About to pull the A51 trigger... Which setup to pick?

So, for 2 (potentially) separate areas...

4 x 3 let's say each... Think T5 light frame over the space... so I'm not quite aiming for the entire 4x4 tent/space config often cited... though it may be 4x4 or a tad/slightly larger when not in a tent...

I've been all over the board on this one and I'm settling on skipping DIY and just dropping the cash... I sent A51 an email or two and I'm now stuck on deciding SGS vs RW.

When I inquired as to key reasoning why I'd pick one vs the other it was mentioned that some like the all white spectrum to help with keeping stretch down... wish I would benefit from as well... But, I could supplement blue if need be for that timeframe... i.e. I could step down to one or two single tube T5 fixtures that could even swap in UV bulbs later for flowering once stretch was done...

I was initially thinking 2 x XGS orginally over a 3x4 with my favoring the blue spectrum and it being the higher wattage of the lineups... but those were always out of stock until recently...

Since that initial research, I've continue to read & follow the forum on what's out there and grow journals and in a recent post someone mentioned that some are favoring the RW's because they achieve about the same results with less wattage... And less wattage means less heat which is very important for my setup... How I wish these had remote ballasts! I'm also using a 6" inline fan to exhaust the area which I wish could be leveraged to usher the heat away...

So I've opened my thinking to include the RW lineup & I'm now looking at the flexibility that multiple smaller units will provide for the little extra cost... With more discrete lights, I can space things as needed or re-purpose the 'extra' units (if I have overkill here somehow past the point of diminishing returns)... or have to otherwise down-size things ever/etc...

i.e...

6 x RW-75 with 3 over each 'area'.... that may be good enough for long-term and be done...

With my needs, I set out with my original "max" goal of 4 of either the RW-150 or XGS-190 long term... and I was contemplating the idea of 6 perhaps with the RW-150 since it is lesser wattage... So that's my biggest plans at most...

So from the A51 line-up, what would be your configuration choice?

I'm listening.

I'm wondering if the 3 x RW-75 for each space is adequate... I've heard the 1k lumens per some area (m^2 or ft^2?) or some threshold like that where going above it hits that point where the plants are saturated and can't use anymore light (esp without co2 supplementation)...

I'd like to bump right up to that line.... just shy of it... That may take 3 x RW-150 per each of my areas though... which I can't lay down that type of money all at once...

Another config I'm considering would be RW-75 then a RW-150 then a RW-75 for a total of 300w per area/space... and with 2 of the 75's that gives me some configuration flexibility... And I can fairly safely assume a minimum of 1 RW-150 to be used per flowering space... the question then becomes can the 75's be in the mix with the heat... or do they become veg lights?

The RW's can be used for Veg too right? Would they need blue supplement to be really effective as Veg lights?

Can anyone think of a reason to buy a single RW-150 over two RW-75's other than the cost difference? Anything with technical merit?

4 RW-75's over a 3'x4' area would give you the most even coverage at 25 watts sq/ft.

Whatever you choose i would not drop below 25w/sqft.

and not sure where you heard 1000 lm/sqft but that is way to low.

sure your not thinking 10k lm/ft

purplegrower02 said:

sure your not thinking 10k lm/ft

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Yeah, wasn't sure of the exact numbers just knew there was a magic ratio to aim for and not overshoot...

So the 25w/sqft... are you saying that is the ideal number I was aiming for (the upper bound) or are you saying that's what I'd be achieving in my 3x4 configuration (questioning this because 3*4*25 = 300 and I was looking at 300w per 3x4 area)...

One reason I'm looking at several of the 75's is that my 2 areas... each 3x4 roughly... would be in an L configuration... but may be in a square layout someday/etc... the flexibility of multiple smaller units is pretty much selling me to go with 8xRW-75 but I may only budget 4x for this first go and do just 1 area for now..

I can keep my existing T5's on the other area until I decide if I want to drop that much more cash again (this is for self only, no profits so I don't have THAT type of funding/justification)... Of course that doesn't help my heat situation and would be additive in nature.. and it's only getting warmer...

Did a little searching... folks sound like they're at least trying to put facts to the conversation (unlike some other threads we often find)... So I buy it...

https://www.rollitup.org/t/max-lumens-before-growth-rate-tapers.101350/

Sounds like a little over the 5k lumen/ft^2 would be considered 'ideal' from a quick scan/read of that post... Need to read more thoroughly but gives me a ball-park...

