~300w CFL Closet Grow-newbs who need help!

Hello Fellow Growers!

My garden has been doing alright, despite some obvious deficiencies that I'm going to need help diagnosing. I suspect it's all PH related but I'm not totally sure yet. So onto some details. The point of my garden is for personal use. My fiancé and I both use Cannabis medically as well as recreationally. I have no interest in selling my harvest as I'm doing this to not only save us money, but to get us away from the shady element that tends to be involved in procurement of this sacred herb around my parts. Yields, therefore are not my top priority. I'd rather grow less of the good stuff than a buttload of shwag. But also, I'm aware of the limitations of my setup and realize that I'm not going to be producing anything worthy of the cannabis cup. I chose to avoid HID lighting because I live in a rental and cannot get away with cutting holes into the ceiling for ventilation. Also stealth is a major concern.

Closet/Ventilation:

1.5'Dx2.5'Wx3H (or up to 4' if I move the coat hanger bar up to the top of the closet. The closet is located in our bedroom. The door to the closet is always open due to heat restrictions, light is contained (not completely) by using a "blackout" curtain that has a flat white back. Walls are also flat white. Ventilation and cooling are accomplished by two 24" box fans and a window AC in the main room. One fan is right next to the plants and leaned pointing up into the lights and across the tops of the plants. This fan has a passive intake beside it accomplished by the curtain being tucked under the corner of the fan. Exhaust is accomplished by the second box fan at the top of the closet above the curtain. It just blows the hot air that makes its way up the closet, back into the bedroom. When I attempted to use the closet with the door closed, the temps were getting into the mid-high 90'sF. With my current setup, "daytime" temps are stable around 75F. Nighttime gets to the AC setting of 65F. Fans are on 24/7. Currently in the process of building a coffee can carbon scrubber which will be powered by a stupid powerful Honeywell desk fan. That's only a few days out seeing as there is already a faint but quite definite smell coming from the babies.

Lighting:
4x: 23w 5000k CFL, 1600 lumens each
5x: 23w 2700k CFL, 1600 lumens each
2x: 55w 2700k CFL, 3800 lumens each

Total actual wattage: 317
Total actual lumens: 22,000

One 23w is in a desk lamp for adjustable supplemental lighting. All the others are mounted to a homemade fixture made of wood, tinfoil, and various fixtures that I'd found for free or very cheap, gutted a few trash picked lamps. I also realize that 5000k lamps are not ideal, however it was what I could get my hands on at the moment. I plan on purchasing a set of 85w photography cfls that run at 6500k. Found them on Amazon for about $50 for a four pack (also WAY cheaper than hydro stores for comparative bulbs.)

I have six of the ugliest little green babies you could think of right now. They were all germed in paper towels with a light fish emulsion solution (1/2 strength 5-1-1). Nutes have only been given to the oldest when signs of deficiencies started (classic miracle grow 20-20-20 at 1/4 ratios for indoor plants, it was like a half teaspoon in a gallon of water). I ghetto tested my soil for ph by adding some vinegar to a sample and there was some definite fizzing, so therefore I concluded that the soil was slightly basic. to attempt to correct this on the cheap, I mixed a tablespoon of Braggs apple cider vinegar with a gallon of water and thouroughly watered each of them. They have seemed to take it not too badly, as I heard drastic changes in PH can shock young plants. They are still green and growth at the nodes continued over night. I found a friend with a soil ph/light/moisture meter that he said I could borrow. So I will be able to get some real numbers for you all soon. Currently I have two that are three weeks from seed. Three that are two weeks from seed and one that's about a week in. They are all bag seed and fairly old bagseed at that. I started topping them pretty early because I want to make them as compact as possible. If all six end up being females, I want to keep all six despite my space restrictions. But I will probably only end up with a couple if I'm lucky. The losers are going to be eaten in various ways for health purposes.

Any input would be appreciated. But please remember that I'm on a stupid tight budget so any jerry rigging advice is preferred to "go out and spend all your money on this shit that might not work anyway". I'm trying to keep this grow as simple as possible!

