Batshitt Only??

quebec budzz

Well-Known Member
Hi guys ,I've bubba kush, mekong high and skunk 11.Can I just put guano or do I need more than just guano.I use both types of guano and I mix them.I'm in vegetative state,please give me advices on organic i'm new to this world!!Taste way better.thanks guys:leaf:
 

bobbypyn

Well-Known Member
Blackstrap's the best, but any of the unsulfured ones are fine. some liquid fish & seaweed too. 1/2 cup guano, 1/2 cup worm castings, 1/4 cup molasses, 1 tsp liquid fish & seaweed in a gallon of non chlorinated water with an airstone for 24 - 36 hours. then dilute 100% before feeding, here again, non chlorinated. chlorine = death to your little friends in your soil in organics. no chlorine.
 

quebec budzz

Well-Known Member
thks you really know your stuff,can you tell me if I should top my mekong high to produce more??I know it works for indica..
 

bobbypyn

Well-Known Member
aw it weren't nothin... those asian sativas produce pretty good naturally but I think topping always adds more weight overall, if that's your goal (and it usually is unless you're just tryin to see how big a bud you can grow!)
 

randomseed

Active Member
Blackstrap's the best, but any of the unsulfured ones are fine. some liquid fish & seaweed too. 1/2 cup guano, 1/2 cup worm castings, 1/4 cup molasses, 1 tsp liquid fish & seaweed in a gallon of non chlorinated water with an airstone for 24 - 36 hours. then dilute 100% before feeding, here again, non chlorinated. chlorine = death to your little friends in your soil in organics. no chlorine.
You'll find alot of recipes but they pretty much boil down to this with different people using slightly different amounts of stuff.
See soil sig link for my take on it.

A good organic regimine is -
1) building a strong soil with EWC, guanos, kelp and other whatnots
2) additions of topdress guano and teas in veg
3) transition top dress to bring the soil up to speed for flower
4) top dressing and water with guano weekly, apply a tea maybe 50% of the way through flower to boast soil activity
5) stop appling top dress and guanos last 1-2 weeks.

Some people make neutral teas with no guano or direct ferts while some (like me) do like to use some in my organic teas.
The only hard part is figuring out how much your plants can take to maximize your grow, that takes some practice and varies by strain. The good part is guano burns in my experience are pretty light and dont usually require a flush to fix, just back off the guano for a week and things tend to get themselves back in line, unlike ferts where emergency procedures come into play. Guano is pretty forgiving.
 

randomseed

Active Member
Also there are other things then Bat poo for this kind of growing.
Blood meal, bone meal, lots of other meals, kelp and pleanty more that give simmilar effects but with varing strengths, timeframes for breakdown, and effects on the soil then guano. If looking at guanos its a good idea to start thinking about organics as a whole, guanos are a great introduction but there is a whole world of cheap and renewable fertilizers (if you want to call them that) that starts to open up once you really start looking.
 

quebec budzz

Well-Known Member
Also there are other things then Bat poo for this kind of growing.
Blood meal, bone meal, lots of other meals, kelp and pleanty more that give simmilar effects but with varing strengths, timeframes for breakdown, and effects on the soil then guano. If looking at guanos its a good idea to start thinking about organics as a whole, guanos are a great introduction but there is a whole world of cheap and renewable fertilizers (if you want to call them that) that starts to open up once you really start looking.
Blood meal, bone meal One of my friends told me, I can't use bone and blood meals indoor because it's causing too much pest problems is that true?Today ,I bought B'cuzz roots ,B 'cuzz grow and B'cuzz bloom.Should be OK with my two types of guano+B'cuzz,RIGHT BOBBY??:-P
 

randomseed

Active Member
Blood meal, bone meal One of my friends told me, I can't use bone and blood meals indoor because it's causing too much pest problems is that true?Today ,I bought B'cuzz roots ,B 'cuzz grow and B'cuzz bloom.Should be OK with my two types of guano+B'cuzz,RIGHT BOBBY??:-P
Not really. Bone Meal is totally safe. Ive heard things about people getting bugs in their blood meal but I dont know about all that. I dont use blood meal just because its blood meal.
 

Wetdog

Well-Known Member
As RS mentioned, you ought to add some kelp meal or the like. All those guano's are light in the K dept, and K is very important for flowering.

Wet
 

randomseed

Active Member
As RS mentioned, you ought to add some kelp meal or the like. All those guano's are light in the K dept, and K is very important for flowering.

