Flyers without crawlers - Fungus Gnats or Root Aphids? *Pics*

thecannacove

Well-Known Member
Saturday afternoon I went to take a cutting from one of my ladies (hopefully) - the cutting was actually to be put into flower after roots were established so that I could sex the plant. Anyhow, to my astonishment I found what I thought to be spider mite bites on my leaves, here is Figure 1:

BeUtXJ8.jpg
After seeing this on the one leaf I looked at my plants top to bottom everywhere. Soil, bottoms of leaves, tops of leaves, grow room, etc. Anyhow, after inspecting I saw not a single sign of a spider mite, or any crawler for that matter, and anything I thought might be something, I scoped it at 100% - nada!

HOWEVER, I did have flyers... which I thought was simply harmless gnats or fruit flies. But after seeing the spots on the leaf, I thought I would start doing some research. Which is when I learned about fungus gnats and root aphids. Everything I read about the fungus gnats suggested they were far less harmful and rather easy to rid the garden of. Everything I read about root aphids suggested that they are extremely devastating to a garden and equally as difficult to get rid of. But I also read (about RA) that once flyers are present, it's after a strong population exists, yet I have not seen a SINGLE crawler of anything anywhere - and trust me, I've been looking.. for hours at a time.

I had been thinking they had a calcium and mag. deficiency for a couple of days, so I fed with cal-mag plus Saturday night and clipped all foliage that had any specs or sign of deficiency, etc. Since Saturday, out of all of my plants (11) there may be a max of like 3-5 leaves that have any yellow on them at this point, so it makes me somewhat optimistic about the fate of my plants. But the flyers of course still exist since I haven't treated with anything and won't until I know what I'm attacking. So with that said, I have captured some of these little fuckers and took pictures in hopes the good people on RIU like yourselves may be able to assist in identifying the bastards. Figure numbers provided for easy reference. Without further ado...

Figure 2: wFrQKSm.jpg

Figure 3: F4ZlC7G.jpg

Figure 4: oFMOhrY.jpg

Figure 5: bLdFemy.jpg

Figure 6: Im4dMj6.jpg

Figure 7 (60x Magnification): nwM1KKK.jpg

Figure 8 (60x Magnification): uhkTrcw.jpg

Figure 9 (60x Magnification): zDA3s0n.jpg


Sooo... what do y'all think?

*Optimistically Heartbroken*
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AimAim

Well-Known Member
I think the spots on your leaves are extremely minor and not related to the insect.

I think those first 5 pictures of the critter are real good. Someone will recognize the bastard.
 

seth34

New Member
they live in your soil or reservoir..... I hear if you go in while lights are off an a green light is on u van see the larva pop out of the soil. in my lp aero I USE CONCENTRATED H2O2 and those yellow stickey pads in the air.
 

thecannacove

Well-Known Member
they live in your soil or reservoir..... I hear if you go in while lights are off an a green light is on u van see the larva pop out of the soil. in my lp aero I USE CONCENTRATED H2O2 and those yellow stickey pads in the air.
So what do you think the little fuckers are? I'm growing in organic soil btw, do no hydro reservoirs :)

____________________
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thecannacove

Well-Known Member
Yeah I think your solid unless something crazy starts happening. Put up some sticky traps, little flying fuckers get attached to them real quick.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000I6K3JY/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Good way to monitor what's buzzing around your buzz-weed.
I agree, they are doing really well again :) discoloration on leaves was corrected after giving the girls some cal-mag plus. So no infestation here. Glad it was just a deficiency, I can deal with that lol.

____________________
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Hazey One

Well-Known Member
Those are fungus gnats-been fighting them indoors and out. They live in the top layers of soil and will breed under your pots in the drain areas as well. There are some suggestions of using sand or perlite to layer a dry bed (they hate dry sand and need moisture). I bought Gnatrol to begin a good plan for getting rid of them-sticky traps work awesome in addition to Gnatrol. once adults are stuck no more breeding. Gnatrol attacks the gnat larvae internally-with "worms" or bacteria really :). They work over time and attack other stupid pests as well. Once all the larvae are irradicated no more adults! It's important to get sticky traps to stop them or they will end up stuck to your flowers. Playing cards with fly paper on them etc-lay them on top of the soil or I put double adhesive tape around my pots. They are annoying but somewhat harmless-asexual I believe so get them all stuck to paper! I found that having a good exhaust system and air flow helps a lot too! They hate wind and will run before flying so squish e'm! :)
 

