nomofatum
Well-Known Member
Not saying you won't, just saying you are being a sucker and wasting money.
What am I doing wrong (yield issue)?
- Thread starter JustCurious79
- Start date
RM3
Well-Known Member
not a soooo, kinda thing Epsom & Gypsum add sulfur, makes a huge difference !!!
nomofatum
Well-Known Member
You spent multiple times what you needed to on a product, that is enough to make you a sucker in my book.
Either option gets you the same results, except the extra cash in your pocket.
I'm not trying to be mean, just driven nuts by seeing that same bad decision (imho) repeated over and over and over on here.
xXOnyxXx
Well-Known Member
i'm happy with my grows, i get ROCKIN results ... so no skin off my ass on your opinions .. i know what works and what dont.. and not all calmag is created equal either .. but hey have fun, i'm done now.
blowincherrypie
Well-Known Member
lol so people who use tap water are smoking fluoride?
xXOnyxXx
Well-Known Member
if your local water dds flouride to the water .. then i would think yes, they thrive on the water and its a tds so yea it goes to the plants .... unless you use your own RO filter system that catchs the flouride. you can get a water sheet from your local water service to see whats in you tap water.
blowincherrypie
Well-Known Member
So we smoke the nutes now?? Is that how this works??
Nullis
Moderator
Things like chlorine and chloramines (which don't gas off as readily) are honestly probably a lot less detrimental to plants than you might think. The disinfectants are worse for the other living organisms (microbes) typically found in soil. At or below the concentrations used for disinfecting municipal water supplies the effect of chlorination (on plants) should be negligible.
Chlorine just tends to have very strong smell. Humans can start to smell chlorine in the air at concentrations above .002 ppm (really, that is parts per trillion). It is a disinfectant at 1 ppm. It is fine to drink up to 4 ppm, then it can start to cause irritation.
You should be able to get a water quality report from your municipality. These are more often found online these days, but are typically also mailed to your residence annually. That report will give you more detail about your water quality, including what disinfectants are used, how much is used, and what else is detectable in the water in terms of disinfection by-products, mineral content, etc.
Also, you don't need 5 or 6 foot plants! Shorter plants are better indoors. Try going for 2 to 3 feet at harvest. There is no point growing monster plants, especially when the lighting is insufficient. What most often happens in those cases is that the lower portions of the plant die off, or fail to develop/produce buds anyways, because those parts are shaded. They are not getting enough light to produce anything.
In fact, the lower branches are likely just exhausting resources siphoned away from the upper part of the plant, which is getting most of the light (and hence producing all the flowers). The quality of the flowers is also likely to be inconsistent, as will the maturation rates. Lack of light to some branches or lower branches is going to cause those parts to want to stretch. It will also tend to cause the lower blooms to mature differently. The top cola and buds there will be the densest and mature the fastest, while the lower blooms will be increasingly wispy and immature as you go down the plant.
With shorter plants you should actually yield more and end up with a more consistent finished product. Shorter plants will yield the same if not more top to bottom than larger plants under the same lighting, since the intensity of the light will be more consistent over all. As opposed to the top of the plant getting very intense light and the mid-section to bottom being in relative darkness.
Chlorine just tends to have very strong smell. Humans can start to smell chlorine in the air at concentrations above .002 ppm (really, that is parts per trillion). It is a disinfectant at 1 ppm. It is fine to drink up to 4 ppm, then it can start to cause irritation.
You should be able to get a water quality report from your municipality. These are more often found online these days, but are typically also mailed to your residence annually. That report will give you more detail about your water quality, including what disinfectants are used, how much is used, and what else is detectable in the water in terms of disinfection by-products, mineral content, etc.
Always keep the light as close to the canopy as possible, but obviously far enough away that it wont burn. An air cooled 600 watt lamp could easily be as close as 6-8 inches away from the lens. Light gets exponentially less intense the further away it travels from a fixed point source (which an HID lamp is). That is the basis of the inverse square law. By keeping your light on the ceiling at all times you're wasting a lot of it.
Also, you don't need 5 or 6 foot plants! Shorter plants are better indoors. Try going for 2 to 3 feet at harvest. There is no point growing monster plants, especially when the lighting is insufficient. What most often happens in those cases is that the lower portions of the plant die off, or fail to develop/produce buds anyways, because those parts are shaded. They are not getting enough light to produce anything.
In fact, the lower branches are likely just exhausting resources siphoned away from the upper part of the plant, which is getting most of the light (and hence producing all the flowers). The quality of the flowers is also likely to be inconsistent, as will the maturation rates. Lack of light to some branches or lower branches is going to cause those parts to want to stretch. It will also tend to cause the lower blooms to mature differently. The top cola and buds there will be the densest and mature the fastest, while the lower blooms will be increasingly wispy and immature as you go down the plant.
With shorter plants you should actually yield more and end up with a more consistent finished product. Shorter plants will yield the same if not more top to bottom than larger plants under the same lighting, since the intensity of the light will be more consistent over all. As opposed to the top of the plant getting very intense light and the mid-section to bottom being in relative darkness.
Nullis
Moderator
How do you know what he spent, what he needed? Why concern yourself with his cash, anyways?