This is a new forum for me and I'm working on trying to upload pictures as this site doesn't support mobile uploads (we don't have a computer or TV/home internet). Any advice on how to circumvent that would also be appreciated. I know you guys need to SEE them to be able to help me diagnose my deficiencies.

Thanks for browsing and we hope you stick around!

Welcome from fellow noob. You have a design stirring but will absolutely need to get up to speed on PH. Cheapest thing you can buy is an Up/Down kit from General Hydroponics or similar. Several other things but PH a must, read this..
http://www.growweedeasy.com/ph#why-pH-cannabis

Homemade carbon scrubber? How will this work? You have to capture pretty much all closet air, normally done through negative pressure and exhaust

That's what I got so far. I plan on lining the inside of the large can and the outside of the small can with pantyhose. The space between either can will be filled with activated carbon. After assembled, I was going to make a cowling/connector to create an airtight seal with the fan on top. The air will be pulled through the filter instead of pushes based on the orientation of the fan. I plan on having those sitting in the top compartment of the closet or in the main room freestanding, whichever works best! We will see if it works. If it ends up being too small I will use the large can the interior chamber and make a new exterior with a plastic five gallon bucket. If I have to go that big though, I'm going to have to mix the carbon with hardwood charcoal from my firepit to stretch it. If I bought enough carbon to fill a five gallon bucket, I bet I could just buy a professional filter/fan combo. If the air is being circulated through the filter inside the room, won't the smell still get filtered out. I don't mind if my room smells a little I just can't have the whole block knowing what's going down.

Hehe ghetto but cool as hell! Def update on that. My girls are 33 days old, still in veg, and I can smell them almost immediately if I turn exhaust fan off. That's before flower! Silly me thought I could get away with no carbon filter. Installing one this weekend. If they smell like this now..

Yea, everything for me has to be ghetto right now. I also kinda like the idea of using as little resources as possible since I have spent so much money on herb over the years. We will see if that carbon filter works though. It doesn't need to 100%, My neighbors are used to smelling it from us smoking but as you all know, the smell is so much different when it's still fresh. If rather not have the whole block in on it. As a kid, we would guess who was growing in our neighborhood (quite correctly I might add) just by following our young stoner noses! I remember my auto flower adventure i undertook while I was still a minor living with my mother. You could smell it as soon as you opened my bedroom door and my cab was tucked in the back of my closet. That was just two little foot tall lowryders about a month in no filter. But they had a few small stinky buds going already.

I guess one of my biggest questions is also, considering the size of my closet and how many plants I have right now, when should o switch to flower? I don't want them to get too big to where I have to start chopping them too soon. My goal, if you could call it that would be to get a few ounces. Enough to last us until we can complete another harvest from seed. Initially I had planned two months veg for the youngest. But I'm worried that they will be too big by then. What says the more experienced growers?

Last night was quite productive. We bought new soil and a few 12 inch pots. We also bought a water filter that came with a digital ppm meter and I grabbed that soil tester from my buddy. After transplanting we tested old soil and new. The old ranged anywhere from 5 to 8, yikes! The new is hovering between 6 and 7, spot on! Mixed up a nice light nutrient mix and tested PH at 6.5. So I think I got my PH under control for now. The new meter also has a light meter and a moisture meter. The soil had a decent amount of moisture from the bag so I skipped watering them in for now. I figured the roots would like the nice fluffy light moist soil after coming out of those small clay filled pots. And I was right, check it out:

I also finished my carbon scrubber this morning. It most definitely pulls air, not as fast as I had hoped, but we will see in time if it gets the job done. And if it doesn't, it only cost me $12 so nothing really lost. I do hope it works however!!

Our carbon filter has been running for a few days now and I can say that it is at the very least making a difference. If you stand in front and smell the air it has pulled through, there is no odor except that of the carbon. I can put my hands around the filter when it's running and feel the current of air that's being pulled through. There just is not enough power to get the circulation that we need for it to be effective. There are still times when our bedroom is a little funky, which I personally love! However, it's not ideal for our situation. And this being only the veg cycle, I can tell we are in for a world of STANK! We are going to try running this filter with an actual inline fan. I found a 6 inch that pushes 250CFM for about $30 at a local hardware store. When we have the funds, we will be swapping them out and I will update you all on the results. Should it STILL fail to perform up to spec, we will be ordering a six inch refillable scrubber off of eBay. Found one that looks nice for about $60 no fan (which will be fine because the fan we are buying has the same CFM rating as the maximum of the pro filter.)