TWS

Well-Known Member
You really need to know for sure if they are gnat's or root aphids. You can find the larva of the gnat with a piece of potato or by looking in the top soil. You can have root aphid flyers and not see them in the soil until they are bad enough to come to the top of the pot (in flower) and having flyers the whole time. Root aphids don't lay eggs or have larva. They are asexual and drop live nyphs > fungus gnats are easy to kill with common methods but if these methods do not get rid of them they are most likely root aphids. The root aphid is all so very active on the top soil flicking it's wings and moving around,they are harder to reach out and clap dead.
 

thecannacove

Well-Known Member
Found an EXTREMELY helpful write-up on these two garden pests. Source:
http://www.kushmagazine.com/knowledge-base/grow/growers-grove-jade-kine/2079-rootaphidsarch-enemyofcannabis


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Diagnosis and Biological Control


Quiet but vicious, root aphids are the worst kind of pest that a Cannabis gardener can face. Commonly confused with fungus gnats, even by experienced growers, root aphids are a separate and significantly more aggressive pest facing Cannabis gardeners today. Proper diagnosis between these pests is crucial in order to control them. Aphids are notorious for their ability to adapt to new environments, especially when it comes to developing resistance to chemical controls. To effectively control these pests using biological methods, insect-eating worms called parasitic nematodes can be recruited to hunt down root aphids. There are also certain types of fungi that infect and grow on insects, killing them in the process. The key to using these biological products effectively is to understand the type of environment that favors the growth of the product, whether it is an insect or a fungus. When properly applied, these biological controls offer more complete control over aphid populations than chemical controls.

Know Your Enemy

Root aphids can quickly build to large infestations if misdiagnosed. The first sign of this terrible pest in plant growth is just a simple yellowing of the leaves from the bottom up. This common effect can also be caused by over-watering, under-watering, under-feeding or pH imbalances. Typically, growers begin to address the yellowing by adjusting one of these variables while the pest populations build quietly in the root zone where they often go unnoticed. Fungus gnats produce flying adults very quickly in their life cycle. But root aphids typically do not form winged adults until the populations in the root zone have reached infestation levels. By the time you see them flying, the roots are covered in many generations of aphids. Inspect the root zone of your garden regularly.


Root aphids (possibly related to the genus Phylloxera although I don't believe that's definitive yet) can enter the garden either as wingless nymphs on infected plants, can fly in as winged adults or can even hitch a ride on the gardener's shoes or clothing. Avoid walking through landscaped, muddy or grassy areas before entering your grow room. Sealing your garden space and filtering your intake air is an excellent preventative measure. Root aphids can vary widely in color, but are typically brown or black when they get larger and are green, reddish, translucent or brown in the younger stages. They are rounded to teardrop-shaped with six legs. Aphids use an appendage that looks like a long, snout-like dagger (called a stylet) to pierce into the roots and suck the sugars from the plant as they are transported down from the leaves into the roots via the vascular tissue. Under a magnifying scope (a 30x or more jewelers loupe works great for easy identification of pests and is cheap and portable), the stylet can be seen by putting the aphid on it's back – the stylet is kept tucked back against the abdomen. From the top view, aphids can be clearly identified by the presence of two short structures protruding from their back end that look like “dual exhaust pipes”. They're called siphunculi and some aphids use them to excrete compounds that signal danger to the other aphids. This mechanism has been called a “pheromone alarm”. Other species of aphids use these structures to excrete defensive compounds. More research is needed to determine the specific function of the siphunculi in Cannabis root aphids.


When it comes to reproduction, aphids are truly incredible. Capable of both sexual and asexual reproduction according to environmental cues, these insects can reproduce at lightning speed when conditions are good, and then later go into sexual reproduction mode to create winged individuals capable of flying to another host plant. Aphids seem to sense how abundant the resources are as they're colonizing. When resources become scarce and/or the population becomes too large, they produce adults with wings in order to move on to the next area of juicy plants. When reproducing asexually (through a process called parthenogenesis), aphid colonies expand quickly due to the mother's ability to give birth to live offspring, many of which are already pregnant with the next generation in them when they are born. As long as there are plenty of roots to infect, they'll keep silently colonizing at top speed and won't produce the easily observable flying individuals until they've already infested the entire root zone of the garden. Another cue they use to know when to make winged adults is the short days and colder temperatures of fall and early winter. During these months, aphids sprout wings and search for a warmer place to destroy crops, like a nice grow room with unfiltered air coming in.


Gnat's So Confusing!

