Extreme root bound example

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spek9

Well-Known Member
I am constantly doing several varoius experiments for many different reasons. Recently, I wanted to hone in on the minimum pot size I could reliably use for an eight week veg, 10-12 week flower cycle in my perpetual. Floor space for the pots isn't an issue, the amount of medium I'm using is. If I can shave a gallon or two off of pot size while still not having to feed less than every 48 hours, I'll save on both medium and nutrients in the long run.

Anyways, here's a plant that was in veg for eight weeks in a two gallon pot with Sunshine mix #4. pH was consistent throughout the grow, as was the nutrient mix (GH Flora for the first half, Jack's 5-12-26, Calcium Nitrate and MKP the second half). The plant had a partner in a three gallon pot with everything being the exact same. The partner plant finished just fine. No problems at all. This plant however, went root bound, and got deficiency crazy.

First was Magnesium, then Nitrogen and Phosphorus showed up simultaneously. The problems started showing up early in stretch. It was quite shorter and smaller than its partner (sorry, no pics, I've already harvested it). After the rainbow of death was nearly complete, the plant stopped growing almost entirely:


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Nefrella

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
I am constantly doing several varoius experiments for many different reasons. Recently, I wanted to hone in on the minimum pot size I could reliably use for an eight week veg, 10-12 week flower cycle in my perpetual. Floor space for the pots isn't an issue, the amount of medium I'm using is. If I can shave a gallon or two off of pot size while still not having to feed less than every 48 hours, I'll save on both medium and nutrients in the long run.

Anyways, here's a plant that was in veg for eight weeks in a two gallon pot with Sunshine mix #4. pH was consistent throughout the grow, as was the nutrient mix (GH Flora for the first half, Jack's 5-12-26, Calcium Nitrate and MKP the second half). The plant had a partner in a three gallon pot with everything being the exact same. The partner plant finished just fine. No problems at all. This plant however, went root bound, and got deficiency crazy.

First was Magnesium, then Nitrogen and Phosphorus showed up simultaneously. The problems started showing up early in stretch. It was quite shorter and smaller than its partner (sorry, no pics, I've already harvested it). After the rainbow of death was nearly complete, the plant stopped growing almost entirely:


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was the return on your harvest enough to justify the 2 gallon vs. the 3 gallon with the nutrient issues you experienced?
 
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spek9

Well-Known Member
Nefrella said:
was the return on your harvest enough to justify the 2 gallon vs. the 3 gallon with the nutrient issues you experienced?
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Definitely not. I'm harvesting the two gal plant now even though it's early (wasn't going to get any bigger, so I'll use it for tinctures) and I doubt I'll get 3.5oz, where in a three gallon pot under ideal circumstances, I get up to 3/4 of a pound per plant.

I also have plants in a four gallon and five gallon just to see if they do better in those sizes, but I'm weeks away from seeing those results.
 
Samwell Seed Well

Samwell Seed Well

Well-Known Member
ebcrew said:
I dunno man, i highly disagree.
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Root bound is a description of the result of many negligent decisions.... its hardly the issue....anyone cant stab where its wet...knowing what makes it wet is the real knowledge, not describing a state.

Rooot bound plants dont exist... only plants not properly being taken care of
 
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DaFreak

Well-Known Member
Why do you think the condition was caused by the size of the pot? I'm assuming that you fed more often etc. Every plant I have every grown in a container was bound when I cut it.
 
Samwell Seed Well

Samwell Seed Well

Well-Known Member
Ive kept mother plants for years in 2 gallon pots, ive keep plants in solo cups that were 3 ft tall...its not the plants roots ever. It is always the grower, the strains needs, its enviroment, its happinstance...but never the plants roots
 
Samwell Seed Well

Samwell Seed Well

Well-Known Member
DaFreak said:
Shot glass challenge comes to mind. I always thought the pot size was more about determining the size of the plant you wanted and then numbers, like either 4 in 5 gallons or 8 in 3 gallons.
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Exactly, only difference between a plant in a solo cup and a plant in a 5 gallon pot us amount of possible roots, if you feed appropriately its not really an issue.

Obviously a root mass of a shot glass will be lesser when in contrast to that of a 5 gallon pot, but design is function and it can be over come in other methods, like fertigarion rate. And when I say overcome i do not mean produce more or be easier to manage, just simply it can be root bound and still produce.
 
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spek9

Well-Known Member
Samwell Seed Well said:
Ive kept mother plants for years in 2 gallon pots, ive keep plants in solo cups that were 3 ft tall...its not the plants roots ever. It is always the grower, the strains needs, its enviroment, its happinstance...but never the plants roots
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If one of my plants can't grow any more roots to sustain itself properly and even if it's fed multiple times per day and it still can't uptake enough liquid, I call that root bound.

I've been trying to find my ideal pot size for my own grows. The plant in the two gallon container was root bound.

Could I have done more work to keep the plant healthy? Probably, but I like to make my life easier, not more complicated. I certainly don't want to do any extra work than I have to, when the solution is to use a larger pot in the first place.
 
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spek9

Well-Known Member
DaFreak said:
Or veg less with more plants
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That's how I used to do things. I find it far more manageable to have fewer plants that are much larger. It's more convenient having four plants in a 4x4' than a bunch of smaller ones. Tons of space to move the plants around and get in there to water.

I've got my perpetual dialed in for harvesting every two weeks, with a two week clone rooting/seed starting and an eight week veg.

Two gallon pots are simply too small for eight weeks of veg (at least for the strain I tested on).
 
MrToad69

MrToad69

Well-Known Member
Spek
I think you have the foundation of a decent plant there...obviously you had some issues. What strain was that one?

As for Samwell...strikes me more as the arrogant type talking out of his ass... no question, timing and nutrient calculations are important to manage a plant...but for him to point fingers at someone whose plant has a healthy root system in simply being a Prick IMO...(I didn't see the advice there Sam..just the criticism)

Just my 2 cents...
 
Samwell Seed Well

Samwell Seed Well

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
If one of my plants can't grow any more roots to sustain itself properly and even if it's fed multiple times per day and it still can't uptake enough liquid, I call that root bound.

I've been trying to find my ideal pot size for my own grows. The plant in the two gallon container was root bound.

Could I have done more work to keep the plant healthy? Probably, but I like to make my life easier, not more complicated. I certainly don't want to do any extra work than I have to, when the solution is to use a larger pot in the first place.
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nothing you or I have said is contradictory. If you cant feed a plant enough to keep it alive, up pot it into a larger pot. but a constant drip system or fertigation on a timer though a manifold and dosa tron would do the same thing.

its never the amount of roots always something else, lots of ways to increase photosynthesis and plant health
 
Samwell Seed Well

Samwell Seed Well

Well-Known Member
MrToad69 said:
Spek
I think you have the foundation of a decent plant there...obviously you had some issues. What strain was that one?

As for Samwell...strikes me more as the arrogant type talking out of his ass... no question, timing and nutrient calculations are important to manage a plant...but for him to point fingers at someone whose plant has a healthy root system in simply being a Prick IMO...(I didn't see the advice there Sam..just the criticism)

Just my 2 cents...
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where did I point any fingers... what or who exactly did I criticize?

by the way Spek, had Mr Toad asked what I think of your plant or my thoughts on its root boundness, id say its healthy, looks like a decent harvest off a 2 or 3 gallon plant.

So what does root boundness as yall describe matter. what was the yield? looks like a QP plus anyone else pulling that from a squat 2 gallon plant

im commenting on the collective misunderstanding of terms commonly used....like root bound. Roots are not the issue.
 
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