Defoliation and CO2

KryptoBud said:

Non defoliators don't know what leaves the plant doesn't need? Can you explain what leaves they don't need and why? The only thing I've ever seen posted is take leaves off at day ?? and then again at day ?? Why are the times to do it so specific? "Leaves block light to bud sites" is the usual answer, never an answer with any substance. The biggest reason this misinformation is around is inexperienced growers regurgitate it constantly. In reality i think you lack the experience to tell the difference. One year growing experience is only a few grows so comparing the first to the third or fourth isn't fair. I'd bet the yield increase has more to do with environment, watering, and feeding experience than the defoliation. I'll add a couple links that show leaves do much more than photosynthesis.

https://www.boundless.com
http://audiophile.tam.cornell.edu/randpdf/grplants.pdf
https://garden.org/courseweb/course1/week2/page10.htm

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u dont need the excess leaves that r blocking new growth from light and u dont need because u want to grow bud, not leaves.. the reason for defoliating in x amount of days is because if u do it to much to often u can over stress the plants and herm em out ,stunt growth etc..u can bet all u want but these were my grows and i know what i did to them .i know i fed them the same nutes and the environment was almost exactly the same as the other. u dont have to believe me . just know i will never pull anything under a pound and a half in my 4x4. next grow im shooting for three pounds and it will all be possible because of defoliating ,not to mention i have a bad ass set up and i know what im doing for the most part. . it baffles me how many ignorant people r actually on this site claiming to be so knowledgeable ,yet they never have pics or vids to prove anything they claim smh... show me a 4x4 grow room that hit 3 pounds that didn't defoliate and ill believe u when u say defoliating doesn't work or isn't needed.. until then just watch us real growers yeild large harvests and u can keep on thinking that defoliating doesn't work..

Dumme said:

It's called an impasse. You believe what ever you want, based on pseudoscience, and I'll keep believing real science, based on fact.

It's time to stop called me back in here for this bs. Its a thread thats a half year old. Troll someone else..

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• jungleboysSome SFVXTK bred by Jungle Boys ..The right amount of "Defoliation" aka de leafing through out the plants cycle is very important knowing how much to take and when to take it. As the plants start to develop in flower you can start getting more aggresive. Some pheno types do better completely stripped down some need to be done over a period of time. It's up to us as growers to know our strains. Yield is greatly increased when the middle and lower growth can get good light penetration through out the entire veg and flower cycle. #jungleboys#playingwithfireson#propdcompliant#alwaysimitatedneverduplicated#ogkings#losangelesfarmers#tlcfarms#thejungleboys

i know u aint trying to argue with the jungleboys. i get my info from real growers not wannabes like u . like i said proof is in the pudding .. fuck what u think u know. look at the proof and take off those glasses of skepticism.

Dumme said:

You must not know what you're doing, cupcake...

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I mean to be fair, the jungle boyz and many like them have their shit down on lock. They defoliate the fuck out of their plants and pull 2-3.5 pounds (allegedly). It could be that they took the time to seriously pheno hunt and have some ladies that love it. I have seen an improvement with defoliation within some of the strains I run, some not so much. I can't say that it does work 100% with every pheno, but it does work for some with me. Arguing the otherside when you DON'T have any evidence other than your "soon to be study" means nothing.

xmatox said:

I mean to be fair, the jungle boyz and many like them have their shit down on lock. They defoliate the fuck out of their plants and pull 2-3.5 pounds (allegedly). It could be that they took the time to seriously pheno hunt and have some ladies that love it. I have seen an improvement with defoliation within some of the strains I run, some not so much. I can't say that it does work 100% with every pheno, but it does work for some with me. Arguing the otherside when you DON'T have any evidence other than your "soon to be study" means nothing.

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I have pictures I'll post tonight, but its not a formal study.

It make zero sense to cut off that in which turns light energy into chemical engery, and the foundation for cell division and growth. If "light" penitration is the goal, the problem lies not with the leaves, but with the light distribution, so add more light.

It seems to me, you have a grow room setup flaw, not a leaf problem...

Commercial growers strive for the largest sized flower, yes, but more so, an even sized flower, for retail. This means the maximum yield may not be reached, but all their product would be pleasing to the eye, and sellable.

...and of course, and video is curbbed with trophy picture, to sell the name brand.