Wet
Hey Wet, what do you think about using actual potash? Id really like to but Im scared to death of that PH=12 screwing everything up.
Know any good SAFE sources?
 

Wetdog

Well-Known Member
Hey Wet, what do you think about using actual potash? Id really like to but Im scared to death of that PH=12 screwing everything up.
Know any good SAFE sources?
I stick with good ol kelp meal. Potash scares me also.

I do use Pro-Tekt from Dyna-Gro which provides silica and K, but very lightly as it also raises the pH. Some use it as a pH-up, but I don't use that much, like 1/4-1/2 tsp/gallon.

Wet
 

Oban

Active Member
What do you guys think of International house of guano, its supposed to have different guano for veg to bloom. any thoughts?
 

OldGrowth420

Well-Known Member
Meow. thanks for the info in making teas buddy. You plants will need more than bat guano to stay healthy and produce at an optimum level. Nutrient disorders are caused by too much or too little of one or several nutrients being available. These nutrients are made available between a pH range of 5 and 7 and a total dissolved solids (TDS) range of 800 to 3000 PPM. Maintaining these conditions is the key to proper nutrient uptake.

Nutrients Over twenty elements are needed for a plant to grow. Carbon, hydrogen and oxygen are absorbed from the air and water. The rest of the elements, called mineral nutrients, are dissolved in the nutrient solution.

The primary or macro- nutrients (nitrogen (N), phosphorus (P) and potassium (K)) are the elements plants use the most. Calcium (Ca) and magnesium (Mg) are secondary nutrients and used in smaller amounts. Iron (Fe), sulfur (S), manganese (Mn), boron (B), molybdenum (Mo), zinc (Zn) and copper (Cu) are micro-nutrients or trace elements.


Trace elements are found in most soils. Rockwool (hydroponic) fertilizers must contain these trace elements, as they do not normally exist in sufficient quantities in rockwool or water. Other elements also play a part in plant growth. Aluminum, chlorine, cobalt, iodine, selenium, silicon, sodium and vanadium are not normally included in nutrient mixes. They are required in very minute amounts that are usually present as impurities in the water supply or mixed along with other nutrients.

The nutrients must be soluble (able to be dissolved in water) and go into solution.

Macro-nutrients Nitrogen (N) is primary to plant growth. Plants convert nitrogen to make proteins essential to new cell growth. Nitrogen is mainly responsible for leaf and stem growth as well as overall size and vigor. Nitrogen moves easily to active young buds, shoots and leaves and slower to older leaves. Deficiency signs show first in older leaves. They turn a pale yellow and may die. New growth becomes weak and spindly. An abundance of nitrogen will cause soft, weak growth and even delay flower and fruit production if it is allowed to accumulate.
Phosphorus (P) is necessary for photosynthesis and works as a catalyst for energy transfer within the plant. Phosphorus helps build strong roots and is vital for flower and seed production. Highest levels of phosphorus are used during germination, seedling growth and flowering. Deficiencies will show in older leaves first. Leaves turn deep green on a uniformly smaller, stunted plant. Leaves show brown or purple spots.

Phosphorus flocculates when concentrated and combined with calcium.

Potassium (K) activates the manufacture and movement of sugars and starches, as well as growth by cell division. Potassium increases chlorophyll in foliage and helps regulate stomata openings so plants make better use of light and air. Potassium encourages strong root growth, water uptake and triggers enzymes that fight disease. Potassium is necessary during all stages of growth. It is especially important in the development of fruit.

Deficiency signs of potassium are: plants are the tallest and appear healthy. Older leaves mottle and yellow between veins, followed by whole leaves that turn dark yellow and die. Flower and fruit drop are common problems associated with potassium deficiency. Potassium is usually locked out by high salinity.
Secondary Nutrients Magnesium (Mg) is found as a central atom in the chlorophyll molecule and is essential to the absorption of light energy. Magnesium aids in the utilization of nutrients, neutralizes acids and toxic compounds produced by the plant. Deficiency signs of magnesium are: Older leaves yellow from the center outward, while veins remain green on deficient plants. Leaf tips and edges may discolor and curl upward. Growing tips turn lime green if the deficiency progresses to the top of the plant.