Root aphids are commonly mistaken for fungus gnats, another Cannabis pest that hatches in the root zone and then starts flying around. Compared to root aphids however, fungus gnats are relatively benign. They eat the roots a little and they vector fungal root diseases, but often the plants yield moderately despite the pest even if there's no major grower intervention to control them. Of course, their decent yield of nugs is covered in gnats that got stuck to the resin, which is gross. But bad as that is, root aphids are much, much worse still. They will suck every bit of life out of the plants, pulling them just about back into the medium that they grew out of and then they'll all start flying around trying to find another garden to infest. Plus, they also get stuck to whatever buds remain.

Fungus gnats in the larvae stage don't really look like classic bugs at all. They look like tiny white worms with a black dot on one end - that's its head. Once they mature, they fly around and lay more eggs in the soil surface. You can use a number of different controls, but the bacterium Bti (bacillus thuringiensis israelensis) is organic, effective, safe and available in many different formulations for easy application in any garden. The most important thing to remember is that these products only work for fungus gnats and will not affect root aphids at all. I hear this repeated too often: that growers can treat root aphids with Gnatrol or Mosquito Dunks. This is simply not true and will only cost you valuable time in gaining control.


Fungus gnats and root aphids can both collect on sticky traps and it's not uncommon to have gnats in the same gardens with the root aphids, which can further lead to a misdiagnosis. Differentiating between the pests is easy when looking at the roots, so if you can gently slide a plant out of its pot for inspection, this is the easiest way to see them. The gnats are white worms with black heads and the aphids look like tiny, brownish grapes with legs. The white worms of gnat larvae like to hang out in the top few inches of soil. Aphids tend to colonize on the exposed roots at the edge of the pot and near the drain holes. The aphids vary in size but are roughly the size (and color) of coco fiber grains, making identification in coco more difficult still. Sticky traps can be used to monitor adults of both pests. The wings are roughly the same size between the 2, but the body of the gnat is thin and elongated whereas the aphid body is plump and teardrop-shaped.


Send in the Troops: Parasitic Nematodes

Predatory nematodes are microscopic worms that parasitize and feed on insects. Applying them is like having your own army to battle it out with the aphids – and these are some aggressive soldiers. Nematodes infect by burrowing inside soil pests, then release specific bacteria to kill it. They continue feeding on the inside of the bug while they reproduce as many generations as they can before they've finally consumed everything but the exoskeleton. Then, they break open the cadaver's exterior and a pile of hungry little worms are released to go find more prey. I've used several types of nematodes over the years, but in my experience, heterohabilis bacteriophera is the most effective species. Sold under the brand name NemaSeek by Arbico Organics, these microscopic worms are the most mobile nematode species. Within 48 hours of application, Nematodes will already have infected and slowed the feeding and reproduction of the aphids. Within a week, aphid populations should be devastated and it should be difficult to find moving individuals on the roots. A follow up application should be done if pest populations were extremely high before the first application of nematodes just for good measure.

Nematodes must be shipped quickly and should ideally be applied the day they arrive for maximum viability. Arbico claims they can be stored for a few weeks in the refrigerator, but the sooner the application the better. Most biocontrol suppliers including Arbico will offer the ability to schedule shipments in advance if you know you want to do 2 applications separated by a few weeks for instance. Have your root zone wet before applying the nematodes and mix them in a small amount of water like a bucket. Then apply a small amount of nematode concentrate to each plant site.


Fight Back with Fungi

Beauveria bassiana, (sold under the brand names Mycotrol and Botaniguard), is a fungus that parasitizes insects. Growers will want to obtain the “WP” version, which stands for “Wettable Powder” in order to apply it to the root zone. Spores infect the insect by contact, and then the bug gets sick and dies. The mycelium (fungus roots) of the beauveria bassiana digests the bug’s insides and, in spots where the humidity is high, can actually “mummify” the insect in a cottony-looking growth that is made of more infective spores. It's like the Bubonic Plague for soft-bodied insects. Beauveria bassiana prefers humid conditions but still works on contact at moderate humidity levels. It needs to be significantly humid (85%+) in order to grow new spores and mummify the bug, but the microclimate of the root zone is typically very humid even when the rest of the grow room is not. The major limiting factor in a grow room situation is the fact that high levels of nitrates in the fertilizer solution can kill fungus spores. In soil or soilless mix systems, growers should apply the fungus product by itself without other additives, then reduce their fertilizer concentration for the following few days to week. The lower nutrient levels of cloning and early veg are typically not too much, and later in flowering, the lower nitrogen levels increase the effectiveness of the fungus. It also works well as a preventative measure around the perimeter of the grow space during rainy months, especially if there are landscaped or wooded areas adjacent to the growing environment. Beauveria bassiana is a naturally occurring soil fungus and is compatible with parasitic nematodes. Both organisms are referred to as “entomopathogenic”, meaning they infect bugs. For more information, look up entomopathogenic fungi or entomopathogenic nematodes on Wikipedia, as there are several types of each.