I own a XGS and RW and 25 to 30 watts sq/ft of Area 51 lights will do a great job,I would only use that figure with a light that uses quality LED's and not as a general rule for all of them,lots of junk lights out there. Sounds like you need to read more about plant lighting,lumens is not a good term to go by for plants.

Sound like price is the problem for you.

As always...depends on your expectations. But to start you are going to need a minimum of 25w/sqft...but more is recommended. So that puts you at about 300w to just make the minimum which is not producing hps like results IMO.

When this started I was going to suggest 3 rw150's. So again, depends on what you are trying to achieve in that space.

The best out(growers and lights) aren't hitting much over 1g/w. There is more potential in there IMO...but you got to look at things from a reality perspective too.

Right.. I get the debate is out there on how & what to use to properly gauge LED effectiveness... Lumens... Watts... Umols/Sec... Enough to make my brain hurt... I've got a day job that make the brain hurt - daily - so I'm trying to not compound that! I'm a techie by trade and have dabbled in very basic DC electronics as a kid - hell I even etched my own boards!)... so I've been keen to reading up on all this material/etc... especially the DIY threads. There's just so much subjective and opinion based material out there it's hard to discern the facts from all the noise...



Right now I'm focusing on making something happen and committing to make a purchase before those expendable funds get expended elsewhere (as always seems to happen!)... After a long debate over the DIY path I decided my time is more valuable and it's lower risk to just purchase... Doesn't help being indecisive!

So let's say I only address converting 1 of my spaces and put 3 x RW-150's in there... 450w over a single 3x4 space suffice for modest result?

The 150's look rectangular so I'm thinking of which orientation they would hang best.. with 2 units I would run them parallel to the hanging bar to get the width coverage but that leaves some edge lighting issues on 2 sides... with 3 or 4 I'd go perpendicular to the hanging bar and probably get better edge to edge coverage... Mmmm.... Of course 4 is better... but like was said above "price" is always an issue... But I do want a solid "end game plan" and make strides towards it... just may have to scale it back a tad coverage wise, using the same original budget....

I previously thought that 450 or so would be nearing the "too much" point/saturation, but perhaps not at all... that wattage should be nearing the upper-middle of the 'optimal' playing field then it sounds? That approach doesn't get my 2nd space rolling but that can be project vNext... and I'm still uncertain what heat I can contend with in any configuration (summer temps!)... I need to make a few tweaks to my ventilaltion but even with my 2nd T5 panel going that pushes things a tad hotter than I like so that's one thing prompting the purchase... I can only run one of my T5 panels currently (435w 'ish)... so only 1 of the 2 areas can be used...

It sounds like one disadvantage the 75's would have - for me - is long-term density/spacing.... If I wanted to keep adding units to improve wattage per foot, eventually I'd be cramming them together and probably unable to concentrate that wattage effectively... Might present some hanging challenges/additional work to establish another bar (when not using tent with overhead hangers)...

Starting to settle into the 3 x 150 for one area and see how the heat works out before buying more than I can run...

I like it. Plus if you decide you want to only use 2 per area your second space would be already be almost finished.
But IMO 3 over one area sounds tits. You could very well yield just as well in one superiority light area than 2 lower light areas.

2 150's and 1 75 could work and save a couple bucks.
It just sounds like you have more space to potentially play with. So if tht is the case favor on more light so that if you have to use it you'll be covered.

I have a couple of the '13 SGS in the 3x3, and imo it fills it pretty perfectly.. Throw in 2 rw-75s to take care of the additional 3 ft and that would be a perfect set up.. I'm sure you could go with less, but you would inevitably have a darker corner or two..

Good luck and you made a good choice with Area 51...

captainmorgan said:

4 RW-75's over a 3'x4' area would give you the most even coverage at 25 watts sq/ft.

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That or 3-150s that are spaced about 1-1/3' apart. That would make only a 9" spread to cover on each end of the light to the wall and have awesome over lap. 2 would still be good but the 4-75s like captain said would spread better or at least be more flexible.

But yeah if heat is a concern you can most definitely feel a difference on the back of your hand comparing the xgs to rw 150. Though not like my hand is a calibrated measuring tool but you can tell for sure. Need to get a new thermo gun.

gk skunky said:

But yeah if heat is a concern you can most definitely feel a difference on the back of your hand comparing the xgs to rw 150. Though not like my hand is a calibrated measuring tool but you can tell for sure.

Click to expand...

Which one is running hotter?

Bad Karma said:

Which one is running hotter?

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The one drawing more wattage.............

so has anyone tested them to see if they really perform the same. I know skunk has them together...and they are equal in that situation...but are they actually equal in a side by side like manner?