Bernie Sanders 2020

Fogdog said:

Trump's and on the left, Sanders' overt racism is giving them cover to come out and into the open about their beliefs. I think the main group are remnants of the silent generation and a majority of the white boomers. They still hold a lot of power. The biggest threat are their voter suppression laws. Through that they can defeat democracy and continue minority rule for a long time. I think we have only begun to fight.

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Lol, now Sanders and Trump are interchangeable as racists, and the boomers, your parents, are responsible for voter suppression laws.

You know you sound unbelievably stupid, right?

BurtMaklin said:

Lol, now Sanders and Trump are interchangeable as racists, and the boomers, your parents, are responsible for voter suppression laws.

You know you sound unbelievably stupid, right?

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You follow me about like a love sick teenage girl, Burt. I'm not that way and don't want your love. You might think that I should be flattered but I'm actually kind of disgusted.

I'm sure you are color blind to Sanders racism but I'll try to explain. Trump is an overt racist. He's the white supremacist president and Sanders is leagues better than him. On the other hand, just about every other Democratic Party candidate is leagues better than Sanders when it comes to leadership on civil rights issues. Sanders is the sneaky kind of liberal systemic racist that typifies the white male dominated Democratic Party of the past. He's the kind of liberal who sells out to the white status quo by protecting the entitled status of white males. His policies do nothing to end institutional racism that is made evident in wage and jobs disparities but also in black people being murdered by cops for being black. In his speeches, he's continuously running down efforts to address inequality, even running down Obama during a town hall meeting held to honor Martin Luther King. Leaders in women's rights and civil rights groups have all said they are invisible in his speeches, policies and actions. But still, he's leagues better than Trump.

He is the comfortable choice for left leaning white men who aren't competent to compete without being given an entitled status. Perhaps you fit that category. No, I'm certain you fit that category.

Bernie is a coward that's going to fold and upset his base again in 2020.....I do like some of his ideas such as med4all along with tuition free public colleges...

ttystikk said:

I asked for your motivation and this seems reasonable.

America certainly does affect the rest of the world; sometimes for the better, more recently increasingly for the worse.

Having recognized that, I support politicians who want to step back from foreign wars and spend more money helping average citizens. For this, I'm viciously attacked here every day.

Think about that- and think about the kind of person it takes to justify warmongering while millions of Americans go hungry and homeless.

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And if your chosen candidate for president doesn’t get nominated you’ll give us Trump? You did say that right? That awfully noble of you .

Bernie certainly isn't advocating for forced sterilization or anything remotely as drastic. Furthermore over population is related to poverty and education. Check out over population by Kurzgesagt. Bernie's platform encourages more education, wealth redistribution from the greedy and corrupt 1 percent and massive corporations to the regular individual, which would all contribute to a stabilized population. Bernie/Yang 2020

LostInEthereal said:

Bernie certainly isn't advocating for forced sterilization or anything remotely as drastic. Furthermore over population is related to poverty and education. Check out over population by Kurzgesagt. Bernie's platform encourages more education, wealth redistribution from the greedy and corrupt 1 percent and massive corporations to the regular individual, which would all contribute to a stabilized population. Bernie/Yang 2020

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Bernie is OK, he's just insufficient.

LostInEthereal said:

Bernie certainly isn't advocating for forced sterilization or anything remotely as drastic. Furthermore over population is related to poverty and education. Check out over population by Kurzgesagt. Bernie's platform encourages more education, wealth redistribution from the greedy and corrupt 1 percent and massive corporations to the regular individual, which would all contribute to a stabilized population. Bernie/Yang 2020

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Do you actually believe Bernie really stands for those things?why doesn't he fight for education/medical care/wealth redistribution instead of folding once the primaries are over... Bernie talks a good game, but he doesn't have any action.

Fogdog said:

Bernie is OK, he's just insufficient.

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In what way is he insufficient? Through the fuckery of the DNC and democratic centralism or by ageist propaganda (meanwhile a senile maniac is in the white-house), or the complete corruption of the entire system?

SB85 said:

Do you actually believe Bernie really stands for those things?why doesn't he fight for education/medical care/wealth redistribution instead of folding once the primaries are over... Bernie talks a good game, but he doesn't have any action.

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Agreed and it's unfortunate. Couple this with Warren's recent reaching out to Hillary.. WTF they screwed you over, call them out on that bullshit

LostInEthereal said:

In what way is he insufficient? Through the fuckery of the DNC and democratic centralism or by ageist propaganda (meanwhile a senile maniac is in the white-house), or the complete corruption of the entire system?

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Why Bernie didn't run on his platform instead of the DNC? the guy had enough support in 2016 to put up a real challenge to the system he claims is the problem.

SB85 said:

Why Bernie run on his platform instead of the DNC? the guy had enough support in 2016 to put up a real challenge to the system he claims is the problem.

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He should have started a third party and forced the hand. A progressive third-party could have easily garnered 10, 15 even 20 percent of the total vote and force the centrists to adopt logical and progressive policies.

ttystikk said:

I asked for your motivation and this seems reasonable.

America certainly does affect the rest of the world; sometimes for the better, more recently increasingly for the worse.

Having recognized that, I support politicians who want to step back from foreign wars and spend more money helping average citizens. For this, I'm viciously attacked here every day.

