I like your math, but think you made a poor choice for your LED comparison as that penetration pro wants over $5 per watt when everyone else is charging less than $3 per watt and sell more technologically advanced panels (blackstar 3w is like $2 per watt and GLH 3w is just under $3).Mineralz:
The lights are definitley more up front. For example some killer ones would be the Penetrator 126W Pro or the 357 Magnum ($635 / $750). But here is the thing. A good 400 - 600W HPS with a remote ballast will set you back about $300.00. That's just for the light, hood and ballast. Now you have to also consider "cooling". You need insulated ducting and a good fan. Not a cheap inline fan, but a centrifugal fan. The fan and ducting will be $200 + all day long. Now last but not least you have electricity and bulb changes. Ideally you want to change the bulbs every two grows. After that your yields will start to diminish. Bulbs are $25.00 or more depending on what brand you get. A good Hortilux, Digilux can run up to $100 depending. Yeah thats a lot, but who wouldn't want the best for their plants? If you do 4 grows a year (one every 3 months) with a 600W HPS and change bulbs twice a year, you're looking at $60 - $200 depending on what brand bulb you get. Add the extra electricity (let's say a conservative $15.00 extra a month over an LED) you're looking at $180.00 annually. Of course with the cooling fan running (during lights on) you have more noise. In my case no problem. But if you're in an apartment, or rent part of a multi-family home noise may pose a threat. And chances are you have to have at least "1" fan being used for exhaust.
So here's a breakdown for one year with a 400 - 600W HPS (And these are very realistic for good equipment, not Chinese knock off crap):
- Light / Ballast / Hood (Good quality Brand) $300.00
- Centrifigal Fan $150.00 (And remember for each light you need a fan and ducting! So multiply extra electricity and up front costs)
- Insulated Ducting $ 25.00
- Electricity (Extra over LED @ $15 / mo) $180.00 (Annual)
- (2) Bulb changes @ $35 a bulb $ 70.00 (Annual)
So for one year with an HPS setup you're at about $725.00.
A Penetrator Pro 126W costs $635.00 and a 357 Magnum costs $750.00 (inc no tax and free shipping) from the manufacturer.
And to top it off the "quality" of the bud seems to be better from the grow journals I've read, and people I've spoken to who use them.
Anyhow absolutely no "attitude" intended here Mineralz! Rather I'd like to thank you for bringing up the "cost" factor. Because for most of us (including myself at one point) the initial cost of a good LED is a show stopper.
First LED Grow (126W Penetrator LED) (Growing Short Riders)
- Thread starter adinocr7
- Start date
I like your math, but think you made a poor choice for your LED comparison as that penetration pro wants over $5 per watt when everyone else is charging less than $3 per watt and sell more technologically advanced panels (blackstar 3w is like $2 per watt and GLH 3w is just under $3).
I can't disagree with you. Valid statement! I'd be interested in seeing a Blackstar side by side with a Penetrator Pro or a Magnum 357.
I went with my Penetrator for two reasons:
1. I trust the Hydro Store guy (15 + years growing experience) and he gave me a (full grow from seed to harvest) return policy. If I'm not
satisfied I can bring it back after harvest. No questions asked. Now that's a hell of a warranty and gaurantee!
2. The Hydro guy had about a dozen or more customers who have seen great results from this little 126 watter and the bigger lights as well.
If this continues to go as well as it is, I'll have no regrets on the $475.00 + tax I spent on this unit! So here's to "hoping" for a nice harvest!
Well folks I've finally determined that the one plant is not a Short Rider. Even being bent at 90 degrees it's an inch taller, and the buds are not maturing nearly as quick as the Indica looking plant. I never tied anything down on the Indica looking one. She's stayed short, squat and is literally covered from bottom to top with bud sites. But on a good note the Sativa looking plant will give me some interesting (more head high) smoke. So looks like I'll be in for some variety.
Also I will be sure to keep this journal running until (both) plants are harvested!
Anyhow here are some pics with both plants together:
Here are the pics of the Sativa looking (Mystery) plant:
And here is the quicker maturing (Official) Short Rider:
Also I will be sure to keep this journal running until (both) plants are harvested!
Anyhow here are some pics with both plants together:
Here are the pics of the Sativa looking (Mystery) plant:
And here is the quicker maturing (Official) Short Rider:
A handful of leaves have brown spots on the bottom (Spider Mites). I will say that fortunately the LED makes these issues VERY visible. I was happy to catch it early. So I squeezed in a few minutes to hit the Hydro Store during lunch today. They sold me one of those "Bomb" cans. You basically let it lock and load, shut the doors and walk out (for at least 2 hours).
Well the guy running the store is smart enough to know that would demolish a couple of plants in a 1 1/2' x 2' grow space. So they broke the locking mechanism off the spray can. I took the two girls outside this evening and fogged them both from about 2' away. Very light bursts. I have no worries that they'll be just fine.
