Fresh air advice anyone?

Frutek

Member
This is my problem, the box is not that small, i have 1x in & out fan and 6 cfls and i have allready tryed 2 plants in it but it just doesn't work!
The temps get between 20-24 celsius wich i think isnt to hot, no nutes where added and it's not the soil because the plant is still in the same soil & is doing well on a window ledge with barely any sun(2ft snow outside).
Im thinking the problem is fresh air, my room isn't to big and if i smoke just a couple of cigarettes there's hardly any air in the room at all lol, and i 1st of all can't & 2nd to cold get air from outside directley in the box.
I had a window opend a little for 3 day and freesed my butt of so can anyone give me any advice(beside stoping smoking lol) on this problem?
Here is the link to some progress & problems i had:
https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/295861-2-weeks-old-plant-problem.html
P.S. only the right side of the box is in use, no need for all of it i think.
 

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Frutek

Member
i was changing the light heighs, the closest they were was about 3".
I dont know the oldest leafs start drying untill they die, i put the plant in same soil & everything on a window ledge & it's fine,
i returne it to the box & same thing all over again, even when the light's r like 12" from the foliage.
I dont know what else could it be but air?
 
i was changing the light heighs, the closest they were was about 3".
I dont know the oldest leafs start drying untill they die, i put the plant in same soil & everything on a window ledge & it's fine,
i returne it to the box & same thing all over again, even when the light's r like 12" from the foliage.
I dont know what else could it be but air?
If you need fresh air you should hook an intake fan up to your window with some ducting. Just a small one, maybe like 4". Cover the end with silkscreen to keep bugs out. Put a small oscillating fan in front of the intake to spread it around the room. It would help to put your exhaust on the opposite end of the room so the fresh air will flow through.
 

SickSadLittleWorld

Well-Known Member
Sounds pretty nasty dude. Is is that hard to walk outside or crack a window when you want to smoke? If your indoor air is killing your plants, imagine what its doing to you. What an absolutely disgusting habit...
 

buggin69

Active Member
isn't the plant getting the same air in the window sill as it is in teh box... or is it outside?

i'm confused
 

Frutek

Member
@ univativegrower i like the idea, i was thinkin about drilling a whole in the wall and i can't do that, ill see what i can do about this, thx.
@ SickSadLittleWorld it's -20 celsius outside, open window for 2 mins makes me freeeze my butt off and i have a little heater in my room so it wont help with the bill either.
@ Buggin69 it isn't in my room on a window, it's in the bathroom, sry i forgot to mention that.
 

Frutek

Member
I am about to try some thin sponge as a filter on the intake fan, i really hope it will work because if it doesn't im out of ideas,
the fan on the window wont work, i can't make a big enough whole anywhere without it being to obvious and i really can't have the window opend either.
Spring is on it's way, so this will be my 3rd year outdoor growing but over the rest of the year im screwd if i don't find a way to fix the air problem if it is the air.
If anyone with more expirience could read https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/295861-2-weeks-old-plant-problem.html and maybe help me with it all
i would really epriciate it. Just to mention that it is enough for a plant to spend 1 day in the box and simptoms start showing; the oldest leafs start to turn yellow
and dry, eventually diel.
I am willing to take instructions step by step(eg. put the plant into the box, water it when said, raise or lower the lights, remove it from the box to show someone the progress) if this would help solve the problem,
i know im asking for alot but anything that can help will be apriciated.
Has anyone had the same problem(i repeat that the lights are definetley not to close and this happens as soon i put a plant into the box) and came with a solution?
 

Immature587

Well-Known Member
are you closing the door on that cabinet? because if so there doesn't seem to be any intake or exhaust system going on in there. without a constant change of air those plants will die every time for sure. mystery solved i think. if you cant do that then you're only option is a co2 system but that's probably more than what you want to spend.
 

Frutek

Member
I have been closing the door, but there is an processor pc fan intake(the fan on the pic) & a 220v outake fan just above the lights(that's why it is not visible in the pic).
I close the door because the box is in my room, so the lights can bother me because i have more lights in the box than for my room lol.
 

That 5hit

Well-Known Member
run a dryer hose from a room that has a lot of door traffic like a front room or a back porch (this will insure a good exchanged of fresh air) suck air from this room into your grow area
 

Frutek

Member
i could give it a shot, not sure i will be able to yet.
Do you think a filter of some kind could work?
If i would keep the box closed & put a filter on the intake fan...
 