Dumme said:

I have pictures I'll post tonight, but its not a formal study.

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I'll have another look later for the harvest pictures, but here's a photo of 2 clones in the same grow room, both lollipopped the same, same recirculated reservoir water, same nutrients, same lighting, cut from the same mother, and the picture taken at the same angle.

I didn't even have the room to take the picture of the full plant with leaves.

Both yielded well, but the one with leaves definitely had more yield, by far.

Dumme said:

I'll have another look later for the harvest pictures, but here's a photo of 2 clones in the same grow room, both lollipopped the same, same recirculated reservoir water, same nutrients, same lighting, cut from the same mother, and the picture taken at the same angle.
View attachment 3955341
I didn't even have the room to take the picture of the full plant with leaves.

Both yielded well, but the one with leaves definitely had more yield, by far.

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The problem is that every pheno reacts differently with defoliating, so referencing one strain seems useless in my book.

xmatox said:

The problem is that every pheno reacts differently with defoliating, so referencing one strain seems useless in my book.

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This is just an old picture I found, but I'll look for more. I've done this test on a half dozen strains with similar results.

Like I said, I'll have a larger, very documented study late this year on both schwazz, lollipop, and my own technique of leaving on every leaf and only removing specific flower sites.

Bottom line is, again, leaves turn light energy into chemical energy, and energy = bigger flower.

xmatox said:

I mean to be fair, the jungle boyz and many like them have their shit down on lock. They defoliate the fuck out of their plants and pull 2-3.5 pounds (allegedly). It could be that they took the time to seriously pheno hunt and have some ladies that love it. I have seen an improvement with defoliation within some of the strains I run, some not so much. I can't say that it does work 100% with every pheno, but it does work for some with me. Arguing the otherside when you DON'T have any evidence other than your "soon to be study" means nothing.

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exactly..

Dumme said:

This is just an old picture I found, but I'll look for more. I've done this test on a half dozen strains with similar results.

Like I said, I'll have a larger, very documented study late this year on both schwazz, lollipop, and my own technique of leaving on every leaf and only removing specific flower sites.

Bottom line is, again, leaves turn light energy into chemical energy, and energy = bigger flower.

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your a bufoon.. got damn it how can someone be so ignorant.. u get all the proof u need to see that defoliation works yet u still want to disagree .. some people will never learn smh

Dumme said:

I'll have another look later for the harvest pictures, but here's a photo of 2 clones in the same grow room, both lollipopped the same, same recirculated reservoir water, same nutrients, same lighting, cut from the same mother, and the picture taken at the same angle.
View attachment 3955341
I didn't even have the room to take the picture of the full plant with leaves.

Both yielded well, but the one with leaves definitely had more yield, by far.

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thats cute what did u pull an oz lol

needynate said:

your a bufoon.. got damn it how can someone be so ignorant.. u get all the proof u need to see that defoliation works yet u still want to disagree .. some people will never learn smh

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What it taught me is the conformation that cutting off fan leaves limits yield.

needynate said:

thats cute what did u pull an oz lol

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I honestly don't remember. It was a while back before I setup scrog. The schwazz got somewhere in the 2-3oz range, and the full fan leaves on, got me 3-5oz range.

Still trolling I see....

Dumme said:

I have pictures I'll post tonight, but its not a formal study.

It make zero sense to cut off that in which turns light energy into chemical engery, and the foundation for cell division and growth. If "light" penitration is the goal, the problem lies not with the leaves, but with the light distribution, so add more light.

It seems to me, you have a grow room setup flaw, not a leaf problem...

Commercial growers strive for the largest sized flower, yes, but more so, an even sized flower, for retail. This means the maximum yield may not be reached, but all their product would be pleasing to the eye, and sellable.

...and of course, and video is curbbed with trophy picture, to sell the name brand.

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so ur saying the jungleboys defoliate because they have a grow room flaw lmfao .. you fucking wish ! they defoliate because like they said and i quote, "Yield is greatly increased when the middle and lower growth can get good light penetration through out the entire veg and flower cycle".. did u catch that ,they said GREATLY increased ,not kind of increased ... just because defoliating doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it don't work ,obviously.. u can have all the light u need but if leaves are throwing shade like u, it will just be a waste of energy..... funny u called my grow a small ass grow but then u post two baby plants to try to prove ur point lmfao that's hilarious .. here's a video of one of my smallest plants take notes son

Dumme said:

What it taught me is the conformation that cutting off fan leaves limits yield.