Now on to the good stuff . . .
They asked me what I thought of the 126w. Told them I loved it so far and "jestfully" stated I'd be willing to take a hit on a trade in for one of the "Pro Series" 126w Penetrators.
I won't give out numbers (he kindly asked I wouldn't) but they gave me a very generous buy back price. To top that off they ordered up a Pro Series 126w for me and wouldn't except as much as a penny down. They're gonna call me as soon as the new "Pro" comes in. Gonna be about a week or two.
So as this journal continues the Short Rider will be pretty much close to done by the time the lighting is switched out. However the Sativa looking "Mystery" plant will probaby have a good 3 - 4 weeks under the 126w Pro. So I'm looking forward to seeing her flower under that bad boy.
More pictures to come next week. Hope everyone has a good weekend.
Well the guy running the store is smart enough to know that would demolish a couple of plants in a 1 1/2' x 2' grow space. So they broke the locking mechanism off the spray can. I took the two girls outside this evening and fogged them both from about 2' away. Very light bursts. I have no worries that they'll be just fine.
Now on to the good stuff . . .
They asked me what I thought of the 126w. Told them I loved it so far and "jestfully" stated I'd be willing to take a hit on a trade in for one of the "Pro Series" 126w Penetrators.
I won't give out numbers (he kindly asked I wouldn't) but they gave me a very generous buy back price. To top that off they ordered up a Pro Series 126w for me and wouldn't except as much as a penny down. They're gonna call me as soon as the new "Pro" comes in. Gonna be about a week or two.
So as this journal continues the Short Rider will be pretty much close to done by the time the lighting is switched out. However the Sativa looking "Mystery" plant will probaby have a good 3 - 4 weeks under the 126w Pro. So I'm looking forward to seeing her flower under that bad boy.
More pictures to come next week. Hope everyone has a good weekend.
Fadeleaf Farms
Member
Bummer about the mites, but grats on the incoming upgrade. I look forward to hearing how you like the pro compared to the regular. I'm still quite happy with my 126w Pro and should be harvesting my first crop soon so I'll be throwing up some pics and maybe an after the fact journal or something along those lines sometime before too long.
That's interesting the LEDs made the mites more visible. I've actually been noticing the color of the LEDS is making it harder for me to figure out if my plants are ready for harvest. Granted this is my first grow so my lack of experience is probably more the issue, but the pink light does seem like it makes things like scoping the trichomes and taking pics of my grow a bit more complicated. My plants are almost ready... but my trichomes aren't clear or cloudy or amber... they're kinda PINK lol.
Since my grow is in a cabinet inside my closet, its kinda hard to get a bright enough normal colored light in there to use a scope or get very good pics. I've goofed around with a big maglight and moved a desk lamp in there temporarily so I could get a better look under white light with the LEDs off but it still wasnt bright enough to be very useful. I ended up just chopping off some small sample leaves and tossing them under the microscope. I'm gonna try to harvest branch by branch but it looks like I should be starting the process within a few days...
Fadeleaf Farms
Member
I think the hydrogrow marketing people would agree with you... I just got an email from them about their new EXTREME PRO series of lights thats apparently coming soon. "OMG ITS PRO AND EXTREME!" lol I love marketing.
Fed Leaf:
Don't get me wrong. Even with the LED it was next to impossible to see any mites with my naked eyes. However what stood out quite a bit were the tiny brown spots from where they were eating away at the leafs.
Also remember my girls are "very" small. They do not stretch out a lot and can be removed from the cabinet. So when I check them out I always pull both and place them on the washer under the CFL's (not grow lights just basement lighting).
As far as knowing when to harvest I don't have a jewlers loop. I just look at the hairs / pistils (whatever the hell they're called). Once 50% or more are amber I'll harvest. But this time I'm going to let the bottom buds mature a little more before getting pulled.
BTW the leaves under the microscope . . . great idea man! You can't get any better than that for inspection!
ChronicObsession
Well-Known Member
damn those bros sure do charge an ass ton of paper fucking money for some LEDs. The "Penitrator" , is really expensive for such little power. oh well, goes to show about the real price of LEDs. I build and sell 9 watt lamps for the home, LED cool white and warm white, about 150lumens/watt, they go for about 65$, complete illumination circuit. This *amazing* pink and blue screen is only emitting light in the hardest to reproduce spectrums where lumens can be as poor as 15 lumens per watt for blue. I'm sure a better price for the Penitrator for it's power could be reasonable. Are you guys paying in australian dollars? or the antiMJ american dollar? I don't even see what country of origen the lamp is made from their website. No lenses? how do those little LEDs penitrate a canopy without any lenses? I say stick with 3 watt leds or higher, not panels with a bunch of old gen leds for 400$. ha! makes no sense
The Short Rider is on the left, and the Sativa like Mystery Plant on the right. The "Indy" will be ready next week. However the one on the right looks to be a good 2 - 3 weeks out.