NL2010

Member
Correctly ventilating your growing area is a vital part of greenhouse/grow room design. Adequate ventilation in the grow room is important for a number of reasons – temperature, humidity, disease and odor control, and fresh/stale air exchange. The calculations that are used to correctly design a ventilation system can be quite complex and require numerous known variables. This will attempt to explain all of those factors, and hopefully aid in designing the ventilation system for your space. Some of the equipment listed here is just for demonstrative purposes and I am not necessarily recommending one fan or product over another, merely using their ratings to demonstrate how to choose components that work together.

How to size your exhaust fan

There are many calculations on the web for sizing a fan for ventilating grow rooms; however, what these calculations fail to take into consideration is the friction loss on carbon filters, increased temperatures from HID lights and CO2, etc. The following calculation can be used as a guide for sizing an exhaust fan for a growing area (keep in mind that this calculation will give you the lowest required CFM required to ventilate the grow room):

Step 1 – Room Volume
First the volume of the room needs to be calculated. To calculate multiply length x width x height of growing area e.g. A room that is 8' x 8' x 8' will have a volume of 512 cubic feet.

Step 2 – CFM Required
The fan should be able to adequately exchange the air in a grow room once every three minutes. Therefore, 512 cubic feet/3 minutes = 171 cfm. This will be the absolute minimum cfm for exchanging the air in a grow room.

Step 3 – Additional factors
Unfortunately, the minimum cfm needed to ventilate a grow room is never quite that simple. Once the grower has calculated the minimum cfm required for their grow room the following additional factors need to be considered:

1. Number of HID lights – add 5% per air cooled light or 10-15% per non-air cooled light.

2. CO2 – add 5% for rooms with CO2 enrichment

3. Filters – if a carbon filter is to be used with the exhaust system then add 20%

4. Ambient temperature – for hot climates (such as Southern California) add 25%, for hot and humid climates (such as Florida) add up to 40%.

Example 1:

In our 8’ x 8’ room we have 2 x 1000w air cooled lights, and we plan to use a carbon filter. We also plan to use CO2 in this room. The ambient temperature is 90°F, however, we will be using air from another room that is air-conditioned.

Minimum Required CFM to ventilate room:

(CFM required for room – step 2) + (CFM required for room – step 2 x 10% (2 air cooled lights)) + (CFM required for room – step 2 x 5% (CO2)) + (CFM required for room – step 2 x 20% (Carbon Filter)) + (Ambient Temperature 0 (Air coming from air-conditioned room)).

= (171cfm) + (171cfm x 10%) +
(171cfm x 5%) + (171cfm x 20%) + ( 0 )

= 231cfm – this is the absolute minimum cfm required to ventilate your room.

The next step would be to match the closest fan to this CFM. As we are using a carbon filter we will need to match the fan with the filter so that the fan that will neatly fit onto the filter. The filter that we will use is a Dutch Breeze Carbon Filter - DFS4. The DFS4 has a 6" flange. Our options for 6" fans are as follows:

- Eco Plus 6” – 440cfm

- Fantech 6” – 252cfm

- Fantech 6” XL – 392cfm

- Elicient 150B – 309cfm

The DFS4 filter has a cfm rating of 255-309, so the fan that we will choose for our room will be the Elicient 6” fan. This will be an ideal fan for this room and carbon filter, since the extra cfm will help compensate for the small amount of ducting we may have to run.

If only step one and two was used (the calculation that is most commonly displayed on garden websites) then the grower would have chosen a 4” fan and a 4” carbon filter; the grower would have soon found out that this fan and carbon filter would have been inadequate for their grow room.

Example 2:

If all the variables are kept the same and we changed the room size from 8’ x 8’ to a 12’ x 12’ then the minimum required CFM would be 519 cfm, thus the fan would be Fantech 8” XL, Elicient 8” or EcoPlus 8” and the DFS5 or DFS6 Dutch Breeze carbon filter.

The Really Simple Method:

If you want to keep things really simple, just remember that you want to replace the air in your grow room every one to three minutes. If you're in a hot area, exchange it every minute; if you're in a cooler area, you can take up to three minutes.

