GM files for Bankruptcy today...

Microdizzey

Well-Known Member
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2009/06/01/daily2.html
GM files for bankruptcy


General Motors, once the world’s biggest automaker, filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection early Monday, setting up a scenario under which the U.S. government will become GM’s largest shareholder.
Filed in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Manhattan, it marks history's largest filing of its kind for a U.S. manufacturer. It follows months of speculation that the 101-year-old company might have to restructure through the courts, despite desperate attempts by management to avoid the move.
As it turned out, though, bankruptcy was the only way GM could get its hands on the government money it needs to survive. In its filing, GM lists $82.3 billion in assets and $172.8 billion in debts. The New York Times reports that the company's largest creditors are Wilmington Trust Co., representing bondholders holding $22.8 billion in debts; and United Auto Workers affiliates, representing $20.6 billion in employee obligations.
The U.S. government already has injected $20 billion into GM, and will provide an additional $30 billion to keep the company going as it works through bankruptcy. The investment will buy the government a 72.5 percent stake.
That will give government officials more power to name members of the GM board, though they have said they don’t want to get involved in the daily operations of the company.
That may prove to be quite a challenge, given how much government money is involved.
"It's not forever," Bruce Belzowski, associate director of the Automotive Analysis Division at the University of Michigan Transportation Research Institute, told bizjournals in a telephone interview. "If they had a choice, it would be a short period of time. The longer that it stretches out, the more of a political liability it becomes.”
Still, it could take more than a year before GM emerges once more as a publicly traded company.
While most public attention is focused on GM, the automaker's many suppliers are certain to be affected as well.
President Barack Obama is slated to talk about the auto industry shortly before noon. General Motors CEO Fritz Henderson will follow with a news conference of his own.
Obama administration and GM officials have said they want a much smaller, more competitive GM to emerge from the bankruptcy within 60 to 90 days. GM plans to sell or close such brands as Saturn, Saab, Hummer and Pontiac, and will shed 2,600 dealerships. The company will close 11 U.S. manufacturing facilities by the end of 2010.
Plants throughout GM's system will be idled as the company downsizes. The list of facilities GM said will be closed and include two assembly plants -- Pontiac, Mich. (October 2009), and Wilmington, Del. (July 2009) -- and three stamping plants: the previously announced closing in June of Grand Rapids, Mich.; Indianapolis (December 2011); and Mansfield, Ohio (June 2010).
The company will be split into a new GM and an old GM. The new GM will be owned by the U.S. and Canadian governments, the UAW and current bondholders in the company.
So, how much government interference are you guys willing to take?


"Bend over America, we aren't finished!" :hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump::hump:
 

10poitrma

Active Member
my uncle works a GM/Pontiac dealership and just lost his job from those greedy fuckin CEO's cutting them selves MASSIVE paychecks. so ya i care to.
 

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
I own a GMC Jimmy and have had no trouble with it.
But I will say they should have let them go under to start with instead of sticking the tax payer with the bill for something that was going to fail in the end.

The Auto Makers for years have ignored the consumer. They kept making large inefficient trucks and SUVs even when gas prices were going up over $4.00 a gallon.
Not to mention that they are way over priced for what you get.
Let's face it, the Auto industry has gone the way of real estate by pricing themselves out of the market.
The people need to start buying smaller cars and quit buying large trucks trucks and large SUVs as Status symbols. It's time to get real folks.

Then GM decides to cut Saturn of all things. This is like cutting ones nose off to spite their face.
I say let them go under and good riddance.

