BCNL Producer Review

I have been running 2x BCNL Producer as side project for quite some time now.

This true review will help people deciding on purchasing from bcnl and help people who have already bought a bcnl pro.


Lighting
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Issue starts with intake fan only being 4inch 100 cfm .
As shown below air intake comes in from the middle, cools ballasts(grey) cools air pump orange, then goes threw a few holes to finally fill up the light chamber, this will then be exhausted out the two 100 cfm fans out the back.





This design is truly garbage and causes the below cabinet to run over 32 c/ 90f even when surrounding room is average temperature. Multiple attempts to exuast lights, lower room temperature have no real significant affect. Only way to counter this issue is too attach a blower to the intake(i use the carbon filter exhaust) , this can pump several hundred cfm into the intake and u will notice drastic air movement. You can see up to a 2-4c difference immediately in lower cabinet.


DWC
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DWC systems are fucked with high heat and this is the reason many BCNL customers experience water mold/slime. The stock boxs runs too hot.

DWC system lacks proper air. Second exterior air pump must be added. 4 air stones for 18 plants is not enough. Air line for second pump must be jimmy rigged and is a hassle.

Water pump is garbage and will leave about inch of water which u will then need to shop vac.

Water pump will need to be adjusted per medium and per plant size, which involves calling bcnl. Or manual plug in pump

If floor is not 100 percent level rez level will be uneven causing all kinds of issue.

Larger plants will eat all the food causing others to have deficiencies.




Cabinet
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18 plants in such a tight space causes stretching
Intake and outtake 100 cfm not enough air movment
plants touching each other can and will cause mold
No way to support plants from falling over
middle plants do not have enough light end up smaller
plants must be flipped very small so they dont stretch to the glass

If carbon filter is attached will cause heat and humidity issues
Heat and humidity difficult to control inside the box

Attaching cabinet intake to ducting and placing it near and a/c will defenitly help with inside temps

co2
-----
The delivery system is one tube on the far left side. I dont feel that this system properly provides co2 to every plant before its suck out by the exhaust fan that is always on, no air moment. Can attach small fans with suction cups to help with air movement.


Cleaning/maintenance/pruning
-----------------------

Relatively easy to clean when not in use, issue begins when working with the DWC system. Since you cant remove all the water with that shitty pump u will have to use a shop vac. So lifting 18 plants and trying to vacum around there roots, 8 air stones and all the air tubing can be quite difficult.

Once plants get a certain size good luck getting to them. It becomes a complete jungle in there.


Review
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After a few years playing around with this thing ive decided it will no longer be used as a flowering room. I have converted it to a veg station. With mh's it dosent run as hot, and with no dwc system. Works great like this




Although this system has turned a profit and paid for itself I would not recommend purchasing this unit. I would average over a pound with very little veg time and 50 day of flower. The system involved tons of tweaks and modifications and for the price they charge u can grow 5-10 times the amount.

I did not post every single issue i encountered but feel free to post any question comments of you own.

A few pics of my pro jobs aswell

Awesome review Smoked. I'm kind of done with the producers myself, they are a great way to teach you hydro, but as you said, they aren't really built for novice growers... and this can cause a lot of lost grows and heartbreak. The issues they have are 100 percent correctable. If I were BCNL, I'd drop DWC all together and just provide them with a cheaper dirt / perlite bed marketed at novice growers. No 10+ year vets will even look at this thing, there are just too many problems with it, and the production just isn't that impressive.

I'd also like to add: The T-5's are almost completely useless. They don't support lower bud growth alone, at all. All my bottom bud was useless larf, so I ended up having to buck off everything but the cola and 3-4 branches... but then whats the point of having t-5's at that point??

Anyways, good luck guys. My advice having been down the road, and i'm sure smoked up will agree with me: Save your money, build a small setup. Stick with something simpler, and build your way up. 5k+ grand to try this thing... it's just not worth it. No way, no how.

Agreed they are crap. I am glad I bought mine used for 500 bucks. Most of the problems would go away if they used dual 250 watters instead of 400's. If you do the math 2 400's plus a 200 watt CFL is just way to much light. The plants can not absorb it all.

I downgraded the lights to 2 250's and all my issues disappeared. 2 250's plus a 200 watt CFL and I noticed no difference in yield, NONE

Hello. New to this forum, though not new to growing and just felt the need to comment on this old thread.

While it's always great to read and learn of others growing experiences I have to say that my time with the Producer was in very stark contrast to the comments posted here.

With decades of experience in soil, various mediums, and several forms of hydro I could no longer ignore my curiosity and broke down and bought a Producer some years ago.
Beginning with its construction it was nearly flawless in design, materials, and assembly. Really as sturdy and durable as any washer or dryer I've seen. Heavy gauge aluminum, perfect (high reflectivity) white paint finish, sturdy hardware, premium ballasts, and pristine wiring and routing. I felt it's construction was beyond reproach... This certainly holds true when comparing the Producer to any other cab, steel or plastic.