The Very Important and Often Overlooked Intake Port

It is very important to understand that you can't simply put an exhaust fan in a sealed room and expect to suck air out of it. You absolutely must have some kind of opening in the room to allow fresh air to replace the air you are exhausting. If you don't understand this concept, just put your finger over one end of a straw and try sucking out of the other end - you'll find that the walls of the straw collapse inward and that you can't suck any air out. If you were to poke a small hole somewhere in the straw, you will find that you can now suck air through it; the bigger the hole, the more air you can suck. Obviously, any fan you install in your grow room isn't going to be powerful enough to create enough negative pressure to suck the walls inward, but what will happen is that your fan will draw more energy, make more noise, run hotter, break down much sooner than it should, and finally, suck very little (if any) air out of the room. An intake port can be anything from a gap under the door to an open window - even a hole in the wall. The best place for an intake port is diagonally opposite from your exhaust fan; that way, air has to pass across the entire room - very efficient. You can put a piece of screen over the opening to keep insects and animals out, a piece of A/C filter to keep dust out, or a Louvered Shutter or Backdraft Damper that opens when the fan turns on and closes when it turns off. You can also use a Motorized Damper. This gets installed in-line with your ducting and is plugged into whatever device controls your exhaust fan. When your fan turns on, it allows air to pass. When your fan shuts off, it seals completely, preventing CO2, air, odor, etc. from passing. You can get creative with these devices and use one fan to control two rooms, etc.

One last note about intake ports - you will see much better results from your exhaust system if you install a second fan to create an active (as opposed to passive) intake system. Normally, when your exhaust fan sucks air out of your room, air is passively going to get sucked back into the room. By installing a second fan on the intake side, you will reduce the amount of negative pressure created in the grow room, thereby cutting down greatly on the amount of work the exhaust fan has to do and allowing much more air to pass. Ideally, the intake fan should be the same size as the exhaust fan, but it can be a little smaller if necessary. If you're not sure or you don't want to spend the money, start out with just an exhaust fan. If it's not performing as well as you thought it would, try adding an intake fan - you'll smile when you see the difference!

Fan and Carbon Filter Placement

If no carbon filter is being used then place the fan at the highest possible point in the room; the reason for this that hot air rises and it is the hot air that needs to be exhausted. Also, place the fan on the opposite side of your intake. The negative pressure that the fan creates in the room will pull air from the intake opening across the garden and towards the fan. This will bring the fresh air over the plants while displacing the old stale air.

If a carbon filter is being used then place the fan on top of the filter. There are two options that a grower can use with the carbon filter: 1) Suck through the filter or 2) Blow through the filter.

Sucking air through filter is the preferred method. Carbon filters should be placed on the floor standing upright or hung horizontally from the ceiling. Place the fan and filter in the room opposite the intake port. From the fan, attach ducting so as to exhaust the scrubbed air out the room. Keep the ducting as short as possible and avoid any bends in the ducting. Keeping the ducting as short and as straight as possible will reduce the friction loss and noise.

Blowing through the filter is a less commonly used method of exhausting. The benefit is that the fan can be placed at the highest point in the room and the hot air is sucked out of the room and forced through the filter. However, if you're using the fan/filter combination as part of your exhaust system (as opposed to just an odor scrubber), it will need to be placed outside of the growing area.

Before using a carbon filter for the first time always take the filter outside and then first suck, then blow through it before installing it in your growing area. This will blow out any carbon dust which is created in the filter during transport. During normal operation always keep the dust sock on the filter; this stops large dust particles from blocking the filter and will help prolong the life of the filter.

Air Circulation

Always provide your plants with adequate air movement and circulation in the grow room. Air circulation within the room eliminates stale spots and also reduces the formation of micro-climates within the leaf canopy. If air circulation in the grow room is poor then the micro-climate in between the plants increases in humidity and temperature. This can result in mildew and insect problems, as well as less deficiencies. For adequate air circulation use a wall mounted fan; 2-3 fans will provide sufficient air movement. Never switch these fans off unless you are spraying or fogging your room.
 

Frutek

Member
Tnx NL2010 but you didn't really hit the spot there, i do have an intake & an outake(exhaust) fan..my problem is that my room is a bit to hot & doesnt really have enough fresh air(lots of smoke inside heh) at least that seems to be the problem, & the box is in my room.
 
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