Fertilizer free, mouth watering from A to Z

karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
No amendments, only water (my well is 8.1 pH). Worm castings, about 30 pounds per plant with the straw top dressed with broadcasted castings prior to a replanting anf just prior to a spring rain. These castings where delivered by home depot by the ton. They have been outside in the soil for almost a month. The largest are almost 6 feet. The growth has been almost a foot a week. I have not watered in 2 weeks though the ground is moist and cool under the straw. The metal posts warm the soil a bit too. Left out of the ground, in the sun, they would burn you to touch. In the ground the heat transfers into the soil keeping the cool to them touch. I'm hoping this may deter PM not only with the temps but from the added iron, via rust. Rust away. They will still last 50 years. The plants are connected with carabiners and thin bicycle tubes, crossed to form a barrier between the metal and stem
 

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karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
ANC said:
Some people grow great weed with no inputs, not even watering...
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The best is grown this way. Your quality is from microbial diversity. I have had flavors last saturated after smoking a joint for over 45 minutes.
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
EWC is fertilizer. it has an npk rating. organic fertilizer is fertilizer....it contains most of the same things synthetic nutes contain. plants have never cared whether they're eating organic or synthetic nutes, as long as they're eating.
the whole organic thing is a personal preference, i've smoked organic next to synthetic, and couldn't tell the difference, because the grower knew how to dry and cure.
 
karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
EWC has an NPK of 2-0-0. It's adds microbial diversity. Do you two understand how plants grow in nature? Naturally plants regulate up to 60,000 species of microbes in a healthy soil, feeding them exudates which are mostly carbs, something the soil food web can not produce. Phosphorus, besides creating scar tissue for greedy or beginer growers, besides destroying the DNA, in the soil produces "dead zones." If your smoking organic phosphorus weed or not organic you lack life and quality which is why you can not tell the difference. Is it still this bad out there? If I had lots of worms naturally in my soil would this be an amendment to you? If you grow a plant in pure casting and keep it wet, it will never yellow, like seen in nitrogen deficient plants. Dry out the top of the pot and it will yellow every time. The life replenishes and balances the soil health, it is not from additives.
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
Lol okay first of all if you were growing fertilizer free you would just be planting your plant Into native soil without adding anything to it. Once you add something like worm casting in bulk ...you have now amended the native soil with fertilizer that Does in fact have an NPK rating. Worm castings will vary in the npk ratings because it fully depends on what was given to the worms.
Worms are naturally in soil so no its not an amendment ...you however added 30 pounds of bulk fertilizer to your soil.

I am an organic grower so I understand bacteria and fungus and how important adding an amendment like castings can be.
Not saying what you are doing is wrong or bad just saying that it is not fertilizer free. It is just an organic amendment.
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
karmaxul said:
EWC has an NPK of 2-0-0. It's adds microbial diversity. Do you two understand how plants grow in nature? Naturally plants regulate up to 60,000 species of microbes in a healthy soil, feeding them exudates which are mostly carbs, something the soil food web can not produce. Phosphorus, besides creating scar tissue for greedy or beginer growers, besides destroying the DNA, in the soil produces "dead zones." If your smoking organic phosphorus weed or not organic you lack life and quality which is why you can not tell the difference. Is it still this bad out there? If I had lots of worms naturally in my soil would this be an amendment to you? If you grow a plant in pure casting and keep it wet, it will never yellow, like seen in nitrogen deficient plants. Dry out the top of the pot and it will yellow every time. The life replenishes and balances the soil health, it is not from additives.
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i know botany at least as well as you do, apparently a little better. plants do not care where their food comes from. you are happier doing it your way, the plants could give a shit less.
i feed at low ppm, get run off every time i water, do not flush, and i can tell you, people would not be able to tell the difference in your product and mine. just because you're incapable of getting good results with synthetic nutes, doesn't mean that the rest of the world is bad at it too
 
karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
Call it a fert or if your lucky your healthy soil has three times the worm castings that are made on site. I grew with low ppm's. I had a fert company 13 years ago and were the only organic fert in the first annual organic high times. Elements or botany I am many times your senior. I have grown thousands and taught for many many years. I accept your challenges though regarding plants cycles. Let's see your leaf size? What ppm do you consider low? I've spoke with some of the best growers in the world including Jorge Cervantes, Elaine Ingham and Jeff Lowenfel. Let's see if you can keep up my boy. I'm also one of the best chemists in the world. Can you tell me of chelation? What level are you at? That 1 foot long leaf is on a plant under 2 foot, feed 8.1pH. Did I mention it was Feb. In Maine so limited light
 