We transplanted the last seedling into the large pot last night and I made a surprise discovery, there's a CRITTER IN OUR CLOSET!! One of the smaller plants had a leaf that was all chewed to shit. Luckily I was prepared and did a neem oil treatment, foliar and soil. Also, since the soil was wet from the neem anyway, did my watering and feeding a little early.

I've been keeping an eye on my PH and I was noticing that as the soil dried, the PH was steadily rising to between 7.5 and 8! Is that normal? I've been trying to rectify by PHing my water with raw organic unfiltered Apple Cider Vinegar. It seems to help until the pots start to dry. Will this be acceptable or should I start looking for soil additives to decrease the PH permanently?

Later today I will be rearranging my lights to get a more even coverage. The light was concentrated perfectly for when they were all in their one liter pots. Now it's a little scarce on he edges. If I remember I will post some pictures. the pictures at the top are from before the transplant. The last one is the baby that was being munched on! The first picture is my shining star, simply because she's obviously different. It smells almost fruity when I rub the fan leaves. Any ideas on genetics people? I've never seen three fingered fan leaves that look like that. I'm suspecting a Sativa dominance, which I'm stoked about because my woman needs Sativa dominance for her anxiety while I prefer a nice heavy Indica for my back and neck pain.

Until later my friends!

Hey man, your set-up looks like mine from 2 grows back. Mine looked ghetto, but it grew some good stuff. Everythings a learning experience though, so it is what it is. Anyways, tour plants are looking good. Nice healthy green. They all look indica dominant IMO, very large fan leaves, and a darker green appearance is why I'm saying that. Keep pics coming. I'll definitely tag along for your grow! PEACE

Hey man, I recently finished my first grow(save my gf and I money, probably pretty similar situation as yourself.) I have learned a lot since I first started and will stop by n take a look.

I havnt read everything, but..

-definitley looks overwatered, possible pH problem.

-what gallon pots are they in now? They look huge compared to the plants whicb can cause problems cuz you want runoff everytime you feed and youd be pouring a ton on that little plant Nd wouldnt dry too slow.

-I have been told to not add ph up\down when dealing with soil. I use half tap water (let it sit out for 24hr) half RO water for feed andpure waterings. I Checked Ph until I felt confident itd stay in a good range.

-RO water has low ph, thats why I used 50/50 and I also added dynagro protekt (it naturally raises ph a little, and its silicon which benefits the plant especiLly during hot temps.)

- Make sure to get like 15% runoff, itll prevent salt buildup from nutrients. 100% NECESSARY.

-I water with the gatorade bottles with twisty mouthpiece ya know? I water like half, wait about 15min and water the rest.

-Oscilatting fan is essential

-I never wear shoes or anything thzt might have bugs in grow room.

-I told my good good buddy when we were drinking and regret it almost all day everyday.

Get some LED's bro! Not much heat, wayyyy wayyyy more yield with LED's than the same wattage of cfl's.

Assuming your in the USA, Phresh&Can Brand carbon filters are high quality and bring about peace of mind. If illegal theyre without a doubt essential. During flowering you will stink out your apartment please get a good one.

I use Fox farm soils and House and Garden nutrients. Im trying out organic this winter though, alot of experienced growers will tell you the majority of the flashy expensive nutrients are uneccesarry and I agree. Do your research and do what feels right. Youll be much more confident after your first grow.

I dont bash cfl as I use them for the first few weeks of veg stage. From what ive heard\seen I dont think youll be satisfied with your yield afters months of growing. I use a 4x4 tent and 600W Metal Halide\HPS.

