ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
lol this is one big thread of circle jerking by deniers
Climate Change? Of course. Which way?
- Thread starter Doer
- Start date
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
the vast majority of scientific journals on this
but i dont doubt your ability to cherry pick the ones you like
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
so it's science by consensus?
does everybody get a vote, or only those who publish in journals approved by you?
when you can explain how man made global warming is effecting the climate on mars then maybe ill listen to your theory on how humans are responsible for the current glacial retreat thats been going on since 800ad.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
no its science by evidence and peer review you side is very lacking in that regard
mars is not earth it has no atmosphere, no moon (to keep a steady precession) a different orbit and the pretence that we have an accurate temperature on mars but are unable to do the same for earth with all the measurements we're undertaking speaks volumes about the straws your grasping at
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
mars DOES have an atmosphere, and it has TWO moons. we actually have excellent temperature readings on mars, due to the global surveyor, several probes, and even a few rovers.
mars does have a different orbit. obviously. if it had the same orbit we would be fucked by Anthropogenic Global Impact Warming.
this does not change the fact that the earth's northern hemisphere has been undergoing a glacial retreat since a glacial peak around 800ad (when greenland stopped being green) while the southern hemisphere is experiencing an increase in glaciation.
meanwhile the increase in temps on mars are likewise the result of
variations in solar energy output from the maunder cycle.
variations in the orbit of mars (earth wanders and wobbles a bit too, just not quite as much)
a constant and measurable process of cooling and warming based on the interactions of the various forces at play, the greatest of them being the sun.
here on earth we add in:
volcanic disturbances
biological action sequestering or releasing energy into the environment
human activity
human hubris
human gullibility
human greed
human stupidity
human credulity
human egos
al gore's constant lies and exaggerations
and the tyranny of orthodoxy.
so in a way youre right, most of the "climate change" is being driven by people, but its the HYPE they are driving, not the facts. "climate change" as a concept, as far as anyone has proven yet, is solely a product of human creation, and has no basis in reality or the physical universe.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
mindphuk
Well-Known Member
More bullshit from someone that obviously is using the title "Doctor" as irony or maybe just an honorarium. Your beliefs are counter to what actual scientists have measured, you know the ones that go out into the field and actually measure shit like ice core samples rather than rely on internet rumor and innuendo to support their theories.
Greenland used to be green in 800 AD? LOL! Where did you come up with this gem?
Greenland used to be green in 800 AD? LOL! Where did you come up with this gem?
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
the norse setlements on greenland were doing great until the mini iceage which peaked around 800 ad in the northern hemisphere. this was the cooling that occurred BEFORE the medieval warm period. and yes, before 800 ad-ish greenland was quite habitable. before it froze over. it was called Thule on maps, which for hundreds of years were regarded as fanciful imaginings. till greenland was "rediscovered" by europeans.
this increased glaciation is what drove the visigoths down from the north around 400 ad-ish to cause so many problems fro imperial rome. reports from contemporary authors indicate that the visigoths had been migrating south for some time, ahead of advancing snows and cold winters looking for a warmer place to live.
and let us not forget that after the medieval warm period dark ages monks recorded their failed attempts to invoke jesus to stop the advancing glaciers in switzerland, scandinavia and other areas of europe with glacial problems.
the climate has, does and will continue to cycle.
determining if human emissions play a part in accelerating these changes, and whether or not this is a good thing remains to be determined.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
so many words yet so little evidence... sing it again but this time make it seem like you mean it
"The Medieval Warm Period was not as uniformly warm as we once thought—we can start calling it the Medieval Period again," said the study's lead author, William D'Andrea, a climate scientist at Columbia University's Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory. "Our record indicates that recent summer temperatures on Svalbard are greater than even the warmest periods at that time."
Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2012-09-high-arctic-tops-year-high.html#jCp
Doer
Well-Known Member
Well, do you know what a Parmisian Shot is? It ain't cherries.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
translation = "quick look that way"
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
well weather done changed! stop the presses!
you suffer from the normalcy bias. im old enough to remember when these same assholes were predicting the coming doom by iceages, and we would all have to move down to mexico or freeze. in some cases its EXACTLY THE SAME DUDES! using the same "data" to prove opposite results.
maybe you missed the gist of what i am saying so ill use BIG WORDS!
Last glacial advance ended around 1300 ad. we have had a warming trend since then IN THE NORTHERN HEMISPHERE!
Most reputable actual climatologists with degrees in climatology not ethno-botany or women's studies agree that the trend should continue for another 20-40 years, maybe even 100 years before it peaks, and begins to once again get cooler up here in the northern hemisphere.
meanwhile the exact same trend will occur in the southern hemisphere but in the opposite direction.
this all presumes to occur WITHOUT any human influence since this cycle has occurred since long before the industrial revolution, and some ice cores show it occurred while dinosaurs roamed the earth and we still lived in caves with baby mammoth vacuum cleaners.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
whats that?
a wall of text with zero evidence to back it up?
yeah you're still full of shit
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
translation = "look over there"
if you have something to say about something why dont you just say it? preferably with evidence
i thought you set the tone of the thread very well at the beginning
mindphuk
Well-Known Member
Where's your evidence? Just making claims without citations again I see. How about if you present evidence that Greenland was not covered in an ice sheet since I'm inclined to believe the experts that have studied this, especially the paleoarcheologists that demonstrate it is over 100,000 years old by multiple methodologies.
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
that was a wall of text?
i guess this is just TLDR.
sorry youre so intellectually lazy.
ginjawarrior
Well-Known Member
[h=1]"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence"
[/h]for all your bravado i didnt realise you were that naive
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
yes, once upon a tiime greenland was green and NOT covered by ice. the norse had several settlements there, including the inland valleys (now under massive ice sheets, but 1000+ years in the cooler will do that)
and in that distant time greenland was called Thule. it was on maps used by the greeks the romans, and the cartheginians.