I honestly don't remember. It was a while back before I setup scrog. The schwazz got somewhere in the 2-3oz range, and the full fan leaves on, got me 3-5oz range.

Still trolling I see....

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i think ur scale is broke buddie.. my plants average around three 0z and they're way bigger then urs..

needynate said:

so ur saying the jungleboys defoliate because they have a grow room flaw lmfao .. you fucking wish ! they defoliate because like they said and i quote, "Yield is greatly increased when the middle and lower growth can get good light penetration through out the entire veg and flower cycle".. did u catch that ,they said GREATLY increased ,not kind of increased ... just because defoliating doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it don't work ,obviously.. u can have all the light u need but if leaves are throwing shade like u, it will just be a waste of energy..... funny u called my grow a small ass grow but then u post two baby plants to try to prove ur point lmfao that's hilarious .. here's a video of one of my smallest plants take notes son

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What's funny is that you've shown me your grow, and I gave you a picture of a 2 throw away plants, and you think that's my grow, lol.

I don come on RIU to measure dick size, cupcake. I come one here to share and learn. You're responding is very belittling, and stops at strait trolling. Add something productive or get the fuck out. ...and while you're at it, stop speaking for people you've never met, like you're someone special.

You haven't added one thing productive yet..

FYI my last grow was a tad over 1.45gpw, who give a shit about how many oz's... I have one of the most unique gardens in the world.

Dumme said:

What's funny is that you've shown me your grow, and I gave you a picture of a 2 throw away plants, and you think that's my grow, lol.

I don come on RIU to measure dick size, cupcake. I come one here to share and learn. You're responding is very belittling, and stops at strait trolling. Add something productive or get the fuck out. ...and while you're at it, stop speaking for people you've never met, like you're someone special.

You haven't added one thing productive yet..

FYI my last grow was a tad over 1.45gpw, who give a shit about how many oz's... I have one of the most unique gardens in the world.

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im trying to teach u but u refuse to learn . i continually prove my points yet u still are in doubt and refuse to see the facts ,dont get mad get smart..

needynate said:

im trying to teach u but u refuse to learn . i continually prove my points yet u still are in doubt and refuse to see the facts ,dont get mad get smart..

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Maybe you suck at teaching...
Maybe your teaching garbage...

Maybe your too retarded mentally to see you haven't proven anything at all.

..as I said, empirical observation alone is NOT proof, and social conformity is moronic, but please continue...

Dumme said:

What's funny is that you've shown me your grow, and I gave you a picture of a 2 throw away plants, and you think that's my grow, lol.

I don come on RIU to measure dick size, cupcake. I come one here to share and learn. You're responding is very belittling, and stops at strait trolling. Add something productive or get the fuck out. ...and while you're at it, stop speaking for people you've never met, like you're someone special.

You haven't added one thing productive yet..

FYI my last grow was a tad over 1.45gpw, who give a shit about how many oz's... I

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Dumme said:

Maybe you suck at teaching...
Maybe your teaching garbage...

Maybe your too retarded mentally to see you haven't proven anything at all.

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maybe ur an idiot and ur brain capacity is limited.. u have one of the most "unique" gardens in the world ,shut that shit down boy! I've provided proof and plenty of facts ur just oblivious to the truth ,u must be a liberal ..

Coming from you, that means very little.

not once have u responded in a deffense to ur supposed belief that not defoliating creates larger yeilds . u just say that its better but have no proof.. then u start calling people cupcake ,and telling them that they have small ass grows,and that they're retarted . ur the true troll and r the one trying to make this a dick measuring contest . get ur head out of ur ass and take notes instead of being so one sided,...

Dumme said:

Maybe you suck at teaching...
Maybe your teaching garbage...

Maybe your too retarded mentally to see you haven't proven anything at all.

..as I said, empirical observation alone is NOT proof, and social conformity is moronic, but please continue...

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i bet ur an old ass geezer who's stuck to ur old ways and will never learn anything new. funny ur most likely an old fuck, yet ur brain is that of a 15 year old..just keep on getting ur info from jorge cervantez and watch this younger generation accomplish greatness ,while we defoliate and find new more efficient ways to grow.. the future is now , get with the program or get lost...