You guys realize the OP is doing hydro, right? You realize everyone has different needs and ways of growing here? Why concern yourself with the products other people use, or what they choose to spend their money on? Especially something as common and petty as Cal-Mag products.
Some people don't need them. Some people don't. If you're growing in soil or some kinds of soil-less media, you probably don't need it. If you have hard tap water (which is hard because it has a mineral content), you probably don't it. However, if you use really clean water (RO, multi-stage filtered, bottled, distilled, rain) and/or are doing hydroponics then guess what: it does actually serve a purpose.
Gypsum, for one thing, can be a bitch to dissolve or keep dissolved in water. There is also a such thing as too much available sulfur. Sulfate is an anion and it does compete with other anions for uptake, most notably nitrate and molybdate. Some growers use epsom salt along with CalMag products.
RM3
Well-Known Member
Nullis, you're a mod and I'm not arguing, wasn't bangin on the OP either, just sharing a fact, sulfur feeds trics, and all of my research indicated no toxicity problems using sulfates, I have been givin my girls sulfates in 5 different forms and have quadrupled tric production, tis a fact I am trying to share with the community
nomofatum
Well-Known Member
I think it's a fair assumption he paid about going rate, and google told me that number.
Because that is one of the reason we come here, to get advice on how to improve our systems or save money. And the bud porn of course.
To me that is the whole point of places like rollitup. Share helpful knowledge. Saving money is helpful, growing more weed is helpful. Why wouldn't you want that help or want to give it. Both side are enjoyable if you aren't a stubborn emotional thinker.
Calcium Sulfate will dissolve without issue.
If you need both CalMag and epsom you have something screwed up. You can have too much of anything, shouldn't be an issue with the levels of Calcium Sulfate and Magnesium Sulfate you would be using, unless you have some wacky nutes loaded with sulfur.
Nullis
Moderator
Toxicity might not be so likely, but too much sulfate could potentially prevent nitrates or molybdenum from being absorbed. Hydroponic and other nutrients generally contain sulfate salts (e.g. sulfate of potash, sulfate of potash magnesia, etc.).
What they do not generally contain is calcium. Soil/media may be limed to provide calcium, and it may be present in many sources of tap water. Otherwise you need to add it in the form of a supplement, especially for hydroponics or media with little to no cation exchange capacity.
What they do not generally contain is calcium. Soil/media may be limed to provide calcium, and it may be present in many sources of tap water. Otherwise you need to add it in the form of a supplement, especially for hydroponics or media with little to no cation exchange capacity.
Nullis
Moderator
No more screwed up than your presumptions and pious sense of self worth.
E.g. I barely use nutrients. But I do occasionally use a half teaspoon of GO CaMg+ per gallon of my <10 ppm rain water and apply magnesium sulfate foliarly. And if you can't pull your head out of your ass for long enough to realize that you don't know what all everybody does or why or when or who really is the "stubborn emotional thinker": that is your own issue.
nomofatum
Well-Known Member
Wow, I think the Mod just crossed the line.
What part of what I said do you have a problem with? Seems like an attack without any reason or explanation.
nomofatum
Well-Known Member
You tricked me with the foliar part. If you put both CalMag and Epsom in a res, you are generally asking for trouble.
I know I don't know a great many things. I know I do know a great many things. I'm more than happy to receive additional education from anyone and everyone here. I'm also happy to share what I know. I can only hope others would have as good an attitude and perspective.
Apparently not all my hopes are going to be fulfilled, not a surprise.
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Nullis
Moderator
You have the "way I do" tunnel vision that prevents you from making assumptions about other members and the way they do (the fact that different people do different things for different reasons). Talk about being a stubborn emotional thinker. Don't get all offended just because I try to point this out.
Meanwhile, you're essentially attacking others in ludicrous fashion over their methods (e.g. products used) when you couldn't possibly even know much about them, or even what they spend on their grow. Sorry, Google tells you exactly what products a person uses along with exactly how much they paid for that product, dose/frequency of use, etc? Then Google also tells you the total cost of their grow and their yield?
Meanwhile, you're essentially attacking others in ludicrous fashion over their methods (e.g. products used) when you couldn't possibly even know much about them, or even what they spend on their grow. Sorry, Google tells you exactly what products a person uses along with exactly how much they paid for that product, dose/frequency of use, etc? Then Google also tells you the total cost of their grow and their yield?
nomofatum
Well-Known Member
That is odd, because I don't do it the way I'm recommending. I don't need to, my water has what I need for both calcium and magnesium. I've never added either Calcium Sulfate or Epsom to my res. It would seem you are the one making false assumptions.
I'm not attacking, I'm pointing out a cheaper option to do exactly the same thing. IMHO a better option. Please quote whatever you think I said that could possibly qualify as an attack.
Your last paragraph is extra silly. Regardless of the specific CalMag product, if you mix up an equal strength epsom/calcium sulfate DIY product you will paying well under 1/10th the cost per application.
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Nullis
Moderator
Good for you, and your water. Keep practicing as you preach, though, I mean... er...
But I love it, LOVE IT, when somebody posts with attitude like they're the pinnacle of Grow, talks about others being stubborn or emotional or whatever... and then gets all offended and deems I "crossed the line" for telling them to do something like pull their head out of their ass.
"My water has what I need for both calcium and magnesium.... so fuck all you suckers who don't use my water."
