set things up.

Also, any suggestions on the best place to get some "practice" seeds for cheap would be appreciated. The best I've found so far is 420-seeds.com. Anyone deal with them? I can get a cheap strain for like $20 + $10 shipping I think.

Like I said, I'm looking at practicing and developing my abilities, working out the kinks of my room setup, grow technique, lighting, etc. so I don't really care if it's a good smoke or not.

Actually, if there was another plant that was similar enough to learn with that was NOT marijuana, I'd be willing to use that too, but it would have to be a close cousin so things wouldn't be much different when I would switch to the real thing.

Okay, anything anyone can offer, I thank you in advance.

Doug
 
Syriuslydelyrius

Syriuslydelyrius

Well-Known Member
allright.. 15sq ft is larger than what I have and I can support 2 smokers from it. Want to maximize that space then grow smaller plants (either a smaller strain or start flowering earlyer) You could easly take that 7 foot ceeling hight and split it so you have 2 shelves 3.5 feet apart and its easy enough to train and top any strain to keep it under that hight. This then gives you a veg shelf and a flower shelf. My flowering is on bottom and I put my germination dome with seeds on the 2nd shelf right above where the 150w hps is hung for the flowering shelf.

When it comes to CFL's or any lighting for that matter make sure you have 2000(bare min) to 3000(at best) per sq ft. At 15sq ft you should shooting for 45,000 lumens. Going by actual watage those 26w cfl's depending on what light spectrum lets use the 5000k one and they produce 1725 lumens each so you would be talking 26 of those cfls. You can use higher wattage cfl's the 42w ones are 2800 lumens so your still talking 16 of those bulbs. The low wattage cfls are very cheap and if your talking a small amount of SQFT then by all means use them, I personally wouldnt have 26 differant light sockets wired up no matter how perfect the wireing job is done besides the fact that 26 of those bulbs uses 754watts of energy. Higher wattage cfls will also work however they get alot more pricey the higher the wattage. Here are some spec's you might find handy

26w cfl=1725 lumens, 86.34 LPW(lumen per watt) $1.50 to $2.50 ea
42w cfl=2800 lumens, 66.6 LPW $7 to $10
54w per (each 4ft bulb) T5= 5000 lumens, 92.59 LPW ($150 to $300 depending on # of bulbs and size)
65w cfl= 4000 lumens, 61.53 LPW $15 to $20 ea
85w cfl= 5000 lumens, 58.82 LPW $20 to $25 ea
150w cfl = 8200 lumens, 54 LPW $35 to $50 ea
200w cfl = 1000 lumens, 50 LPW $45 to $50 ea
150w hps= 16,000 lumens, 106 LPW $70 to $90
250w hps= 25,600 lumens, 102 LPW $100 to $175
400w hps=50,000 lumens 125 LPW $250 to $350
600w hps = 90,000 lumens, 150 LPW $300 to $400
1000w hps = 140,000 lumens. 140 LPW $300 to $500 ea

Yes the hps are more lumens per watt, just be sure to calculate in the extra electricty and cost of a ventilation fan/system thats pretty much required to cool the heat from them.

As far as "practice seeds" the free ones from that bag of cheap dirt weed are fine for that first grow. If you are going to buy seeds I wouldnt be looking for cheap seeds I would be looking for good genitics. You may also want to look into an auto flowering strain that flowers in a certian amount of time no matter what the light cycle is. The big issue with the auto-strains is that you cant clone them and you will have to atleast selectly seed some buds for seeds to continue the strain. The benifit of them would be that they go from seed to harvest in 9 to 11(strain/condition dependant) weeks so they cycle fast, compaired to the non-auto flowering strains that you have to veg for 1 to 2 months before putting them into there 8 to 11 week flowering pierod. I have grown 12 lowryder#2 plants inside my veg/mother room on 24 hours of light from seed to harvest, when they were done the clones from my white rhino were ready to flower. I would take cuttings from them to be rooted right before i flowered them in the other room. Then start all over with a new batch of lowryder seeds and those clones. Yeah they took up space in the veg room forcing you to flower the other strain earlyer and I didnt use fem seeds so I would get 5 to 8 females, 8 only happened once and the average was close to that 50% mark. Average yeld was 25 to 30g per plant closer to 25 i would think. Giving me 2 lowryder harvests for every 1 white rhino harvest and basicly giving me some bonus buds.

Dont be afraid to ask for advice on here and research, research, research before you start spending money.
 
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PacoDegato

Active Member
Okay, in that case I'm taking my 15sqft and effectively doubling it to 30sqft of surface, although I'm losing half my height.

I'm afraid heat might be a serious problem until I can make sure I can ventilate into the main building exhaust stack (I'll have to cut into the ceiling I JUST had remodeled in order to try to branch off of the duct to bring it into this closet area).

In the meantime, lets say I want to divide the room into two areas, left and right, and avoid the shelf for the start.

