RM3
Well-Known Member
If you read the link , you should have seen it was after reading a thread on defoil over at ICMAG the link was included and had specific defoil instructions which I followed
giving defoliation during flower a try
- Thread starter Gucc1M3ng
- Start date
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
I think I read that ic thread lol, that turned into shit really fast if it's the one I am thinking about, the first 10 pages is people bitching right? I couldn't even finish reading it because it was so childish. Glad you did a thread on it though, I'll check it out. I really think the best test would be x2 5x5 spaces with 9 plants each. One defoliated and one not touched at all. And the defoliation needs to start very early in veg. That would be a much better idea of the benefits or negatives. But glad you tried it and I'll check it out.If you read the link , you should have seen it was after reading a thread on defoil over at ICMAG the link was included and had specific defoil instructions which I followed
HeartIandhank
Well-Known Member
RM3
Well-Known Member
lol I wasn't surprised at allI bet you must have been soooo surprised when you saw the plant with leaves yield more..
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
There is no hate involved. I asked you to provide me with a bonafide report from a bonafide non-partisan, educational source and that doesn't mean from a stoner site or cheesy mag like High Times.That way you can see how I usually grow and you can stop hating on me and my waysGive me a minute.
I also don't care if everyone is doing it. That's what's wrong with cannabis forums, the blind leading the blind. Like they say, "a thousand flies on a pile of shit can't be wrong."
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
That is NOT a bonafide test done using scientific research standards by a well respected major university.
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I know about the high times, that's why I said take it with a grain of salt
I don't believe half of the things that come out of magazines like that, I just thought it was weird they posted an article about it a little after I started talking about it is all. I go to the library a lot, there's tons of articles from colleges about defoliation and many books about it. Cambridge has a lot of good tests. There's actually some articles on some .gov webpages. I read something interesting about defoliation and the effects below the soil with mycos. Defoliation increased mycos. I can't remember what article that was from. I also read something about heavy defoliation in the forest being beneficial. I've also read a lot of articles about defoliation of vegetables that had negative effects. I can't site where I read everything, but I assure you I'm not the type to just make things up, I try to think hard before I speak, so rest assured anything I say is pretty solid. I try not to lead anyone in the wrong direction and try to see the points of both sides. Totally agree with you on the forums "blind leading the blind", that could not be any more true. I can't count the number of times I read a thread about a question someone has and 10 people say the same thing when they answer the question and I sit back shaking my head because they are all wrong. They read something one time or some one tells them something and they automatically believe it. That's why I always dig deeper, especially into a subject like defoliation, even though my head is saying it's bad, I still want to make my own conclusion so Ill read all the tests and articles I can get get a better idea.I know this wouldn't be a scientific test, I mean, come on, no one around the forums can do a perfect lab testing experiment, but we have to work with what we have and I think a 5x5 area with the same conditions would be a good start as opposed to a couple plants under one light. I can't wait until the feds reschedule mj so the real testing can begin because we all know, 99% of the info we have is not directly associated with mj, most of the mj knowledge we have comes from personal experience (and yes the science behind plants) but mj is quite a bit different than any other plant species and there's so much to learn about it. I just love gardening, it's my favorite past time, well actually, I try to stay busy most of the day dealing with plants so it's more than a hobby to me. It's funny, the more plants I grow the more I learn, little tweaks here or there can make a huge difference. It's a learning experience until I die. And I don't want to sound like I'm disrespecting you when I rebuttal my thoughts, bouncing ideas off eachother is the way we all will progress and get better.
ISK
Well-Known Member
IMHO: that's the whole problem with the pot growing world, it's mostly illegal....so unlike the tobacco industry who can pour millions of dollars into legitimate hi-tech research to learn how to make the highest profits.
I seen an intensive study done by a Japaneses university (sponsored by a cigar company) on tobacco beetles...detailing everything about them, how they feed, reproduce, survive, and how to eliminate them...it has now become an industry standard that is undisputed.