Quality aside, a well built cabinet means nothing with respect to dry weight. In over 20+ crop cycles I never harvested less than 1.5#'s dry, and typically averaged 2.0+/-.
In addition, my time with the Producer delighted me with the fewest pestilence issues of any growing condition I've employed. Moreover, I found it to be an extremely capable and reliable 8-week dong factory that was always hungry for the next round of clones.

To dispel the all-too-frequent comments about the Producer running too warm... All I can can say is that those commenters/operators should really take a good hard look at their heat extraction and evacuation regimes, as the Producer (with properly routed intake and exhaust) runs with it's overhead glass cool to the touch. Having considerable experience in HVAC and heat transfer, I can unequivocally say that this cabinet is IDENTICAL to every other grow cab made in that the USER is responsible for whatever heat is created by whatever ballasts, lamps and various electronics are enclosed within it. Period.
Perhaps the common ground here could be found in accepting that all cabinets fail in the heat department if they aren't addressed by an operator with at least a fundamental knowledge of heat dissipation and management.

To directly address some of the issues mentioned:

"18 plants in such a tight space causes stretching"
Tight space, yes. Stretching, no. Never experienced ANY stretching whatsoever. It begs the question why you have relegated it to a veg cab if stretching was your complaint.

"Intake and outtake 100 cfm not enough air movment"
Incorrect. My system was drawing fresh, somewhat cooler air from an adjoining room and exhausting to another, which lowered the internal operating temp at plant height by over 9°F. This was accomplished with no additional fans or inducers.

"plants touching each other can and will cause mold"
Properly trimmed plants with properly routed ventilation and the use of an internal circulation fan (6" KingAir, $10.00) renders those concerns invalid. If you're growing a particularly bushy strain... Grow fewer plants. I've run the Producer with 12 Indica for a 1.7Dry outcome.

"No way to support plants from falling over"
Not so. Although I haven't myself, nor had I found the need to install a net/trellis, etc, I have seen several ingenious and inexpensive implementations by enterprising SCROG'ers/SOG'ers. Those journals can easily be found with little search effort.

"middle plants do not have enough light end up smaller"
Myth. As each plant site is totally portable, simply move the shorter plants directly under the HPS and taller ones to the middle. Less than a minute, problem solved.

"plants must be flipped very small so they dont stretch to the glass"
Somewhat true and it's strain-dependent, but that's a good thing. Less time, less nutes, less energy, more product, more margin. I ended up running my clones longer with mild veg nutes to gain better roots and often skip veg altogether and go right to flower. In fact, those were some of the most prolific (2#+) harvests I'd had.

"If carbon filter is attached will cause heat and humidity issues"
True. Same with any cab. Vent beyond your grow space... You should anyhow, if possible. If not, don't buy this or any large producing cab.

"Heat and humidity difficult to control inside the box"
Dispelled. Route your intake and exhaust properly and get a handle on your grow room ventilation.

"Attaching cabinet intake to ducting and placing it near and a/c will defenitly help with inside temps"
Possible, but much cheaper to not involve A/C if proper passive ducting is employed... Climate dependent of course.

"co2
-----
The delivery system is one tube on the far left side. I dont feel that this system properly provides co2 to every plant before its suck out by the exhaust fan that is always on, no air moment. Can attach small fans with suction cups to help with air movement."
Great observation and point. I thought the same and ran controlled identical-crop grows to observe any difference and was surprised to find that growth was stronger and the dongs were considerably bulkier when using co2.
You also raise a good point about internal circulation. I ran a 6" fan in the box since the first crop cycle and believe it's not only essential to keep air moving, but also to more evenly distribute co2. With respect to the placement of the co2 outlet being high up and to the left, there's a very good reason for that. Carbon dioxide is heavier than air and needs to be released from the highest point above crop height for best administration. It comes out high on the left as it's the most opposite point from the cab exhaust on the lower right. Again, my crops came out considerably better with co2, although I cannot offer numbers to illustrate the PPM saturation within the cab. I do know that it's titrated via pre-programming and that I benefited measurably from it.


"Cleaning/maintenance/pruning
-----------------------

Relatively easy to clean when not in use, issue begins when working with the DWC system. Since you cant remove all the water with that shitty pump u will have to use a shop vac. So lifting 18 plants and trying to vacum around there roots, 8 air stones and all the air tubing can be quite difficult."
Mine was very easy to clean. The surface has a durable, surgical finish and is easy by virtue of that alone. Lifting the plants can be a bit of a bitch, that's why I made a little wooden prop (you can use a nute bottle) to hold the lid up. The pump was far from shitty for me as mine never failed or even complained. It fed perfectly and always pumped the res out in very few minutes.