Chemicals, Resistance and The Importance of Hungry Soldiers

Controlling aphids with chemical controls is difficult because of their adaptability and large populations. Most organic (and even inorganic) pesticides fail to completely remove the aphid population. Because aphids give birth to live pregnant young without the need for a mate, it only takes a single individual surviving to re-establish an aphid colony. The new colony started by the resistant individual will tolerate the same chemical application much better next time and many resistant individuals will survive, making it easier to re-establish faster. When using biological organisms to control pests, growers take advantage of the fact that the new parasitic organism wants to live and aggressively take over wherever conditions are favorable.

Because nematodes will die in the absence of prey, they will continue hunting and feeding and reproducing until every last aphid has been found. In fact, the more aphids that get eaten, the more nematodes are being produced. So the last few aphids remaining will face the largest population of nematodes. Because the nematodes will hunt for food until they die from a lack of it, you can be sure they'll look high and low for stubborn, hidden aphids. Also, both nematodes and beauveria bassiana fungus are applied in massive numbers as well, effectively matching the large populations of the aphids. Nematodes are available in packs of 5 million, 10 million and up. Beaveria bassiana spores are released in increments even larger than that.


The only time a grower may want to use an (OMRI approved) organic pesticide as a drench is to create an initial “knock down” of pest populations before application of a biocontrol. For instance, if you discover you have root aphids and you order nematodes right away, it will still take a few days to get them. In some areas, hydroponic stores have started to carry refrigerated nematodes, but if there isn't one locally to you, you'll want to order online with express shipping. In the meanwhile, you can try drenching a refined azadirachtin product such as Azamax or Azatrol. This will reduce their populations significantly and temporarily inhibit their feeding and reproduction as well. I've seen conflicting research on the compatibility of Azamax with predatory nematodes. To be safe, I'd suggest rinsing the Azamax out before applying nematodes.


There are many biocontrol suppliers online. For nematodes, I like Arbico's NemaSeek, but many places have H. bacteriophora available. Some companies also have different shipping days, so it may pay off to shop around. Another good biocontrol supplier is Rincon Vitova – they're based in Southern California and have very good deals on predatory mites (that eat bad mites) and soil inoculants. They also carry nematodes as well. Root aphids are no fun, but there's no need to panic and drench chemicals in the root zone. Nature has provided us with plenty of useful tools to fight this parasite with other aggressive parasites, both nematode and fungal. Inspect your roots regularly, avoid other gardens and if you see them show up - send in the troops to kick their siphunculi into next month.
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Hope this article helps y'all as much as it helped me. Although it was more of a peace of mind kind of thing for me as I am still not 100% certain what these fliers I have are. :leaf:
 

lxrsd

Well-Known Member
they are Fungus Gnats. i had the same problem and got rid of them easy with gnatrol. for the ones flying i used a yellow sticky around the pot. they are attracted to the color yellow. Gnatrol is a highly selective, biological larvicide for use in greenhouses to control fungus gnat larvae. It may be used on a wide variety of ornamentals, as well as all bulb crops, bedding plants and vegetable sets. Once the larvae have ingested Gnatrol, they become paralyzed, stop feeding immediately and die—usually within 24 hour.
 

thecannacove

Well-Known Member
they are Fungus Gnats. i had the same problem and got rid of them easy with gnatrol. for the ones flying i used a yellow sticky around the pot. they are attracted to the color yellow. Gnatrol is a highly selective, biological larvicide for use in greenhouses to control fungus gnat larvae. It may be used on a wide variety of ornamentals, as well as all bulb crops, bedding plants and vegetable sets. Once the larvae have ingested Gnatrol, they become paralyzed, stop feeding immediately and die—usually within 24 hour.
I have to agree with you but the weird thing is, the potato slices on the soil of the plants (to attract the larvae) were completely void of any pests. I saw/have seen absolutely zero signs of any crawler whether it be an RA or a FG larvae. The only conclusion I can truly draw is that they are NOT RA, since the fliers have been around so long, and I just did a transplant on all 11 of my plants to 5 gal pots (they were pot bound), and not one of them had anything that I could see AT ALL in the root zone.
 
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