When pot becomes as mainstream as tobacco or alcohol, we will have large industry commission universities, and the research facts that will be definitive
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
Yeah, the U of mississippi is still doing the studies, they have a mj farm on campus I believe, but their info is mostly under lock and key. There was a pretty good documentary on it. I think the gov. patents for cbd came from their studies
daybreaker
Well-Known Member
ok whos got the Nigerian?
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
It's amazing how the thc has tripled since those days! I forgot that miss University tests samples of buds from busts and documents the thc levels over the years, that's one of the major things they do there. Crazy to think some strains are hitting over 30% now a days. And the cbd was so low back then!
pk_boosted2
Well-Known Member
Took some time off from the non sense glad to see everyone still arguing over cultivation techniques they probably never even tried just read somewhere it didnt work and they stick to that belief lol!! But.. For those who want results keep reading!!
Defoliation *CAN increase yield but it absolutely can hurt it when not done correctly, but that is all strain dependent as previously mentioned. Defoliating your plants removes potential problems such as moisture build up during respiration process of fan leaves in tightly packed canopies and also gets rid of the small popcorn nugs on bottom of plants. As that article or other explain that these plants do not need all of those fan leaves after initial peak flowering is complete. The plant no longer is using these leaves for root production or foliage growth and focusing primarily on bud development which doesnt require the same processes it did during veg and early flowering so removing them after peak bloom wont hurt anything, and can be beneficial in several ways.
Fan leaves store nutrients which feed ur plant, but when ur feeding ur root zone everyday in hydroponic and drain to waste systems it doesnt matter anyways after peak flowering is completed the leaves begin yellowing and dying off as flower maturation and ripening begin. After flower production has came to a hault or reaches its peak (ripening stage) which ends roughly about week 5-6, removing of rest if these fan leaves to begin maturation provides stress that causes plants to increase resin and terpene production. Defoliating at this time also helps ripen and finish lower flowers that were deprived of light to help them finish maturing at same time as the rest of the plant, while also providing ample air flow throughout your garden which in turn helps ensure that the flowers produced are hard & dense colas throughout your plants from top to bottom!!
Yes that article is 100% accurate. As i mentioned before roughly 2 weeks prior to the end of bloom when most flowers have ceased growing and expanding i remove all of the fan leaves except ones inside the flowers themselves. So i basically just have stalks and flowers, then i reduce the light cycle down to 11/13 or 10/14 on 9/10 week strains which allows me to harvest sooner. When I see that the flowers are no longer "swelling" to reduce the wait time to ripen and force them to finish I reduce the dark cycle by 1 then 2 hours. If anyone is running 10 week strains and wants to finish them a week earlier if u do this u will have no ill effects and finish ripening much sooner with same end product!! Been doin it for years.. It also reduces the potential for some phenos that produce those unwanted banana flowers such as chemd, sours etc.. Which are all very common amongst those varieties, that are triggered by lengthy flowering times and prolonged ripening process (another little technique that works wonders, without sacrificng yield!!)..
*im sure uncle ben and others love to chime in with their information from the 70s before we had proven scientific research and better cultivation methods but when done properly defoliation serves many highly beneficial purposes it provides optimal plant growth and flower production, produces harder denser colas, relieves potential mold and funguses and can directly impact yield and resin quality increases dramatically (as it is a stressor which leads to more resin output).
Ill put up some pics tomorrow of one of my room in week 7 right now and show u how much bigger the colas have swollen before and after leaf removal. They almost double in size with only about 15% of fan leaves remaining on the plants which were all stripped on day 42-44. Got about 12 days left in bloom til the chop!! Ill give a final weigh in and count too. With (AN nutes) lmao... BOL and Happy Harvesting
pk_boosted2
Well-Known Member
People argue about defoliating but say lollipopping works at end of the day its the same fuckin idea. When u lollipop ur removing or "defoliating" the plant the wont receive light to focus all energy on upper cola for increased production. Same thing as defoliating selectively during bloom to focus the energy and light to bud sites to increase flower development. The reason lower plant doesnt produce large colas is simply because of inneficient light down low that why people came up w supplemental lighting and dangling bulbs to provide light source underneath to increase lower bud development.