The reason you need to vac out the remaining small balance is because of that pump you don't like. It's slightly elevated so you don't have to go in and clean roots out of it every day. It's elevated by design. A small vacuuming is not a hardship... it's 5 seconds. I used a $15.00 Home Depot shop vac top that fits any 5gal bucket. Worked a charm. A large syringe would do the same. Next time try propping a little something (2-phonebooks perhaps) under the rear of the cab. This will force the remaining small amount of liquid to the front of the res where it can be vacuumed out in mere seconds with no root involvement or trauma whatsoever. Done. Easy.

As far as air stones go I believe you're right. Did I need to add more... Probably not, but there's never enough oxygen for my roots. I also added 4 more and a sturdy pump. 5 mins... No problem.

"Once plants get a certain size good luck getting to them. It becomes a complete jungle in there."
Welcome to cab growing. Trim timely and properly and it's a non-issue. Besides, it's just good gardening practice to create the best environment for the plants and their caretaker. Removing all the unwanted/unneeded undergrowth only permits better air flow, better growth up high, and is part of responsible and conscientious crop tending. In addition, it allows some of that great blue light from the T-5's to get higher up.
Personally, I want a jungle... A neat one though.

"Review
----------

After a few years playing around with this thing ive decided it will no longer be used as a flowering room. I have converted it to a veg station. With mh's it dosent run as hot, and with no dwc system.
Too bad it didn't work out the way you hoped. That's an expensive bummer. Sorry to hear it.

Although this system has turned a profit and paid for itself I would not recommend purchasing this unit. I would average over a pound with very little veg time and 50 day of flower. The system involved tons of tweaks and modifications and for the price they charge u can grow 5-10 times the amount."
Yeah, it's expensive to be sure. Not citing you here, but it seems to me that nearly every negative review I've seen about the Producer has it's roots in poor knowledge of heat and ventilation management, in addition to lesser growing experience. A poor combination to be sure. Perhaps it's over-marketed as a turnkey solution for wannabes, but from performance and reliability perspectives I couldn't fault it in the least.

Any machine that gives me the better part of a kilo every 8 weeks with little toil in exchange is alright in my book.

"I'm kind of done with the producers myself, they are a great way to teach you hydro, but as you said, they aren't really built for novice growers... and this can cause a lot of lost grows and heartbreak. The issues they have are 100 percent correctable. If I were BCNL, I'd drop DWC all together and just provide them with a cheaper dirt / perlite bed marketed at novice growers. No 10+ year vets will even look at this thing, there are just too many problems with it, and the production just isn't that impressive.


I'd also like to add: The T-5's are almost completely useless. They don't support lower bud growth alone, at all. All my bottom bud was useless larf, so I ended up having to buck off everything but the cola and 3-4 branches... but then whats the point of having t-5's at that point??


Anyways, good luck guys. My advice having been down the road, and i'm sure smoked up will agree with me: Save your money, build a small setup. Stick with something simpler, and build your way up. 5k+ grand to try this thing... it's just not worth it. No way, no how."

I appreciate your thoughts and respectfully disagree with a few. I'll keep the DWC in favor of a box full of soil any day. Too much potential for pestilence and pathogens for that amount of soil in an enclosed space for my comfort. As you say, the Producer may be a great tool to teach hydro, but as a seasoned grower I found it to be very efficient and productive. It was fun too, and actually added some enjoyment to my process.

In my estimation you're right on with respect to issues being correctable. Expanding on that... I think there would be far fewer disappointed Producer owners had they better or more completely understood the roles of temperature, air, and hydroponics. Homework before pulling out the wallet saves $$$ and regret.

For me, their hybrid Drip/DWC system was ideal. Easy to fill, drain, maintain, and clean. I used Hygrozyme and never had a single root issue. The rest was: R/O water, CalMag Plus, Connoisseur Bloom A&B, Voodoo Juice, Big Bud, Bud Candy, VitaBoost Pro, Carboload, Overdrive, and Final Phase. Developed a great 1400ppm peak recipe and only varied from it for a strain's particular needs.

Perhaps no 10+ year growing vet would look twice at it, but this 40+ year growing vet gave it a chance and had been rewarded with great success and fun.

We part ways on the T-5's my friend. I found them very beneficial. They're not meant to support lower bud growth (although they do meagerly), but moreover they serve a function to augment the spectrum that the plants receive with blue wavelength. Given proper pruning and lower plant attention, the effect they provide is measurable and fairly profound. That's the point.