I have been considering upgrading to LED's or an HID system. However, I would definitely need to do a tent setup with HID. I have no way of venting out of the apartment without drawing attention to ourselves. Been seeing lots of good deals on eBay. That all won't be for a while though. My biggest priority, as kind sir has so graciously pointed out, is a decent carbon scrubber. I'm not too concerned about lighting for the size op I'm looking for, as my nodes look tighter than some people who use HID's. Currently they are in approximately 2 1/2 gallon pots. I'm using some no name brand of organic soil that seems to be of good quality. It's nice and light, breaks up easily, holds moisture for a while and dried evenly. My only problem with the medium seems to be PH. Still creeping up. That's why they are over watered at the moment, trying to bring down the PH with what I have available. A friend of mine who works on a farm told me to try watering with 1/2 filtered water and half (cold) coffee that was brewed with used grounds. I think I'm going to try it and see if it works better than the vinegar. I keep getting scared that I will make the vinegar water too strong. I'm not using anything fancy, nute wise. Standard 20-20-20 miracle grow at 1/4 teaspoon per gallon (half strength for indoor plants). They seem to respond well to it at this strength. I'm looking for something lower nitrogen to replace it with for flowering. I'm also considering starting flowering sooner rather than later. I don't want to run out of room. I started six in the anticipation that the majority would be males coming from bagseed that was definitely past it's time. I'm thinking, "oh shit, what if they are all girls!?!" The oldest is right around 6 weeks in. I've also read somewhere that with smaller plants you don't want to veg too long or the yield and potency will suffer, but I've also heard the opposite. What say you all about veg times with smaller grows, should I wait a few weeks or make the switch ASAP?

Redistributed the lights on a new board. Thinking about adding another six 23 watters on a power strip for flowering. I have the room. That would bring total wattage up to 455! Pictures as of 10 minutes ago

I personally dont know about vegging too long and the potency/yield degrading but might be true?
I havnt used strictly cfl but Id want mine bigger before flip but maby you should flip in a week.

Did you cut dead leaf off or what happened?
Your soil looks like it needs more perlite.


Get your ph under control youll look better then

xPeaceofMindx717 said:

I have been considering upgrading to LED's or an HID system. However, I would definitely need to do a tent setup with HID. I have no way of venting out of the apartment without drawing attention to ourselves. Been seeing lots of good deals on eBay. That all won't be for a while though. My biggest priority, as kind sir has so graciously pointed out, is a decent carbon scrubber. I'm not too concerned about lighting for the size op I'm looking for, as my nodes look tighter than some people who use HID's. Currently they are in approximately 2 1/2 gallon pots. I'm using some no name brand of organic soil that seems to be of good quality. It's nice and light, breaks up easily, holds moisture for a while and dried evenly. My only problem with the medium seems to be PH. Still creeping up. That's why they are over watered at the moment, trying to bring down the PH with what I have available. A friend of mine who works on a farm told me to try watering with 1/2 filtered water and half (cold) coffee that was brewed with used grounds. I think I'm going to try it and see if it works better than the vinegar. I keep getting scared that I will make the vinegar water too strong. I'm not using anything fancy, nute wise. Standard 20-20-20 miracle grow at 1/4 teaspoon per gallon (half strength for indoor plants). They seem to respond well to it at this strength. I'm looking for something lower nitrogen to replace it with for flowering. I'm also considering starting flowering sooner rather than later. I don't want to run out of room. I started six in the anticipation that the majority would be males coming from bagseed that was definitely past it's time. I'm thinking, "oh shit, what if they are all girls!?!" The oldest is right around 6 weeks in. I've also read somewhere that with smaller plants you don't want to veg too long or the yield and potency will suffer, but I've also heard the opposite. What say you all about veg times with smaller grows, should I wait a few weeks or make the switch ASAP?

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If your room gets hotter than 70f then yes with 600watts + you either need to vent out or run an air conditioned room. I can tell you right now 350watts of my cfl's are hotter then my 400w metal halide and way way hotter then my 250w hps bulbs which btw gives me 2.5x more yield then my 350watt cfl grows.. Regardless of the point, id still recomend you a nice 3k led setup for flower. Not to mention the cfl's also get much hotter than led's of the equivilent wattage.