Hmmmm.dilema.need help!

devestating

devestating

Active Member
Hey RIU.org my box is in my cellar where its cold. 10*C and 90% humidity. I Put my light on for a few hours today and added a 2 speed fan (i put it on low) So i come back to check and to my suprise it was 20*C and 70%Humidity. Now i dont plan on buying some fancy dehumidifier cause ive spent a ton of money building my grow box allready. im just wondering if i should use Tin foil in order to increase the temperature. also maybe if i increased the fan speed the humidity would go down ?
 
torontoone

torontoone

Well-Known Member
Get either "Emergency Blankets" or a stamped foil like insulating material from
your local hardware superstore. They make the insulation in sheets used for insulating
garage doors and such. Emergency blankets are sheets of coated mylar that are
great radiant hear barriers. You can always cover the outside of your box with foam
or fiberglass insulation as well.

Tin foil tends to create "Hot Spots" on your plants and is a horrible light relector - thus not recommended inside the box.

As for the fan - YES - you are correct - more air movement = lower humidity !

Hope this helps !
 
devestating

devestating

Active Member
torontoone said:
Get either "Emergency Blankets" or a stamped foil like insulating material from
your local hardware superstore. They make the insulation in sheets used for insulating
garage doors and such. Emergency blankets are sheets of coated mylar that are
great radiant hear barriers. You can always cover the outside of your box with foam
or fiberglass insulation as well.

Tin foil tends to create "Hot Spots" on your plants and is a horrible light relector - thus not recommended inside the box.

As for the fan - YES - you are correct - more air movement = lower humidity !

Hope this helps !
Click to expand...
Sweet deal man. thanks alot. do you think big sheets of half inch styrofoam would help insulate it ? its readily availble and dirt cheap. i think i will cover the inside with emergency blankets. does it matter which side ? is there a shiny side and a dull side like foil or no ?
 
Brick Top

Brick Top

New Member
torontoone said:
Get either "Emergency Blankets" or a stamped foil like insulating material from
your local hardware superstore.

Emergency blankets are sheets of coated mylar that are
great radiant hear barriers.

Tin foil tends to create "Hot Spots" on your plants and is a horrible light relector - thus not recommended inside the box.
Click to expand...

Don’t use aluminum foil and don’t use emergency blankets. They’re both junk.

GrowRoom Reflectivity
permalink

Choosing the right surface for the walls of your grow room is very important, as up to 40% of your total yield comes from the edge, and the right wall surface can increase the amount of light those plants receive by up to 30%! Artificial lighting diminishes exponentially with distance, so it is important to ‘contain’ as much of this light as possible, and direct it accordingly. Reflective surfaces also help illuminate the lower portions of the garden, providing lower buds with light and heat energy.

To get the best results with your light and walls, it is important to get the walls as close as possible to your garden to ensure the least amount of light is wasted. As a caveat, the percentages provided are only useful as a general guideline, as they present the range of reflectivity of the particular surfaces. The high percentage presents the best possible circumstances for that material (for example a 99% reflectivity rating for mylar sheeting would be under ideal conditions - no creases, completely flat, no discoloration, etc).

The best way to determine how well your grow room walls reflect light would be to purchase a light meter and measure your light directly; then take an opaque board and hold it a few inches off one of your walls with the light meter below the board in such a fashion that the light reflects off the wall and onto the light meter. You can then compare the difference between the two and determine a percentage from those numbers, the closer the two numbers are, the better your wall reflects light. It is important that in both measurements, your light meter is the same distance from the light, otherwise your results will be skewed.

Also important to note is that radiant light energy refers to electromagnetic (EM) radiation with a wavelength between 400-700 nanometers (nm) and radiant heat energy correlates to EM radiation with a wavelength between 800-2000nm.

Listed below are some of the most commonly used materials used for grow room walls:

Foylon:

A more durable version of mylar, made of spun polyester fabric and reinforced with foil laminate. Foylon is resistant to most solutions, won't tear or fade, and can be wiped or washed clean.

A great solution for growers who are interested in long term use, and though it may be slightly more expensive than mylar, its durability will more than make up for its cost. It has the ability to reflect about 95% of the light and approximately 85% of the heat energy, so a good ventilation system should be used in conjunction with folyon.