5k+ grand to try it... I'm with you. What a waste. A far less expensive approach would offer similar or greater yields, but that doesn't help those who actually NEED to roll in a box. However, if you've done your homework and find that the box fits your budget, knowledge AND your home... It's a big winner.

"Agreed they are crap. I am glad I bought mine used for 500 bucks. Most of the problems would go away if they used dual 250 watters instead of 400's. If you do the math 2 400's plus a 200 watt CFL is just way to much light. The plants can not absorb it all.

I downgraded the lights to 2 250's and all my issues disappeared. 2 250's plus a 200 watt CFL and I noticed no difference in yield, NONE"

Crap? Sorry to hear of your negative experience. That sucks. You must like the box though if you spent the time, money, and toil to re-outfit it with what you feel is a better arrangement. That's cool. Nice recovery.

As for twin 250's rendering the same yield as twin 400's... Ridiculous. That's 1/3 less light energy. Of course it matters. You can lower your electric bill all you want... As long as you're willing to tolerate a commensurate and proportionate reduction in quantity and quality.

Plant's don't absorb light, they utilize it by converting it to chemical energy. If you're one with your plants you'll know to temper them to accommodate all that beautiful light... Then the twin 400's will reveal their full potential.

The CFL is there as a light source for cuttings in veg and to augment the flowering spectrum (if desired), not as a viable growth source in and of itself.


In closing, I think we'd all agree that cab grows aren't for everyone. They're not for me either, but it did satisfy my curiosity very positively.

As a grow consultant I'm far too frequently disappointed by the lack of understanding of the very principles that can and do negatively influence expectations and investments. By simply spending money, too many people are of the impression that they've paid for and eliminated their problems.

Homework first... Homework first. Mom was right.

For my money the Producer was an excellent-to-outstanding grow cabinet. Expensive, yes. Effective... Definitely.

The cool and fun factors shouldn't be overlooked here either. There's something nice about having a spare key in the corner.

It's good to be new on your forum and I look forward to learning and contributing where helpful.

As a new BCNL Producer owner, I would second the review info that Smoked reported.

That said, it was TH-see’s rebuttal that actually got me to buy a Producer in 2020. Everything that Smoked said was true for me. Yes, TH-See offered sensible workarounds and some sage advice re: HVAC controls, but it doesn’t change the fact that the Producer is a VERY expensive niche setup.

Overall, Producer is a niche market solution that is great for novice growers, or for growers with unique space considerations. It is not a commercial grow setup, and anyone who thinks they’re going to make money on this is mistaken. It should be considered a ‘specialty’ residential setup only. Yields will be 1-2oz per plant, and there is no upside potential with this setup. You will never get more than this yield.

One comparison that might help is to think of the Producer in terms of stereo systems. The Producer is a ‘high end shelf system’ a la Bose that produces good quality music for what it is, but which will never out-perform a stereo bulky using components (separate receiver, speakers, CD player, etc.)

+
Build quality is excellent.
Tight package.
Can be locked (but don’t mistake this for security - it can easily be broken into)
CO2 integrated
Nutrient package is good.

-
Air Pump is effing loud.

Heat, heat and more heat.

Water load/unloading. Perhaps the least elegant solution you can find, and a true PITA.

Upgrade capability. There is very little room to do much more.

HVAC. If you don’t have proper duct work your grow will be challenged in multiple ways.

Value. Very expensive.

Configuration options. 18 plants is a ridiculous number of plants. Most personal grows are legally limited. Would be much better as a 6-up configuration, but no form fitting lid for alternatives.

Energy use. This is the big one for me. Running a Producer and Mothership with the stock HPS/MH bulbs consumes (on average) about 800-850 kWh per month.

LED huh? Lack of LED as a standard lighting setup is just lazy. LED is an upgrade. $1200 for Producer, and $425-600 for Mothership. That means if you don’t like HPS/MH for heat or energy consumption or maintenance/replacement costs, you’re buying half the box all over again for no incremental gain.

If you’re trying to justify the added expense with output or volume it’s just not there to support the additional costs. For a discriminating buyer who wants expan

If I had it to do all over, I would not have spent the kind of money that I did for this equipment. It was TH-See’s rebuttal to Smoked that really drove my decision-making process.

For the Royale with Cheese version Producer + Mothership and 3 grows of nutrients it was over $9k. That included $900 in shipping costs from Canada to US, and I got hit with another $350 in foreign currency exchange fee

If you’re doing this for personal consumption, $10k buys a lot of smoke.

If you’re thinking about building a high quality grow room, this isn’t your centerpiece.

It’s not really a viable commercial setup, so forget about that justification.

I’ll stick with the current all-in-wonder Producer setup until I build out my grow room for real. After that is completed, Producer will be relegated to a very expensive Veg station (or I will sell it).

YMMV.