For an optimal 4 plant set up with the cmh would you say the 4x4 suffices? Or could you grt away with the 3x3 and a single 315w?
Ps did you use the single bulb 630 or two 315 bulbs?
630w CMH for a beginner?
- Thread starter rama108
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Ps did you use the single bulb 630 or two 315 bulbs?
DesertPlants
Well-Known Member
I think I might be misunderstanding you. Are you're saying a 630 penetrates better than two 315s? Greater penetration is from dispersing the emission points. It allows the light to hit areas that would be shaded by plant mass above it. Light doesn't just penetrate deeper because it's stronger... with a TINY exception of refracted light. It can't just go through the leaves.
Lucky Luke
Well-Known Member
Thanks for asking, its the Q im interested in to.
Im currently running a 600w HPS in a 4 x 4 flowering tent.
growin-Jables
Well-Known Member
in a 4x4..a 630w is going to pushing Max intensity. you would need the fixture mounted as high as possible and keep plants short. in a 4x4. I would go with a combo of 315w cmh and 100-200w draw led for little extra umps. but a 315w cmh will do well in a 4x4 if kept to a scrog grow. nake sure to run 3100k bulbs
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
QBs and COBs would be cheaper and just as effective. I do like CMH, though. Any legitimate lighting system for a new grower will probably make a huge difference in their enthusiasm. Lighting is probably the most important part of growing, and, I would say, probably has the most impact on your final yield, followed by genetics, followed by nutrients.
growin-Jables
Well-Known Member
greater penetration is not soley relying on number of light angles. yes....its a factor....but intensity of the light fixtures its self plays a larger role imo. spacing out 2 315w fixtures still only leaves you with the single bulb intensity that only makes it was about 8 -12 inches into the canopy. have 2 315s. you might increase a few extra inches into canopy. A 630w fixture has a footprint of 5x5...so it already completely lights up the entire tent. as well as doubling the intensity intothe canopy and getting about 18-22 inches deep into canopy. when using 2 315s. you have a foot print of 3x3 with each fixture. so your kind of unnecessarily sacraficing alot of intensity, for spread you dont really need growing in such a small place. IMO, multiple fixtures is more beneficial in a large scale grow. in a tent grow. I would choose intensity over spreading out lower wattage bulbs in an area that's already small enough to be covered under one fixtures. This Comaprison test I found shows the level of par put out by a 630cmh hung from 36 inches . if you look at the charts and try and visualize it. 2 fixtures spaced out 2 ft apart. if you add up the numbers on the outside of the par foot print chart for single cmh. you will quickly realize how many weak spots in par there will be with 2 individual fixtures because after about 2x2. the par begins to drastically drop. and begin to overlap with the others fixtures weak spot, creating an even " ok " intensity light through out the tent.
. the dual cmh. has highest par ratings. an even up till the 3x3 and 4x4 par readings , it's still producing more par than what the single cmh would be creating right underneath the fixture . , its shows higher par numbers across the entire 5x5 in total. I hope this makes sense not just to myself lol. ive tried flowering unders 315s. ok. but only certain strains grow big buds consistently. when using 630w. any strain will produce very generous sized buds
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growin-Jables
Well-Known Member
lol why do you think hps penetrates better than any other light.....because of its intensity.....and again....buds get huge under hps....because the light is physically penetrating the buds and leaves. why do you think even shaded buds grow if light couldn't penetrate through leaves. there still light brought in from the sides. why can marijauna plants grow outside even in the shade with no direct sunlight. because light travel isn't linear necessarily. justthe fact that the sun makes it sooo bright outside, even in the shade the plant is still absorbing light and photosynthesizing
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
I'm of the mind that penetration isn't the big deal for most tent growers as they train their plants to an even canopy using a variety of techniques and lollipop the lower stuff anyway.
If all you have is the one 630 then when you have fewer plants you are stuck using it. Wastes a lot of power and light tho the fewer plants will likely do better there is still a lot wasted.
Our power here is 23.5¢/KWH and about 90% of my cost to grow bud. I veg my plants under fluoros until they are about 8" tall before I fire up a 400MH and then only if I have enough plants to need it. I still use an 8 tube 4' T12 fixture I built 17 years ago. I wired it so I can use 2, 4, 6 or all 8 tubes but If I need all 8 then it's using 360+ watts so might as well use the 400. I see guys using a 600 for tiny seedlings and think they are either living somewhere where power is dirt cheap or free, rich as f'k or dumber than a bag of hammers.