A recommended method to attach Foylon to the walls would be using Velcro, as it makes taking it down for cleaning much easier nd reduces the risk of tearing, creasing or bending it. If this is used for your walls, making sure you get it flush with the wall with no pockets of air between it and the wall to prevent hotspots.

Mylar:

A highly reflective polyester film that comes in varying thickness, the most common being 1 and 2 mm thick. The 2mm thick mylar while not quite as durable as the foylon, is fairly rugged. The 1mm thick mylar tears fairly easily, so taking it down for cleaning is quite difficult without damaging it in the process. Both types of mylar are able to reflect approximately 92-97% reflective, giving it the potential to be more reflective than foylon, but because foylon is more easily cleaned without damaging it as well as it being harder to crease, foylon usually ends up being slightly more reflective. Important to note is that mylar reflects radiant heat energy just as well as foylon (around 85%), so proper ventilation is necessary if mylar is used in your grow room. Attaching this to walls can be done in a similar fashion as foylon, and the same caution should be used to avoid creating hotspots in your room. The 1mm thick mylar stands a fair chance of being creased or ripped in the process unfortunately, even if Velcro is used to attach to the walls.

C3 anti-detection film: (I'd sleep better at night if I had this.)

A specialized type of mylar that exhibits the same properties as the 2mm thick mylar, but in addition to reflecting approximately 92-97% of the light, it also is 90% infrared proof, making your grow room all but invisible to IR scanning. This can also be attached in the same manner as foylon or mylar, and the same caution should be used to avoid creating hotspots in your room.

Flat white paint:

Self explanatory; a great option for large grow rooms or for people who are interested in a low maintenance wall. Flat white paint has the ability to reflect between 75-85% of the light, and does not create hotspots. Adding a fungicide is recommended when painting.

Glossy and eggshell whites not reflect light as efficiently as flat white. Semi-gloss paint for example, only has the ability to reflect between 55-60% of the light. Also important to remember when using paint is that any smears or blemishes on the surface take away from how reflective the wall is so care should be taken to avoid marking or staining the walls. Titanium white paint is very reflective; however it is usually only used on reflectors due to its high cost.


White/Black plastic (also known as panda plastic or "poly"):

"Poly" is useful if you are setting up a temporary grow room or don’t want to damage the walls. Poly is easily cleaned.

The purpose of the black side is to not allow any light to pass through the plastic, which ensures your dark cycle remains dark. The white side is 75-90% reflective. Choose a 6 "mill" thickness of poly for maximum light blockage and duribility.

If this plastic is put too close to the light, you will obviously melt it so be careful!. Panda plastic does not create hotspots. Poly can be attached to the walls by using carpenter’s nails or using tape glue or similar means. This can be used as a cheap alternative to mylar if painting your grow room is out of the question.

Polystyrene Foam Sheeting (more commonly known as Styrofoam):

This is excellent for harsh environment growrooms (your attic for example), provided you have a good ventilation system and a way to keep the temperatures from rising too high (an a/c unit or similar) as it is an excellent insulator.

It is also a great material for use in a temporary setup or for use as a "travelling reflector" on a light mover, where weight is a concern. It is approximately 75-85% light reflective so it is comparable to using a flat white paint. Foam will not create hot spots. Rigid foam can be purchased in sheets, and can be used as a free standing wall or can be taped, glued or nailed to the wall, the last generally being the most successful method.

Emergency Blankets:

These are ultra thin polyester blankets that are sold in most camping stores and are constructed of a single layer of polyester film that is covered with a layer of vapor deposited aluminum.

It is not very effective at reflecting light because it is so thin. Holding it between you and a light source, many small holes are noticed at the intersections of creases and the entire blanket is translucent to begin with, this coupled with the many creases that are in it when you purchase it takes away a significant amount of it reflectivity. It is very easily creased as well which also detracts from its ability to reflect light. And while it is reflects nearly 90% of radiant heat energy, it is only able to reflect around 70% of the light.

