2x85W LED, plant count & perpetual planning advice

Hi there,

Long time reader and can finally legally grow so my first proper post

I have a converted closet on its side (would be straight up but the lights wont fit then) measuring, 5ft wide x 1.5ft deep x 4ft high, white matt. I got 2x85W LED from a lighting friend who said they are well used industrially and should suit me well. They are using 2835/500mW chips and rated PAR output of 750μmol/m²/s at 6 inches made up of 320 leds.

I am looking to flower 3 plants at 30cm (scrog/lst) every 8 weeks or so, I have a second smaller box for veg/keeping mothers, using a 85watt cfl and 70 watt hps. Currently I have started some new seeds and waiting to get them sprouted and vegging. I am starting with Mazar, Northern Lights and AK47 and plan on taking clones from the first grow to create the three mothers then take clones from those mother after the first lot have finished flowering for 8 weeks. Oh an I will be removing the boxing on the left side to create more room.

Don't worry too much about the plants in there now, just using them to find some good bag seed genes and get things dialed in. Germinated my new seeds today. Attached are a few pics for reference.

My question is please, Would this be sufficient for the space I have? Should I pop a 70 watt hps in there too?

I am a long time smoker and do have a green thumb but this is the first LED grow and I would like to ensure I am set up correctly and don't waste all that time should an obvious upgrade be necessary. Any tips, advice would be greatly appreciated.

Not nearly enough light to flower under.

Thank you, disappointing to hear, and If I added two more 70 watt hps?

Ill be visiting my buddy to kick his butt for him, the worst is I showed him the platinum 300 which I had on order and he said this would cover me.. jees

Maybe you should thank him? What did you pay for the Groline 85w lights? They're certainly higher quality than a p300, an overpriced crappy Chinese blurple that's actually 180 watts. You want around 30 watts/square foot with high quality LED (for flower), and more like 50 w/ft. with blurples and hps etc.

LED guru's, what do you make of these? Whats the efficacy of 2835's at 200mw?
http://ledlightingsolutions.co.za/images/2018/08/02/GroLineIP65.pdf
http://ledlightingsolutions.co.za/led-lighting-supplier-industries/horticulture

Thank you so much. Yes it's quite confusing and these are the questions I am asking so any advice would be most appreciated. He said they are good quality compared to the Chinese cheap stuff so seemed to understand my needs.

I got them for about 1400Zar each but he hooked me up I thnk, I believe this model is at 500 mW. He said they are use commercially so ya just decoding what I can.

Thanks again!

On their rating they are rated 160-180 lm/w. Does this mean that I can multiply that by 85 watts to get a lumen estimate?

I think that's $100 USD, good price for 170 watts! I think you need more for flowering, but I'm not sure just what you have. @Randomblame ?

Where are you seeing a lumen rating? A PPF rating would be great. https://fluence.science/science/par-ppf-ppfd-dli/

Well each light is 85Watt at 1400ZAR each so about $200 yes.

In the pdf linked above under the main certificates section on the right, or am I completely wrong reading in that?
I think the PPF rating is also there.

Thanks again! Love this site, always so much info!

If I look at the three spectra they all look like CRI90 with red peak around 630nm. If so that 160-180lm/w rating is impossible. Its probably more like 130 or 135lm/w and efficiency is maybe ~2 or 2,1μMol/J(w).
I would use them as close as possible to get 600-700μMol/s/m² and as high as needed for uniform coverage. A lux meter app is already enough to adjust hanging heights.
But 6-8" is probably the sweet spot with these lights. Can you get a 3rd one? Or better, take a Samung double row F-strip in 4ft length in 3000°k(~55$). One such strip can run with up-to 170w(HLG-150H-48, 45$) and with a siutable driver its dimmable down to 6-10%. (B type driver) Samsungs F-series strips you can get from digikey.com and Meanwell HLG-drivers are widely available.

The 750 PPF at 6" means measured in the center. The average PPFD is pobably a bit lower ..

Thank you for the detailed reply! Yes I was going to originally but 3 but figured I could always expand. I have actually since ordered a 4x50watt COB bridgelux custom built panel with 90 deg lenses from another local supplier which I think would do nicely in the center then.. for the time being I added 1 x 70 watt hps for some punch and I am running the panels on their dual setting to test the veg results. I am kinda curious about these though as they do seem to have great spread and coverage.

Thanks for the app tip!

Thanks @Randomblame! Sensison, make sure that COB light has dimming! And forget the lenses, you don't want those in a space only 4 ft high! With such low height, the strip Randomblame mentioned would be great. It would fit well with your current lights and can run at the same height.
https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/samsung-semiconductor-inc/SI-B8VZ91B20WW/1510-2229-ND/6676693

Or two single row strips, https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/samsung-semiconductor-inc/SI-B8V521B20WW/1510-2225-ND/6624009

Thank you guys, I really appreciate it! I am however also planning on increasing the height of this cabinet to closer to 6ft. Will update as I go along

sensison said:

Thank you guys, I really appreciate it! I am however also planning on increasing the height of this cabinet to closer to 6ft. Will update as I go along

Click to expand...

Yeah, enough height is important, bro. I also have to get away with only 66" and when pots are already 8-10" high and then hanging kit needs another 4 inch I've only 50" left to work with. Thats only 32" for plants and 18" for distance from canopy. I'm using LED strips and T5 UVB bulbs(see sig) and need a ninimum distance of 14-16" for even UVB distribution. I have a DIY stealthbox with a 3 and a 9sft area and believe me I've certainly regretted 100x that I did not build it higher.

Yea man I get you totally.. if I could put the cupboard upright it would mean 2m of space! I can also cut holes in the bottom to recede the pot level to maximize 'plant in box' space. The grow tents here after the law changed are stupid expensive, and personally I prefer the white anyway and like to diy and customize as I go along. Do you think I should turn it upright maybe and run the two light bars vertically down two sides with the 200 cob hanging from above? Or rather keep all the lights coming from the top?

Oh and all three of my seeds popped and are in small newspaper folded pots with ziplocs. Hope they take Cheers again man!