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karmaxul

karmaxul

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Point taken though in terms of ions added what I added is very low. Most ions are stored inside the bacteria. I add enough to sustain the cycle until the cycle becomes natural though never diminishes. Adding ions in most cases kills life. Over 50ppm life suffers. Much less with phosphorus which in any forest is .001ppm. Phosphorus weed is junk, organic synthetic, whatever asnd will never be close to castings quality. Try it, it's magic. Wet tops dry feet indoors
 
karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
Nitrates build up with lack of life. Nitrates cause people cancer as well as weeds. We eat protein not nitrates. Extracts get dangerous with nitrate levels increased. The industry is going to the ones who kept it illegasl and growers who say they love the plant go support these entities while the genetics suffer. 90 percent of seed breeders should not be breeding. Bunch of phosphorus junkies, everywhere. Harvesters, not growers
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
i know a chelating agent is used to both preserve and keep nutrients from forming chemical bonds that will render them inert.
in medicine they're used for the opposite, as a way to bond unwanted substances in the body and remove them when the chelating agent is "expelled".
to me low ppm is under 200 in veg, under 600 at the high point in flower.
someone as educated and urbane as you claim to be, shouldn't be quite so opinionated. you should be aware by now that your way is not only not the only way, it's not the best way....for everyone, or every situation.
if you will notice, i've never said there was anything wrong with organics. all i've said is there's nothing wrong with synthetics either. i don't think what fertilizer or method you choose to use will make you a superior grower. i think learning from your mistakes, listening to people who get good results, and reading good, reliable information about general botany and plant growth will make you a better grower. learning to listen to your plants makes you a superior grower. if you can grow in dirt, organically, if you can build super soil, if you can use dry salts or synthetic nutes, and grow a good, consistent product, then you're a superior grower
i've grown outside since 1980, and did it all "organically", digging many many holes and amending mountains of soil.
i moved inside a few years ago when my spot was sold to new owners. taken me most of it to learn the difference between indoor and outdoor growing, and the last two, i'm pretty damn happy, as are all of my customers.
so don't be so defensive, no one's saying your way is wrong, just that it's not the only way to get good results
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
karmaxul said:
Nitrates build up with lack of life. Nitrates cause people cancer as well as weeds. We eat protein not nitrates. Extracts get dangerous with nitrate levels increased. The industry is going to the ones who kept it illegasl and growers who say they love the plant go support these entities while the genetics suffer. 90 percent of seed breeders should not be breeding. Bunch of phosphorus junkies, everywhere. Harvesters, not growers
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I grow in 100% composted farm manure that is literally teaming with red wigglers.
I don't know if it is the manure, the castings or both but I won't grow in anything else because I have never had such amazing plant health and growth.
It is magic you are right.
 
karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
i know a chelating agent is used to both preserve and keep nutrients from forming chemical bonds that will render them inert.
in medicine they're used for the opposite, as a way to bond unwanted substances in the body and remove them when the chelating agent is "expelled".
to me low ppm is under 200 in veg, under 600 at the high point in flower.
someone as educated and urbane as you claim to be, shouldn't be quite so opinionated. you should be aware by now that your way is not only not the only way, it's not the best way....for everyone, or every situation.
if you will notice, i've never said there was anything wrong with organics. all i've said is there's nothing wrong with synthetics either. i don't think what fertilizer or method you choose to use will make you a superior grower. i think learning from your mistakes, listening to people who get good results, and reading good, reliable information about general botany and plant growth will make you a better grower. learning to listen to your plants makes you a superior grower. if you can grow in dirt, organically, if you can build super soil, if you can use dry salts or synthetic nutes, and grow a good, consistent product, then you're a superior grower
i've grown outside since 1980, and did it all "organically", digging many many holes and amending mountains of soil.
i moved inside a few years ago when my spot was sold to new owners. taken me most of it to learn the difference between indoor and outdoor growing, and the last two, i'm pretty damn happy, as are all of my customers.
so don't be so defensive, no one's saying your way is wrong, just that it's not the only way to get good results
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Chelation is combining an amino acid with a ion. In the soil food web this is balanced and the plant controls it based on its ever changing needs. As a grower to believe force feeding it is healthy you are delusional. Stress, stress and stress. Lab chelation and natural chelation in its self is not even. Your levels are countering each other. Plants use the most N though it's low. N puts off flowering. It keeps plants in veg so people add P to force flower though in the process though kill what the plant needs to be truly happy and healthy. Most elements balance with others. In a good system your calcium to magnesium is 6 to 1. Over 50ppm at one times the health suffers. Trees have no age till death, thery die when the microbial balance suffers. Your thc, is formed in part with terps and polyphenals. Both depend on the natural amino acids of nature's cycles. There is no comparison. Try casting, you'll never go back. Truly magic
 
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karmaxul

karmaxul

Well-Known Member
ganga gurl420 said:
I grow in 100% composted farm manure that is literally teaming with red wigglers.
I don't know if it is the manure, the castings or both but I won't grow in anything else because I have never had such amazing plant health and growth.
It is magic you are right.
Click to expand...
Can you please tell them there is no compare in flavor to magic microbial quality?
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
Lol I will not get into a debate on salts vs. Organics but I will say that I started out synthetic. ... and there are many many reasons I am organic now.
But to each their own. :)
 
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