The largest advantage of using this type of material is that it is very cheap and therefore easily replaced. Emergency blankets can create hotspots if not attached flush to the wall so it is important that no air gaps exist between it and your supporting wall. The easiest way to attach this is to use tape (Aluminum or metal tape is recommended), as it tears very easily once it is cut or punctured.
Aluminum Foil:

Aluminum foil is no more than 55% reflective - if used, make sure that the dull side is the one that is used to reflect the light. When it becomes creased its reflectivity is even lower (around 35%.) It is also very dangerous to use because it creates hotspots easily, is electrically conductive, and is a fire hazard when it is in close contact with HID lighting. Attaching this to walls is a pain and usually using aluminum tape or glue is the best way. This should only be used as a last resort, and even then its usefulness is questionable.
 
devestating

devestating

Active Member
Thanks bricktop. i'e read this post before in another post. very informative. the problem with my grow box is that its located in my cellar as mentioned above. very shitty enviorment. so i need something to increase the heat. and i dont want to spend a whole lot more money. iv'e allready spent over $500 CND so im kinda breaking the bank here. which of those materials will increase my temperatures the best that all i want to know. And i have a 2 speed fan which lowered my humidity thank fuck. lol it was at 90% now at 65 - 70% with lights on
 
Brick Top

Brick Top

New Member
devestating said:
Thanks bricktop. i'e read this post before in another post. very informative. the problem with my grow box is that its located in my cellar as mentioned above. very shitty enviorment. so i need something to increase the heat. and i dont want to spend a whole lot more money. iv'e allready spent over $500 CND so im kinda breaking the bank here. which of those materials will increase my temperatures the best that all i want to know. And i have a 2 speed fan which lowered my humidity thank fuck. lol it was at 90% now at 65 - 70% with lights on
Click to expand...

How much do you need to increase temperatures? It’s a shame your box if built because you could have incorporated a thing or two into the construction easier than adapting it now. I don’t know how hot they run but you could purchase a roll or to of the heat cables people put in gutters and roof valley’s to melt ice and snow and run then back and forth across the bottom and up the sides. Research those sorts of heat cables and see what temperature they run at and see if that would be enough to heat you to where you need to be.
　
That would kind of make a mess of any reflective material you have and that is why I said it’s a shame the box is built instead of being built because something like that could easily be built into the construction and then you insulate the outside of the box and it keeps all the heat in.
 
devestating

devestating

Active Member
well its just screws. it takes me 10 minutes to take it apart and put it back together again. all ready had to do it twice cause i moved it and wont fit through most doors lol ! so you think maybe fibreglass insulation on the outside or even the inside maybe ? then cover with poly tarp just like in a house ?
 
TheLastJuror

TheLastJuror

Well-Known Member
devestating said:
well its just screws. it takes me 10 minutes to take it apart and put it back together again. all ready had to do it twice cause i moved it and wont fit through most doors lol ! so you think maybe fibreglass insulation on the outside or even the inside maybe ? then cover with poly tarp just like in a house ?
Click to expand...
just like a house my friendbongsmilie
 
Brick Top

Brick Top

New Member
devestating said:
well its just screws. it takes me 10 minutes to take it apart and put it back together again. all ready had to do it twice cause i moved it and wont fit through most doors lol ! so you think maybe fibreglass insulation on the outside or even the inside maybe ? then cover with poly tarp just like in a house ?
Click to expand...

Depending how apart "apart" is and I do not know the box’s construction so I cannot really advise what I might think is best.

In general all I would say would be best would be from inside out … reflective material/heat-cable (in floor and walls)/walls/floor of whatever type construction/insulation on the outside to keep the heat in. Seal it all in like a Thermos.

If your box is of 2 X 4 construction and comes apart enough you could drill holes about one half inch inside the inner-wall/reflective material, and the same thing in the floor, and run heat-cable through the holes running it back and forth snaking it around to get as even of coverage as possible.
　
You could even put the heat cable on the actual floor. You would want to staple it down so it would not move around as you fiddled with your plants but it is waterproof, it is made to be in gutters and melt ice so it is not as if pots could not sit on top of it and some water spill on it now and then.
　
Then you just need to figure out how to do the walls and having good reflectivity.
 
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