Strabo in his Geography (c. 30), Book I, Chapter 4, mentions Thule in describing Eratosthenes' calculation of "the breadth of the inhabited world" and notes that Pytheas says it "is a six days' sail north of Britain, and is near the frozen sea." But he then doubts this claim, writing that Pytheas has "been found, upon scrutiny, to be an arch falsifier, but the men who have seen Britain and Ierne (Ireland) do not mention Thule, though they speak of other islands, small ones, about Britain." Strabo adds the following in Book II, Chapter 5:
Now Pytheas of Massilia tells us that Thule, the most northerly of the Britannic Islands, is farthest north, and that there the circle of the summer tropic is the same as the Arctic Circle. But from the other writers I learn nothing on the subject—neither that there exists a certain island by the name of Thule, nor whether the northern regions are inhabitable up to the point where the summer tropic becomes the Arctic Circle.
Strabo ultimately concludes, in Book IV, Chapter 5, "Concerning Thule, our historical information is still more uncertain, on account of its outside position; for Thule, of all the countries that are named, is set farthest north."
- Ancient Greeks had a legend of Hyperborea, a land of perpetual sun beyond the “north wind.” Hecataeus (c. 500 BC) says that the holy place of the Hyperboreans, which was built “after the pattern of the spheres,” which lay “in the regions beyond the land of the Celts” on “an island in the ocean” believed to be Thule.
- In 330 B.C., Greek explorer Pytheas of Massalia, while sailing the North Atlantic, discovered what he believed to be Thule. His book About the Oceans gave an account of the journey, but it remains lost.
.
- Cleomedes referenced Pytheas’ journey to Thule, but added no new information.
. - Virgil, c. 37 B.C., coined the term Ultima Thule (Georgics, 1. 30) meaning “farthest land” as a symbolic reference to denote a far-off land or an unattainable goal.
.
- In the 1st century B.C., Greek astronomer Geminus of Rhodes claimed that the etymology of Thule came from an archaic word for the polar night phenomenon – “the place where the sun goes to rest”.
.
- Dionysius Periegetes in his De situ habitabilis orbis also touched upon the subject, as did Martianus Capella.
.
- Roman historian Tacitus, in his 98 A.D. book chronicling the life of his father-in-law, Agricola, describes how the Romans knew that Britain (which Agricola was commander of) was an island. He writes of a Roman ship that circumnavigated Britain, and discovered the Orkney Islands and says the ship’s crew even sighted Thule. However their orders were not to explore there, as winter was at hand.
. - A novel in Greek by Antonius Diogenes entitled The Wonders Beyond Thule appeared c. A.D. 150 or earlier. Gerald N. Sandy, in the introduction to his translation of Photius’ 9th-century summary of The Wonders Beyond Thule, surmises that Thule was “probably Iceland.”
. - Latin grammarian Gaius Julius Solinus in the 3rd century A.D., wrote in his Polyhistor that Thule was a 5 days sail from Orkney:
…Thule, which was distant from Orkney by a voyage of five days and nights, was fruitful and abundant in the lasting yield of its crops.
…Ab Orcadibus Thylen usque dierum ac noctium navigatio est; sed Thyle larga et diutina Pomona copiosa est.
- In the 4th century A.D., Avienus in his Ora Maritima added that during the summer on Thule night lasted only two hours, a clear reference to the midnight sun.
- The 4th century Virgilian commentator Servius also believed that Thule sat close by to the Orkney Islands:
…Thule; an island in the Ocean between the northern and western zone, beyond Britain, near the Orkneys and Ireland; in this way Thule is with the sun in Cancer, in perpetual daylight without night, it is said.
…Thule; insula est Oceani inter septemtrionalem et occidentalem plagam, ultra Britanniam, iuxta Orcades et Hiberniam; in hac Thule cum sol in Cancro est, perpetui dies sine noctibus dicuntur…
- Early in the fifth century A.D., Claudian, in his poem, On the Fourth Consulship of the Emperor Honorius, Book VIII, rhapsodizes on the conquests of the emperor Theodosius I, declaring that the “Orcades [Orkney Islands] ran red with Saxon slaughter; Thule was warm with the blood of Picts; ice-bound Hibernia [Ireland] wept for the heaps of slain Scots.” This implies that Thule was Scotland. But in Against Rufinias, the Second Poem, Claudian writes of “Thule lying icebound beneath the pole-star.”
. - The known world came to be viewed as bounded in the east by India and in the west by Thule, as expressed in the Consolation of Philosophy (c. A.D. 524) by Boethius.…
…For though the earth, as far as India’s shore, tremble before the laws you give, though Thule bow to your service on earth’s farthest bounds, yet if thou canst not drive away black cares, if thou canst not put to flight complaints, then is no true power thine.
- In 551 A.D. Jordanes, in his Getica wrote that Thule sat under the pole-star.
. - Seneca the Younger wrote of a day when new lands will be discovered past Thule. This was later quoted widely in the context of Christopher Columbus’ discovery of America:
…There will come an age in the far-off years when Ocean shall unloose the bonds of things, when the whole broad earth shall be revealed, when Tethys shall disclose new worlds and Thule not be the limit of the lands.
…Venient annis saecula seris, quibus Oceanus vincula rerum laxet et ingens pateat tellus Tethysque novos detegat orbes nec sit terris ultima Thule..
b8ut yeahh im just blowin smoke, i really dont know shit since im not a mathlete and dont have a phd behind my name. and since you obviously cant recognize a reference from literature in my nome du plume, p[erhaps you should re-evaluate you declarations as to who may or may not be ignorant.
you may bow begin criiticising my typing, spelling and grammar.