Saying defoliation doesnt work is not true bcuz theres many diff ways to "defoliate" a plant. Obiously removing all ur fan leaves during early flowering will likely kill ur plant removing or selectively removing large light blocking leaves wont hurt and will actually increase flower development mongst other benefits. U think someone just came out of nowhere and made this shit up? Lol.. In 5-10 years it will probably be the norm after more and more research comes out about it and its benefits, leaf pruning and defoliation is a somewhat new concept like many other cultivation techniques that were thought to be "outrageous" arenow common place. Its a pioneered way to increase yields indoors! And those of us who have used and began to master such techniques are reaping its rewards while others are too afraid to try it out. Like my reference about ppl who thought the world was flat until it was discovered that it wasnt its just another thing ppl are afraid of "falling off the earth" defoliation works wonders!!
Saying defoliation doesnt work is not true bcuz theres many diff ways to "defoliate" a plant. Obiously removing all ur fan leaves during early flowering will likely kill ur plant removing or selectively removing large light blocking leaves wont hurt and will actually increase flower development mongst other benefits. U think someone just came out of nowhere and made this shit up? Lol.. In 5-10 years it will probably be the norm after more and more research comes out about it and its benefits, leaf pruning and defoliation is a somewhat new concept like many other cultivation techniques that were thought to be "outrageous" arenow common place. Its a pioneered way to increase yields indoors! And those of us who have used and began to master such techniques are reaping its rewards while others are too afraid to try it out. Like my reference about ppl who thought the world was flat until it was discovered that it wasnt its just another thing ppl are afraid of "falling off the earth" defoliation works wonders!!
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
Thank you pk boost! Someone not afraid to speak up and try new things. I know there's people who defoliate that grow 10x better than anyone you see around forums, I know it's not a myth, just don't know how to properly and have not tried it myself. The reason the people that are successful with the technique aren't more out spoken about it is because they get shit on in forums about it and they just keep to themselves and bust out 3 lb plants under one light indoor consistently. The underground growers no one will ever see unless you know them 
pk_boosted2
Well-Known Member
Thats the problem with the internet people come on here and all of a sudden its like they r in the Army "they can be all they can be and more" lol. Never met soo many Navy SEALS and master growers in my life til i came on this forum. Everyone thinks they are right and everyone else is an idiot. I tried for awhile and gave up havent posted in a minute but I got so many messages I decided jump back on here.Thank you pk boost! Someone not afraid to speak up and try new things. I know there's people who defoliate that grow 10x better than anyone you see around forums, I know it's not a myth, just don't know how to properly and have not tried it myself. The reason the people that are successful with the technique aren't more out spoken about it is because they get shit on in forums about it and they just keep to themselves and bust out 3 lb plants under one light indoor consistently. The underground growers no one will ever see unless you know them
Anyways, yeah man BOL with your garden hope you find good solid info that can help u in your journey and get great results. I just recommend checking multiple sources for information before deciding or trying new things bcuz half shit in these forums or articles online are complete BS. Theres nothing better than trial and error and doing things yourself. I been in many ridiculous arguments on this forum lol gets you no where so I wont even address any of it anymore, just gonna keep doin me and answering questions if anyone directs them my way and keepin it 100!! BOL and Happy Harvests..
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
Thanks man, much appreciated! And yeah, I don't know why the forums are like that sometimes, you'd think people would want to learn new techniques, I bet this same stuff went on when super cropping came around though, in time people's curiosity will spark and gardens will get better. It might not be with defoliation, but that's why I came to this thread, I wanted to see what there was to say about it, but there's only hostility, at least that's what I sense. I guess I don't get it, I grow just as well as anyone here, But I still want to learn, it's like no one knows how to have a Convo about how to make their garden better because they think it's already the best in the world. News flash, we all suck if we're not getting 2gpw +
stankyyank
Active Member
Regardless of the results, it might be arguable that half of the cuts readily available to the avg grower will self -or straight freak and turn pollen sacs.