Here is a close up of the Short Rider:
Here is the Sativa plant:
Bottom line . . . I'm officially sold on the LED's.
The Pro Series has not arrived yet. But from the results I've seen so far this standard 126w Penetrator (comparable to a 250w HPS) is doing just fine.
Here is a close up of the Short Rider:
Here is the Sativa plant:
Bottom line . . . I'm officially sold on the LED's.
The Pro Series has not arrived yet. But from the results I've seen so far this standard 126w Penetrator (comparable to a 250w HPS) is doing just fine.
Attachments
Yeah the 3 watters penetrate the canopy a hell of a lot better than the 1w diodes. I'll probably have my 126w Pro Series in the next week. My current one uses the 1w LED lights vs. the 3w ones that the Pro Series has. But the Pro Series is $635.00. Fortunately they're giving me a pretty sweet trade in deal on my current light. My hope is that with the 3w LED light the bottom buds will mature and fill out a lot quicker.
So overall with what I've seen with this current light, I am thinking the Pro Series (comparable to a 400w HPS in absorbable light) will grow slightly bigger buds, help the plant grow a little bigger and again ultimately help the lower buds fill out more due to better penetration.
Thanks man. I will say though go with something that rocks. Save up the cash and get a Penetrator Pro Series (126w Minimum) or one of those 357 Magnums. Yeah it's a lot up front for some people. But in the end you'll be glad you spent the extra 200 - 300 bucks.
TillthedayiDIE420
Well-Known Member
Nice grow man i was having a look at the penetrator series, I decided to go with spectra myself but These guys have been on my mind and i would like to see a competition with this guy in it.
Im going to be using stealthgrow vs spectra then both of them combined i was thinking about doing a three way
Im going to be using stealthgrow vs spectra then both of them combined i was thinking about doing a three way
They're lookin really good! Keep em comin. I should have new pics of my girlz up 2morrow. They're starting Week 6 of Flower 
Excellent. Very interested in checking that out.Nice grow man i was having a look at the penetrator series, I decided to go with spectra myself but These guys have been on my mind and i would like to see a competition with this guy in it.
Im going to be using stealthgrow vs spectra then both of them combined i was thinking about doing a three way
There are a lot of good lights. I'm not at all "stuck" on the Penetrator Series. I only decided on that particular brand because I have a local store that stands behind them. So any problems I can take it back and they'll replace it with a brand new one and send mine back to the mfg. I know Spectra is top notch as well. I think you'll be very happy with the results.
If I was to go with another brand it would be the 357 Magnum. I've seen some really good grows with that light. But again I wouldn't hesitate to get a Spectra either. It's all about what you can get a good deal on, and also how easy it is to get support for your particular light as well.
Don't hesitate to post a link in my thread if you end up doing a grow journal. I'd be happy to have the link for others to see including myself.
I harvested the top buds off the Short Rider. I'm letting the remaining 20% mature a little more before they're clipped.
I also picked up a food dehydrator today for some quicker drying.
Air drying is the best way to go. However I've had bud that was dried in a food dehydrator, and bud (from the same plant) that was air dried. I could not tell the difference. It's when you try to rush the dry time in an oven or anything of that sort when you really ruin the quality.
So once the bottom buds are clipped and dried, I'll do a weigh in and post the results.
And don't forget . . . there is still the Mystery Sativa looking plant. She is filling out very well and should be ready in another few weeks. I'll do a separate weigh in on that one as well.
And of course there will be a smoke report on both plants!
*Everything here within is fictional and for entertainment purposes only*
I also picked up a food dehydrator today for some quicker drying.
Air drying is the best way to go. However I've had bud that was dried in a food dehydrator, and bud (from the same plant) that was air dried. I could not tell the difference. It's when you try to rush the dry time in an oven or anything of that sort when you really ruin the quality.
So once the bottom buds are clipped and dried, I'll do a weigh in and post the results.
And don't forget . . . there is still the Mystery Sativa looking plant. She is filling out very well and should be ready in another few weeks. I'll do a separate weigh in on that one as well.
And of course there will be a smoke report on both plants!
*Everything here within is fictional and for entertainment purposes only*
ninjagaiden
Well-Known Member
i know you are happy with your results. i can only promise you can do much better with other lamps.
please stop supporting the scam company known as HGL.
p.s., i used to have 2 penetrators, same model as you.
please stop supporting the scam company known as HGL.
p.s., i used to have 2 penetrators, same model as you.
TillthedayiDIE420
Well-Known Member
Very true my friend very true. I want to check out these 357 magnums and i will let ya know when she is up and running