If that is the case, I would imagine that I should either go half and half or possibly dedicate more sqft to the flowering area than the veg area, especially since I can directly control how large the plants get in the veg area.

So, let's imagine I have a flowering area of about 2 1/2 x anywhere from 3-4, and 7' high. That would give me from 7 1/2 to 10 sqft of flowering area. That being said, how large of a HPS light can I get away with? I don't want to get one too big and waste electricity and light, but I don't want to get one too small, especially if I might do the shelving later and need a higher wattage as the flowering space grows.

At most I'm thinking a 400W HPS, and I can stick with the CFLs on the Veg Side, and maybe even supplement the Flowering side with some CFL's down low/on the sides.

How does that sound?

By the way, I'm starting off with Ebb & Flow since it looks to be quite easy and almost idiot-proof (we'll see about that...).

My main concern now is making sure I get the correct lamp setup because of the expense, and in figuring out how to vent into that exhaust. If I can't do that, I may have a large heat problem being that I'm not near any windows.

Any ideas/suggestions/etc?

Thanks,

Doug

Syriuslydelyrius said:
allright.. 15sq ft is larger than what I have and I can support 2 smokers from it. Want to maximize that space then grow smaller plants (either a smaller strain or start flowering earlyer) You could easly take that 7 foot ceeling hight and split it so you have 2 shelves 3.5 feet apart and its easy enough to train and top any strain to keep it under that hight. This then gives you a veg shelf and a flower shelf. My flowering is on bottom and I put my germination dome with seeds on the 2nd shelf right above where the 150w hps is hung for the flowering shelf.

When it comes to CFL's or any lighting for that matter make sure you have 2000(bare min) to 3000(at best) per sq ft. At 15sq ft you should shooting for 45,000 lumens. Going by actual watage those 26w cfl's depending on what light spectrum lets use the 5000k one and they produce 1725 lumens each so you would be talking 26 of those cfls. You can use higher wattage cfl's the 42w ones are 2800 lumens so your still talking 16 of those bulbs. The low wattage cfls are very cheap and if your talking a small amount of SQFT then by all means use them, I personally wouldnt have 26 differant light sockets wired up no matter how perfect the wireing job is done besides the fact that 26 of those bulbs uses 754watts of energy. Higher wattage cfls will also work however they get alot more pricey the higher the wattage. Here are some spec's you might find handy

26w cfl=1725 lumens, 86.34 LPW(lumen per watt) $1.50 to $2.50 ea
42w cfl=2800 lumens, 66.6 LPW $7 to $10
54w per (each 4ft bulb) T5= 5000 lumens, 92.59 LPW ($150 to $300 depending on # of bulbs and size)
65w cfl= 4000 lumens, 61.53 LPW $15 to $20 ea
85w cfl= 5000 lumens, 58.82 LPW $20 to $25 ea
150w cfl = 8200 lumens, 54 LPW $35 to $50 ea
200w cfl = 1000 lumens, 50 LPW $45 to $50 ea
150w hps= 16,000 lumens, 106 LPW $70 to $90
250w hps= 25,600 lumens, 102 LPW $100 to $175
400w hps=50,000 lumens 125 LPW $250 to $350
600w hps = 90,000 lumens, 150 LPW $300 to $400
1000w hps = 140,000 lumens. 140 LPW $300 to $500 ea

Yes the hps are more lumens per watt, just be sure to calculate in the extra electricty and cost of a ventilation fan/system thats pretty much required to cool the heat from them.

As far as "practice seeds" the free ones from that bag of cheap dirt weed are fine for that first grow. If you are going to buy seeds I wouldnt be looking for cheap seeds I would be looking for good genitics. You may also want to look into an auto flowering strain that flowers in a certian amount of time no matter what the light cycle is. The big issue with the auto-strains is that you cant clone them and you will have to atleast selectly seed some buds for seeds to continue the strain. The benifit of them would be that they go from seed to harvest in 9 to 11(strain/condition dependant) weeks so they cycle fast, compaired to the non-auto flowering strains that you have to veg for 1 to 2 months before putting them into there 8 to 11 week flowering pierod. I have grown 12 lowryder#2 plants inside my veg/mother room on 24 hours of light from seed to harvest, when they were done the clones from my white rhino were ready to flower. I would take cuttings from them to be rooted right before i flowered them in the other room. Then start all over with a new batch of lowryder seeds and those clones. Yeah they took up space in the veg room forcing you to flower the other strain earlyer and I didnt use fem seeds so I would get 5 to 8 females, 8 only happened once and the average was close to that 50% mark. Average yeld was 25 to 30g per plant closer to 25 i would think. Giving me 2 lowryder harvests for every 1 white rhino harvest and basicly giving me some bonus buds.

Dont be afraid to ask for advice on here and research, research, research before you start spending money.
Click to expand...
 