Time for fuel efficient, more affordable cars.
 

medicineman

New Member
My only concerns are for the thousands that will be unemployed. Not only will GM employees be effected, but thousands more that work for affiliates, dealerships and parts manufacturers. I'm guessing well over 100K will be effected. I've been a Chevy man for most of my life, having owned a few classic chevy cars, and trucks. Went to Chrysler for my last vehicle and am very happy with it, an '04' dodge 1500. I actually get between 18-20 MPG on the highway. Had to modify it a bit, but even in town, If I pussyfoot it I get 14MPG. not bad for a 6,000 lb behemouth.
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
my uncle works a GM/Pontiac dealership and just lost his job from those greedy fuckin CEO's cutting them selves MASSIVE paychecks. so ya i care to.
the dealership he works for probable gave five bucks to the republican party or a candidate.
 

budsmoker87

New Member
this is fucking great. driving cars is the most deterious affect we can have on our environment...and we're one of the few countries where people drive around for sport lol. nascar anyone?

it's not like we didn't KNOW this would happen lol. LOOk @ the world economy, LOOK how our monetary system works. no surprise here. I say the gov't takes some responsibility by employing those who're laid off to rebuild our transportation infrastructure, starting w/clean energy transportation technology or those bullet-trains they have in china that travel like 165mph.
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
budsmoker..you are demanding the government hire all these people who lost their jobs..making WAY WAY WAY MORE than the average american worker..with my and all the other tax payers money..at the rate of 300K to 500K dollars a job to create..that is what it is going to cost...me and you..the tax payer..we are the governments money bags. we are who gets looted to pay these people.please stop asking for these fuckers help in washington..PLEASE...WE CANT AFFORD IT..THEY HAVE BANKRUPTED US..AND YOU JUST WANT THEM TO DRIVE US FURTHER AND DEEPER INTO DEBT? how much harm do you want to do to yourself and your children>? havnt you hurt them enough with this massive federal debt that will never be repaid?
 

budsmoker87

New Member
max, calm down bro. deep breath


i demand that SOMEBODY make moves toward instilling a strong, sustainable infrastructure for transportation. I have no problem with fiscal responsibility, REGARDLESS of whether it's the government's initiatives or not. the gov't has proven itself to be irresponsible in the past few months by taxing us w/all these bailouts- i'm with you on that. they're continuing to throw money @ GM tho...another 20 or 30 billion dollars in the last day or two? that ENRAGES me like you wouldn't believe...especially when anybody with half a peanut-sized brain could understand that these companies will fail even after their file for bankruptcy...and the gov't now owning over 70%...

GM has been around over 100 years. Companies come and go, it's time to move on. It's time to live more sustainable lives without GM but with new, inventive technology for transportation. it needs to happen. Now who do YOU think is gonna make it happen, if not the government? No companies, especially now, could possibly recieve enough funding without help from the government....now it just becomes a battle between the already-established oil companies, and their influence in washington through bribes (oh sorry, meant to say "contributions")
 

budsmoker87

New Member
also, the unions and CEO's were the ones demanding money/patting themselves on their backs and spoiling their own asses. I'd have to say that the majority of the 21,000 workers that are now layed off were probably not CEO's or even part of the unions
 

olosto

New Member
They were union and they were making waaaay too much. When you have that many people that are line laborers making 50+ dollars and hour, there is a problem...
 

budsmoker87

New Member
they were ALL union workers? ok, even if they were...they're out of work now...desperate people will do what it takes. I still say the gov't put them to work re-building smart, sustainable transportation. the days of personal-vehicles served us well...it's time to move on, and the gov't is the only way to finance a new transportation future
 

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
they were ALL union workers? ok, even if they were...they're out of work now...desperate people will do what it takes. I still say the gov't put them to work re-building smart, sustainable transportation. the days of personal-vehicles served us well...it's time to move on, and the gov't is the only way to finance a new transportation future
Why do you advocate fascism? Don't you believe that liberty is "sustainable"?
 

budsmoker87

New Member
whats occuring NOW is fascism. open ur eyes and see what's infront of you

the merger of corporations and gov't=fascism...especially when the people are offered no voice, no say in what happens from business perspectives or a military perspective (pakistan AND iraq for example). they take YOUR money to inflate these companies and the bubble bursts because inflated money is worthless in an economy that's already experiencing a downturn

