Might actually vote repub

[medicineman]

Dave, If we held to your logic, there would be a few million votes for a person that cannot win, Ron Paul. So Obama and Hillary and McCain all voted for the patriot act, yeah it is a piece of crap and I hate it. I hate about 99% of what the government does. I vote for the person that I think is electable and will do the most good (less damage), voting your conscience only does you any good, not anyone else. It may appease your conscience, but in the grand scheme of things it's pissing into the wind. I wouldn't presume to tell you how to vote, but actually it's a non-vote. Happy voting.

 

[40acres]

have any of you read the "Common mans history of the United States" or "freakanomics"?

 

[Seamaiden]

I sure haven't. Synopsis?

I gotta say, I am AMAZED that so many here, being who and WHAT you are, remain firmly entrenched in this two-party system dogma. You don't seem to understand that you can have an effect, not just YOUR vote, but discuss this stuff with those around you, inspire THEM!

Has anyone else here gotten involved politically on a local level? Have you ever seen something that needed to be done and gone out and DONE it? Do you act? Actions speak louder than words, words inspire action.

 

[medicineman]

I sure haven't. Synopsis?

I gotta say, I am AMAZED that so many here, being who and WHAT you are, remain firmly entrenched in this two-party system dogma. You don't seem to understand that you can have an effect, not just YOUR vote, but discuss this stuff with those around you, inspire THEM!

Has anyone else here gotten involved politically on a local level? Have you ever seen something that needed to be done and gone out and DONE it? Do you act? Actions speak louder than words, words inspire action.

And just exactly do you want us to do. I vote and try and talk to my friends to get them to vote, no matter who they want to vote for. I mean, I'm all for insurection, hell yeah. I just don't want to be singled out and spend the rest of my few years behind bars. They have laws against overthrowing the government, which is exactly what needs to be done.

 

[Seamaiden]

I have exercised my rights to become involved on a local level. Helped get an undeveloped area of a city where I used to live set aside, in perpetuity, as greenway migratorial route. I also ran for a seat on a local government board. Wasn't exactly a pretty experience, but experience it was, and it got a lot of people's attention on some important issues. People can get involved in caucuses, all SORTS of things. Of course, disillusionment may very well ensue as one begins to see and appreciate the true scope of things, the true scope of politics, but it's SOMETHING, and it's not just sitting on ass and making a stink for nothing, and it's NOT allowing oneself to be led around by the nose.

It's more than voting, it's more than talking, MM. It's more than that.

 

[medicineman]

I have exercised my rights to become involved on a local level. Helped get an undeveloped area of a city where I used to live set aside, in perpetuity, as greenway migratorial route. I also ran for a seat on a local government board. Wasn't exactly a pretty experience, but experience it was, and it got a lot of people's attention on some important issues. People can get involved in caucuses, all SORTS of things. Of course, disillusionment may very well ensue as one begins to see and appreciate the true scope of things, the true scope of politics, but it's SOMETHING, and it's not just sitting on ass and making a stink for nothing, and it's NOT allowing oneself to be led around by the nose.

It's more than voting, it's more than talking, MM. It's more than that.

Fine, you do it, I'm going to enjoy what little of my life I have left with the least hassel possible. I'll vote and you get involved. I'm rooting for you, I just don't feel like marching, go get em girl.

 

[Seamaiden]

When you see the hobbly-looking woman, you'll know that's me.

 

[hom36rown]

Hmm....lemme see here...

You smoke pot even though you know it's illegal. Your principles (and I'm assuming here) must tell you that pot should be legal and that everyone should be able to make that choice...that whole freedom and liberty thing, right?

And then you turn right around and vote for a man that voted for Patriot Act II that still gives the Federal Gov't that ability to piss on the 4th Amendment and allows the Federal Gov't to wiretap US citizens without a warrant.

So much freedom and liberty. So getting back to your question, my answer is...I see no logic.

Fine whatever dude, youre missing the point completely...sure, Im a sheep youree exactly rgiht, whatever. go ahead and waste your vote, you want that jackass mccain in office? its no skin off my nose. Hey maybe you should write yourself in who knows!

 

[hom36rown]

everyone wtrie in dave this year! We are going to make something happen people!

 

[VTXDave]

Fine whatever dude, youre missing the point completely...sure, Im a sheep youree exactly rgiht, whatever. go ahead and waste your vote, you want that jackass mccain in office? its no skin off my nose. Hey maybe you should write yourself in who knows!

How do you resolve the dichotomy of being a person who, I believe, values personal freedom and voting for a candidate who voted to curtail the freedoms of Americans?