Calcium (Ca) is fundamental to cell manufacture and growth. Soil gardeners use dolomite lime, which contains calcium and magnesium, to keep the soil sweet or buffered. Rockwool gardeners use calcium to buffer excess nutrients. Calcium moves slowly within the plant and tends to concentrate in roots and older growth. Consequently young growth shows deficiency signs first. Deficient leaf tips, edges and new growth will turn brown and die back. If too much calcium is applied early in life, it will stunt growth as well. It will also flocculate when a concentrated form is combined with potassium.

Trace Elements Sulphur (S) is a component of plant proteins and plays a role in root growth and chlorophyll supply. Distributed relatively evenly with largest amounts in leaves which affects the flavor and odor in many plants. Sulphur, like calcium, moves little within plant tissue and the first signs of a deficiency are pale young leaves. Growth is slow but leaves tend to get brittle and stay narrower than normal.

Iron (Fe) is a key catalyst in chlorophyll production and is used in photosynthesis. A lack of iron turns leaves pale yellow or white while the veins remain green. Iron is difficult for plants to absorb and moves slowly within the plant. Always use chelated (immediately available to the plant) iron in nutrient mixes.

Manganese (Mg) works with plant enzymes to reduce nitrates before producing proteins. A lack of manganese turns young leaves a mottled yellow or brown.

Zinc (Z) is a catalyst and must be present in minute amounts for plant growth. A lack of zinc results in stunting, yellowing and curling of small leaves. An excess of zinc is uncommon but very toxic and causes wilting or death.

Copper (C) is a catalyst for several enzymes. A shortage of copper makes new growth wilt and causes irregular growth. Excesses of copper causes sudden death. Copper is also used as a fungicide and wards off insects and diseases because of this property.

Boron (B) is necessary for cells to divide and protein formation. It also plays an active role in pollination and seed production.

Molybdenum (Mn) helps form proteins and aids the plant's ability to fix nitrogen from the air. A deficiency causes leaves to turn pale and fringes to appear scorched. Irregular leaf growth may also result.

These nutrients are mixed together to form a complete plant fertilizer. The mix contains all the nutrients in the proper ratios to give plants all they need for lush, rapid growth. The fertilizer is dissolved in water to make a nutrient solution. Water transports these soluble nutrients into contact with the plant roots. In the presence of oxygen and water, the nutrients are absorbed through the root hairs
 

randomseed

Active Member
wall of text.
In organic growing you can totally get by with just batpoo, hell do it write you can get by on pure H2O. As long as your soil is built and conditioned well all of what your bringing up is already there in the dirt, your simply adding the basics that are getting drained out over time. Pretty much all the micros and other nutrients are already in the dirt, if your have defs its because you built your dirt wrong in the first place and creating "nutrient solutions" are just band aids on your soil process. Hell the only reason an organic grower needs to add anything to their water during a grow is because its almost impossible to supply all the NPK upfront for a three month period without creating massive overdose issues.

Everything old grow says is correct in terms of non-organic growing but is the wrong method for organic section of the forums.
lol @ nutrient solutions

Also in organic growing
" the nutrients are absorbed through the root hairs " is pretty much false, organic growing relies on the life in the soil to provide the nutriation to the plant via a symbiotic relationship with the roots, not through the roots directly absorbing anything from the soil (or water solution) itself.
 

randomseed

Active Member
I stick with good ol kelp meal. Potash scares me also.

I do use Pro-Tekt from Dyna-Gro which provides silica and K, but very lightly as it also raises the pH. Some use it as a pH-up, but I don't use that much, like 1/4-1/2 tsp/gallon.

Wet
Actually started using the pro-tekt this month, weird stuff. It throws the PH waaaaaaay up but for whatever reason the smallest bit of PH down seems to have a major effect on it. Its like the silica has some kind of massive ph swing to it but all you have to do is nudge it and it comes flying back down.
I actually runined a batch because I saw the ph hitting like 9 and using my normal 1ml/5gal = .5ph swing formula I threw in 3ml of ph down and all the sudden it was sitting at like 4.5! Sensitive stuff.
 

randomseed

Active Member
What do you guys think of International house of guano, its supposed to have different guano for veg to bloom. any thoughts?
It does and I use tons of it ;-)
Also the peruvian sea bird guano is an awesome all purpose any stage fertilizer (10-10-2)
The most confusing part is figuring out if you want say jamacian bat guano or indonesian bat guano, on the surface they seem the same (1-10-1 or something) but they come in different forms so depending on your application one may be better for your situation then others. As long as your getting at least one of the correct ones for your phase you'll be fine.
 
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