Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Fox news is a propaganda website. Anything that comes from that site is suspect.
I won't engage in an debate over details that I don't even know are true.
atheist vs muslim
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I won't engage in an debate over details that I don't even know are true.
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
fair enough, i'll keep an eye out for another outlet covering it
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I'll keep an eye out too. It's not as if I disrespect or doubt you by doubting the details given by FOX, it's FOX that I doubt.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
OK, here's something from the OregonLive site
https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/08/he_brought_an_american_flag_to.html
Says he is legit "left of center progressive".
Here's what I think and it's not based on what I read here.
The person who beat Welch was wrong. No excuses.
Welch didn't understand the seriousness of the situation in front of him. He played into the right's hands by creating a disturbance behind the lines.
The person who beat Welch was wrong. Welch made a bad decision.
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
no, i understand, i don't trust them either, and would like to hear the story from another outlet
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i don't think he made a bad choice bringing it, but he should have been ready to fight if he didn't want to turn it over.
the people who hit him were wrong not only in hitting him, but in trying to take his flag without even asking him why he brought it. they may have thought he was a counter protester, but three or four of them closing in on him shows at least a small degree of coordination. they could have easily questioned him instead of attacking him. no one had to hit him, 4 people could have taken his flag without bashing in the back of his head, then hitting him while he was down.
the people who hit him were wrong not only in hitting him, but in trying to take his flag without even asking him why he brought it. they may have thought he was a counter protester, but three or four of them closing in on him shows at least a small degree of coordination. they could have easily questioned him instead of attacking him. no one had to hit him, 4 people could have taken his flag without bashing in the back of his head, then hitting him while he was down.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
What can I say? They shouldn't have done it. No excuses. People have to tune their shit up because the next two years are going to be even more tense.
The demonstration was about projecting white power. The counter demonstrators were there to stop them from marching through the streets of Portland. In the middle of it all was confusion and people can make bad decisions.
I still say the whole thing wouldn't have happened if neo-Nazis hadn't descended on the City for their own reasons. At root of all violence for the day are Proud Boys and Patriot's Prayer for choosing to take their message of white power to a city that is known for liberal inclusiveness..
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i agree. there should be no reason for antifa to exist. we should have started teaching kids a long time ago that color is meaningless, that the old prejudices are bullshit, and that we can't progress as a race until we get past this stupidity.
but antifa does exist, because there are people who keep all that old hate alive, and try to make it grow. i know it may seem like i don't like antifa, and honestly, i'm not really impressed, but that's my problem. i'm a strange mix of pacifist and militarist. if you leave me alone, and don't cause any problems, i have no problem with you at all. once people start causing problems, they need to be dealt with, quickly and harshly. it seems to me that antifa takes half steps, and doesn't do enough...and when they do something, half the time it's directed at the wrong people.
if you wake up that militarist part of me, it wants to eliminate threats, permanently. i would take more drastic steps, which would probably cause even more problems.....so i guess it's a good thing i stay home most of the time
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