And you believe that since I'm voting for Ron Paul and not Obama that I want McCain? How do you reach that conclusion? I'll make it easy for you then..."I" do not want Obama, Hillary OR anywhere near the Oval Office. Each of those candidates voted for Patriot and anyone who would even consider voting for them should be, IMHO,ashamed of themselves...That is of course unless they believe the Patriot Act a "constitutional" piece of legislation.

Oh I won't write myself in since I intend on running for county Supervisor come the next election.

 

[hom36rown]

How do you resolve the dichotomy of being a person who, I believe, values personal freedom and voting for a candidate who voted to curtail the freedoms of Americans?

And you believe that since I'm voting for Ron Paul and not Obama that I want McCain? How do you reach that conclusion? I'll make it easy for you then..."I" do not want Obama, Hillary OR anywhere near the Oval Office. Each of those candidates voted for Patriot and anyone who would even consider voting for them should be, IMHO,ashamed of themselves...That is of course unless they believe the Patriot Act a "constitutional" piece of legislation.

Oh I won't write myself in since I intend on running for county Supervisor come the next election.

notice my question mark...making it a question, as in do you want mccain to be president...because you are contributing to his victory if you vote for anyone other then obama plain and simple. Let me make it simple for you, I could name a whole laundry list of people Id rather have then obama, but I am not going to vote for them, BECAUSE IT IS A WASTE OF A VOTE. The primaries are over, ron paul lost by enourmous margins....he is not going to win, so a vote for him is a WASTED vote.

 

[Seamaiden]

And that's the attitude that keeps putting these others in office.

Do you not think we've heard it before? If you're going to take that stance, then just let others do the decision-making for you, really. Vote for who you think has the best chance of winning? You get exactly what you deserve. Unfortunately, we get it, too.

 

[hom36rown]

Dont blame me, I voted for ron paul in the primaries....he lost

 

[medicineman]

And that's the attitude that keeps putting these others in office.

Do you not think we've heard it before? If you're going to take that stance, then just let others do the decision-making for you, really. Vote for who you think has the best chance of winning? You get exactly what you deserve. Unfortunately, we get it, too.

So, tell me who is the best of the three choices. Yeah we get it, you are an idealist that votes your conscience, but that's pissing into the wind as he has no chance. Wouldn't you rather have an influence on reality than dream of what might have been? Voting for paul is so lame.

 

[VTXDave]

Ahhh....The comfort of apathy and complacency. Kinda makes you all warm and fuzzy, doesn't it?

If the men who founded this great nation held to those ideals we'd still be a colony.

 

[Seamaiden]

That must have been SUCH a hassle, dear.

Nothing that's ever worth it is ever easy.

 

[VTXDave]

...because you are contributing to his victory if you vote for anyone other then obama plain and simple.

And yet you still avoid answering my question regarding how you intend to resolve the contradiction of voting for a man who voted for Patriot II yet while you still believe (of course I'm making an assumption) that people should be entitled to personal freedom. You do believe in personal freedom (as in the right to smoke pot without legal repercussions, arrest, incarceration), yes? I won't vote for a candidate who voted for the Patriot Act and/or who voted to authorize the invasion of Iraq.

 

[hom36rown]

its very simple, I am voting for him because I dont want john mccain to win...and like I said, and like you even quoted me, you are contributing to his victroy if you vote for anyone other that obama. This is why we have primaries, I can understand maybe if ron paul barely missed getting the republic nomination writing him in, but he got what...1% of the vote, and we all no he isnt going to to get any superdelegates(because they dont waste their votes). I already said obama wasnt my first choice, but this is how elections work in america, the primaries narrow it down to two, and then you vote on the two choices. So if you want to vote for paul so you can bitch and moan about whoever becomes president and claim, "well, it isn't my fault, I voted for ron paul" then go ahead and do that, but I rather contribute to mccains defeat...if you wanna throw youre vote away...go ahead, quit bringing up obama signing the patriot act, I know, you told me 3 time now...it has nothing to do with throwing your vote away. The president is either going to be McCain or Obama(deal with it), I like Obama better of the two, so thats who I am going to vote for...does that explain it...I want my vote to count for something, and the plain and simple fact is your vote is going to achieve absolutely NOTHING, which is why it is a waste of a vote. I dont like the 2 party system or how elections work here either, but nevertheless, thats how it is.

 

[VTXDave]

I already said obama wasnt my first choice, but this is how elections work in america, the primaries narrow it down to two, and then you vote on the two choices.

Isn't it nice when the rules are spelled out for you?

And you still haven't answered my question.

 

[hom36rown]

You have no argument, you are wasting youre vote and any reasonable logical person knows it.