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BloodShot420

Well-Known Member
i dont think you have to worry about putting to much light in that closet... i have one that is about the same size, and i use an ebb/flow system too.

my room is about 3ft x 7ft but the ceiling is sloped downard, its about 4' tall after 7'ft (its under the stairs).

i installed a screen to level the canopy of the plants and i put in 2000watts in air cooled hoods. the screen is 24" x 84".

i usually grow about 6 plants per run, veg them for 3 weeks and flower them... i just cut one down that was a monster and occupied 2ftx3ft = 6sq ft of screen and it yielded about 16 oz...

i'm lighting my room to about 100w/sq ft, double the "norm"... but the light to yield relationship is pretty much linear up to something past 100w/sq ft..

as a new grower, plan on harvesting .4-.5 grams per watt of HID you use (doesnt work with cfls). if i were you i would look for two 600w HPS systems... you should be able to start pulling at least 1lb out of that closet if you can keep it mildly cool ;-)

i just buy feminized seeds and dedicate my whole closet to flowering... the important part
 
Syriuslydelyrius

Syriuslydelyrius

Well-Known Member
PacoDegato said:
Okay, in that case I'm taking my 15sqft and effectively doubling it to 30sqft of surface, although I'm losing half my height.

I'm afraid heat might be a serious problem until I can make sure I can ventilate into the main building exhaust stack (I'll have to cut into the ceiling I JUST had remodeled in order to try to branch off of the duct to bring it into this closet area).

In the meantime, lets say I want to divide the room into two areas, left and right, and avoid the shelf for the start.

If that is the case, I would imagine that I should either go half and half or possibly dedicate more sqft to the flowering area than the veg area, especially since I can directly control how large the plants get in the veg area.

So, let's imagine I have a flowering area of about 2 1/2 x anywhere from 3-4, and 7' high. That would give me from 7 1/2 to 10 sqft of flowering area. That being said, how large of a HPS light can I get away with? I don't want to get one too big and waste electricity and light, but I don't want to get one too small, especially if I might do the shelving later and need a higher wattage as the flowering space grows.

At most I'm thinking a 400W HPS, and I can stick with the CFLs on the Veg Side, and maybe even supplement the Flowering side with some CFL's down low/on the sides.

How does that sound?

By the way, I'm starting off with Ebb & Flow since it looks to be quite easy and almost idiot-proof (we'll see about that...).

My main concern now is making sure I get the correct lamp setup because of the expense, and in figuring out how to vent into that exhaust. If I can't do that, I may have a large heat problem being that I'm not near any windows.

Any ideas/suggestions/etc?

Thanks,

Doug
Click to expand...
Your options are endless and you may hear opposing advice from differant people. There are an endless amount of differant ways to acomplish a harvest and yes some work better than others but the ones that work the best are the ones that work for you.

What I have tried to do is give some info on lighting choices so that you can make the best decision for your self. The same would be for how to decide how to or if should divide up your area.

Basicly what it can all come down to is how much money are you willing to spend. If you can afford multiple 600w hps lamps, movers, co2, full inviromental controlls, large cfm fans and the whole 9 yards with the space for it all then sure why not. (you can pretty much spend as much as you want and still want more it can be like a curse rofl)

If start up cost or money is an issue the cfl's are less an investment at startup but are quite not as efficient as HID lights would be. They also dont generate nearly the amount of heat HID lamps do, which is also saving you money on ventilation and climate controll.

Notice that I am not jumping into saying this or that is better. The only comments I am going to make about the differance is that yes I agree that the HPS will give you better yeild. However I must also say that I agree that CFL weed is better tasting/higher quality. This is yet another factor to use to decide apon.

You can also put replacement cost in there as a deciding factor. Depending on the wattage a CFL bulb is good for 8,000 to 12,000 hours where as the 400 to 600w hps bulb is normally good for 24,000 hours. So yes you pay more for the fixture and the bulbs for the HPS but your replacing the bulb atleast 1/2 as much which over a long enough length of time will save money.

So just one last little run down on lights.
cfl's = cheap to buy, not as much lumen per watt as hps, less yield, better quality, and 1/2 the bulb life of hps.

HPS= Costs of ballast, bulbs, fixture, higher CFM cooling fan(s), closer attention to climate and heat control, better yield, and double the life span of CFL's.


As far as splitting the space goes and your wondering to use shelves or split it down the middle. Either here would work however the shelves doubles your floor space by limiting your plant hight to under lets say 3.5ft. There are good shorter strains or any strain you see that states its good for SCROG would work. Its also possible to top, trim, and train a large plant to fit your grow space.
 
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PacoDegato

Active Member
Thanks Bro, I really appreciate the advice. Man I just cannot WAIT to get back into the condo so I can get things rolling. I set up my ebb/flow where I am now in the meantime, but I doubt I'll go beyond vegging here.

Pac
 
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