I just checked and have my 400 only 6" away from the tops and they are doing fine. About 2' plants and the bottom growth is good too.
I have 3 - 400w hps ballasts and will use one with smaller plants then two as they get bigger where sometimes I wish I had a 600 or two but can run all 3 if needed or switch to a 1000W when I got lots going. Have a conversion bulb to get MH light off an HPS ballast if I need more MH light tho my Hortilux Super HPS has enough blue light to veg well along with the MH bulb.
I find most hobby growers like myself are on a pretty low budget so getting one 315 then adding another when they scrounge up the cash works better for many as well. Once you get a few oz in the jars it's easier to save money for more gear too.
A Light Rail® is a great addition to many gardens too and I love mine. At around $300 it cost as much as a 1000W light but can make one light do the work of two and as it only uses 9W pays for itself after one decent grow. Made in Colorado too so not some cheap Chinese knockoff that will die in a couple years.
Just my 2¢.
ColoradoHighGrower
Well-Known Member
Exactly: 2x315=options and flexibility
ColoradoHighGrower
Well-Known Member
What do you mean by "split the stalk at the Y"? Do you split the main stalk? How far down from the Y? Or, do you supercrop extra branches so that you only have the two branches as vertical growth?
Farmer.J
Well-Known Member
Hi.
I'm running two de630w cmh's in a 8x8 tent.
I'm thinking 4 vertical 315's would have been better coverage though. I am considering getting light movers after this harvest.
Do you think I have sufficient enough lighting for the size of the tent?
NugHeuser
Well-Known Member
The problem is 630s are good for 4x4, 5x5 ar max. So you are under lighted.
I would either put them on a light mover or go with the 4 315s.
Farmer.J
Well-Known Member
Yeah gualala robotics has a 5.0 side by side light mover that I believe can move 2-6 lights on parallel rails, it's $500 USD but still cheaper than buying 4 315's. I think that I will get the light mover this winter if I can afford it.
I thought a de630 should cover a 6x6 area (like a 600w hps) but if you say 4x4 then two of them should be perfect on light movers eh?
NugHeuser
Well-Known Member
I'd say two what work fine on light movers.
I've never had an hps cover a 6x6 though, about 4x4 tops on those, for me anyway.
I havent seen much of gardens outcomes with a light mover but you would be sitting around 19 watts per sq. ft. with the two 630's, so a light mover would most definitely be a must if you stuck with just those two.
NugHeuser
Well-Known Member
What happened to the 315s?
And what ya got going for leds, if ya dont mind me asking?
Farmer.J
Well-Known Member
To do that is even more investment, two different motors. I hear what you are saying that it would be ideal. My goal is to run 2 lights parallel across the tent back and forth each minute of the light cycle.
I watched a YouTube video by grow boss explaining how to get the most out of lights by using light movers. He suggests that you can have the lights closer to the canopy because the intense light doesn't have enough time to burn plant tissues, yet penetrates deeper into the canopy. So what I think I understand is in a 4x8 you can run them in line on one motor with a 3' stroke, in a 8x8 I have to run side by side with a 6' stroke.
Psyphish
Well-Known Member
Cops took them. I can only run micro grows now, really small scale. This round I have a HLG65 for the weed and 8 HLG40s for my other plants, also 10 x 20w E27 LED spots. I just miss the growing power of higher wattage lighting. Compared to the previous round with 5x20w E27 spots, vegging is really slow and the plants are spindly, it's only about 2000 less lumen.
If you got room, definitely get CMH instead of LED.
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
I bought a Light Rail 4.0 a couple years ago to use to light up an 8x4 space with a single 1000W HPS but haven't got around to building that space yet. Been using it in my regular grow room an now want another one for the new space if and when I build it.
They make a bracket to attach to the drive unit to use multiple lights with but it's simple enough to DIY one of your own. You want to make sure the weight of whatever you attach is centered so it pulls directly down on the drive unit.
I would prefer using 2 - 600W lights back to back but that means buying 2 - 600w ballasts and bulbs and that's not in the budget. Already have 2 - 1000W systems. With 2 - 600s I'd get 50% more lumen output for 20% more power input and Hortilux lumens are pretty good lumens.