Everybody continues 2 jump on this "obama is a socialist" train, and i've asked MANY people to explain it to me cuz I really wanna see how/why they feel it's socialism. In socialism, purchasing power (whether through capital or commerce) is in the hands of the people, not the federal government. therefore it puts us in control. HOW are we in control of our government's actions, HOW?! the community, as a whole, does not control the production/distribution of capital with companies like GM, we only PAY for it...and we're continuing to pay for this company, and it's unsustainable cuz it WILL COLLAPSE REGARDLESS, haven't we seen what happens when gov't intervenes and props up companies that don't last?

And I'll tell you what's not sustainable- 20th century transportation in the 21st century...and government IS the only option, they're the only ones with the FUNDS to make it happen. You guys think i'm all about government intervention, clearly I've seen what's happened with chrysler, GM, and all the other bailouts and i'm not...but DO YOU think it could happen ANY other way? You guys argue your points with such mob-like mentality. this isn't about "picking sides and sticking to your guns." I'm all about less gov't and more liberty by law, not by authority.

So what IS sustainable then? Advancements in transportation technology-bullet drains, subways, which i stated in an earlier post. Put people back in business by taking the SMARt, sustainable approach to transportation. sorry spoiled americans, you might have to give up the luxury of driving everywhere in ur own personal car.

Remember how quick the US stopped producing cars and began producing weapons when we entered WWII? this could all happen @ the drop of a hat if OIL companies and the politicians in their pockets would back down. CLEAN COAL DOESN't EXISt, yet u hear about such ridiculous propoganda constantly, breathing it down our throats to gain consumer approval. Don't you think the oil companies and their influence on the politicians might be a reason why the politicians refused to let companies like GM and chrysler fail?
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
they were ALL union workers? ok, even if they were...they're out of work now...desperate people will do what it takes. I still say the gov't put them to work re-building smart, sustainable transportation. the days of personal-vehicles served us well...it's time to move on, and the gov't is the only way to finance a new transportation future
so..you think its cool to hire these people and me and you pay 500K a person to the government to hire them? WAKE UP..WAKE THE FUCK UP....
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
I own a GMC Jimmy and have had no trouble with it.
But I will say they should have let them go under to start with instead of sticking the tax payer with the bill for something that was going to fail in the end.

The Auto Makers for years have ignored the consumer. They kept making large inefficient trucks and SUVs even when gas prices were going up over $4.00 a gallon.
Not to mention that they are way over priced for what you get.
Let's face it, the Auto industry has gone the way of real estate by pricing themselves out of the market.
The people need to start buying smaller cars and quit buying large trucks trucks and large SUVs as Status symbols. It's time to get real folks.

Then GM decides to cut Saturn of all things. This is like cutting ones nose off to spite their face.
I say let them go under and good riddance.

Time for fuel efficient, more affordable cars.
I'd disagree about the relativity of large inefficient trucks and SUVs being GM's problem.

The problem wasn't that (there was a market for them)

The problem was that they were forced by their own union (and their CEOs) to try avoiding the small car market because it was unprofitable. So instead of going head to head against Japan/Korea/Germany the Big Three were forced to try flanking them.

Though there were actual mis-steps.

1. Ford's ignoring their Corolla/Camry Killer (Ford Taurus) and letting it end up being neglected despite being ranked #1 car in the United States for several years against the Camry and Corolla.

2. GM's abandonment of the Volt (they actually had to force the initial beta-testers to return the vehicles, perhaps the thought of slowing sales scared them when they realized that with fewer moving parts there would be less need for maintenance and thus fewer people opting for a new car instead of fixing an old one.)


No, the only reason why Ford, GM and Chrysler aren't dead is because of the Trucks and SUVs. Their flaw was not using their advantage their to push back into Cars by leap-frogging a generation or two ahead of Japan/Korea/Germany.
 
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