Think about that- and think about the kind of person it takes to justify warmongering while millions of Americans go hungry and homeless.

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Well thank you for your approval of my reasoning ......... wow.

ttystikk said:

I asked for your motivation and this seems reasonable.

America certainly does affect the rest of the world; sometimes for the better, more recently increasingly for the worse.

Having recognized that, I support politicians who want to step back from foreign wars and spend more money helping average citizens. For this, I'm viciously attacked here every day.

Think about that- and think about the kind of person it takes to justify warmongering while millions of Americans go hungry and homeless.

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Poor little victim.

Don't flatter yourself. You aren't attacked for that and you know it. You are attacked for routinely posting untrue propaganda stories that you refuse to take responsibility for.

Well, that and being a pimp who forced and abused your girlfriend into performing hazardous and unpleasant sex work and then taking most of her money - which informs us how to take your concern for the downtrodden.

LostInEthereal said:

He should have started a third party and forced the hand. A progressive third-party could have easily garnered 10, 15 even 20 percent of the total vote and force the centrists to adopt logical and progressive policies.

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I agree with a lot of his ideas...He is just too cowardly to really put action behind the words. It's going to take a younger person with actually courage to stand on the frontlines for things like medical/education/wealth redistribution.

The crazy thing is they want to label him as some far-left extreme socialist, meanwhile when polled the American populace consistently in 80% or higher agree on his main issues. The overton window has shifted folks, and insane right-wingers, corrupt corporation and their lobbyist tools control the narrative. Don't forget that only 6 major conglomerates control the entirety of cable news, radio, print and a ton of major websites. You're being spoon-fed bullshit at the behest of the corrupt corporate interests. Manufacturing consent.

SB85 said:

I agree with a lot of his ideas...He is just too cowardly to really put action behind the words. It's going to take a younger person with actually courage to stand on the frontlines for things like medical/education/wealth redistribution.

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I agree that if principled he should go much further. I think he's just doing the best he can with the constraints of a broken system.

LostInEthereal said:

In what way is he insufficient? Through the fuckery of the DNC and democratic centralism or by ageist propaganda (meanwhile a senile maniac is in the white-house), or the complete corruption of the entire system?

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Sanders hasn't gotten anything done in more than 12 years as US Senator, one of the most powerful elected political offices in the world. We don't need another gridlock president who can't work with others. Also, Sanders is a poor leader on social issues such as the issues that the Black Lives Matter activists are addressing. Same with womens rights. For example, he endorsed a woman who was running for office on the platform of opposing Roe v Wade.

When he finally DOES write something down, it's an embarrassment. The Medicare for All bill that he wrote and submitted to the Senate for ratification is a half-finished, poorly written job of an amateur. It lacks details so that the Congressional Office of Management and the Budget (OMB) can't provide a firm cost estimate. Some outside groups estimate the cost to be upwards of 30-40 Trillion dollars over ten years. Furthermore, Bernie left out how that would be paid for. At the high end estimates, the extra cost in taxes per person is about 10,000 per year. So this is your idea of greatness? A hapless, lazy, do-nothing Senator is running on an undefined measure that would disrupt healthcare for 300 million Americans and a quarter of the economy. Sanders cult is slavering at people who oppose what is essentially a half baked idea that was hastily scribbled down on the back of a napkin without much thought.

Fogdog said:

Sanders hasn't gotten anything done in more than 12 years as US Senator, one of the most powerful elected political offices in the world. We don't need another gridlock president who can't work with others. Also, Sanders is a poor leader on social issues such as the issues that the Black Lives Matter activists are addressing. Same with womens rights. For example, he endorsed a woman who was running for office on the platform of opposing Roe v Wade.

When he finally DOES write something down, it's an embarrassment. The Medicare for All bill that he wrote and submitted to the Senate for ratification is a half-finished, poorly written job of an amateur. It lacks details so that the Congressional Office of Management and the Budget (OMB) can't provide a firm cost estimate. Some outside groups estimate the cost to be upwards of 30-40 Trillion dollars over ten years. Furthermore, Bernie left out how that would be paid for. At the high end estimates, the extra cost in taxes per person is about 10,000 per year. So this is your idea of greatness? A hapless, lazy, do-nothing Senator is running on an undefined measure that would disrupt healthcare for 300 million Americans and a quarter of the economy. Sanders cult is slavering over people who oppose what is essentially a half baked idea that was hastily scribbled down on the back of a napkin without much thought.

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Sorry didn't read your entire post, I gotta go. But ever heard of the Stop Jeff Bezos act? Him and Ro Khanna adopted legislation to make Amazon adopt 15$/hr minimum wage. I'd say Bernie accomplished something in the last twelve years.
EDIT: Sorry removed an antagonistic comment, I don't think that's productive to a fruitful open discourse. Getting over my hangover by drinking more and popping some k-pins

LostInEthereal said:

He should have started a third party and forced the hand. A progressive third-party could have easily garnered 10, 15 even 20 percent of the total vote and force the centrists to adopt logical and progressive policies.

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Yup,

He should have ended his career by running as a third party candidate in 2016. It would have been for the best.

LostInEthereal said:

I agree that if principled he should go much further. I think he's just doing the best he can with the constraints of a broken system.

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I am really of the idea that Bernie won't go on the frontline because he benefits from the system he claims to be against