Yes another leaf yellowing thread...4 weeks 12/12...something wrong or am I paranoid?

[DaBong]

I have read alot of the "leaf yellowing" threads here and I still can't tell if I have a problem or not.

These plants have been flowering 12/12 for about 4 weeks now, and over the last week or so I have noticed a sudden yellowing of the bigger fan leafs.

From what I have read it seems that yellowing to a degree is perfectly normal.

I just wanted some opinions about these plants as I'm affraid of this problem getting worse and ruining the buds that have grown so far.

All the grow info is in my grow journal if you wanna look, if not here is the basic run down:

soil grow
400 watt hps
alternating watering only when pots feel light with half jacks classic all purpose and half blossom booster, then FF big bloom, and I have added a 1/2 teaspoon per gallon of molassas the last couple of waterings

The only thing I have been unsure about is my PH. I don't have a good meter. I have a test kit that only measures from like 8 to 7, but I tested my water and it seemed well below 7 as the color was lighter that what 7 should have been.

With that said, do these plants look normal for this stage of flowering or is something wrong?

 

[woodsmaneh!]

You have a nitrogen issue big time. Your plant is starving up the food to recommended levels. Get some Cal-Mag asap and give it a shot as recommended than go 3/4 on the next water than 1/2 recommended after that. Stop 2 weeks before harvest.

If your leaves turn a deep dark Green back of the Cal-Mag or what ever you get.

[FONT=&quot]A nitrogen-deficiency can be recognized by reduced growth-rates and yellowing of the leaves (starting with the older/lower leaves). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Colder soil-temperatures make nitrogen less-available to plants. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Usually the deficiency will start on the lower to middle part of the plant, and then will usually happen to older leaves first. Then the deficiency will work its way up the plant. Your plant can be green on top, then yellowing on the lower leaves when the deficiency is starting out. Yield will be greatly reduced without good amounts of nitrogen in your plants. [/FONT]


Heres more info


[FONT=&quot]Element Name:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Nitrogen [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Symbol:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] N [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Atomic Number:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] 7 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Atomic Mass:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] 14.00674 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen is the first major element responsible for the vegetative growth of plants above ground. With a good supply, plants grow sturdily and mature rapidly, with rich, dark green foliage. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]History[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen was discovered by chemist and physician Daniel Rutherford in 1772. He removed oxygen and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]carbon dioxide (CO2)[/FONT][FONT=&quot] from air and showed that the residual gas would not support combustion or living organisms. At the same time there were other noted scientists working on the problem of nitrogen. These included Scheele, Cavendish, Priestley, and others. They called it "burnt" or" dephlogisticated air,” which meant air without oxygen. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen Compounds and Nitrogen in Nature[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Sodium[/FONT][FONT=&quot] nitrate (NaNO3) and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]potassium[/FONT][FONT=&quot] nitrate (KNO3) are formed by the decomposition of [/FONT][FONT=&quot]organic[/FONT][FONT=&quot] matter with compounds of these metals present. In certain dry areas of the world these saltpeters are found in quantity and are used as fertilizers. Other inorganic nitrogen compounds are nitric acid (HNO3), ammonia (NH3), the oxides (NO, NO2, N2O4, N2O), cyanides (CN-), etc. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The nitrogen cycle is one of the most important processes in nature for living organisms. Although nitrogen gas is relatively inert, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]bacteria[/FONT][FONT=&quot] in the soil are capable of “fixing” the nitrogen into a usable form (as a fertilizer) for plants. In other words, Nature has provided a method to produce nitrogen for plants to grow. Animals eat the plant material where the nitrogen has been incorporated into their system, primarily as protein. The cycle is completed when other [/FONT][FONT=&quot]bacteria[/FONT][FONT=&quot] convert the waste nitrogen compounds back to nitrogen gas. Nitrogen is crucial to life, as it is a component of all proteins. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The Nitrogen Cycle[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The nitrogen cycle represents one of the most important nutrient cycles found in terrestrial ecosystems . Nitrogen is used by living organisms to produce a number of complex organic molecules like amino acids, proteins, and nucleic acids. The store of nitrogen found in the atmosphere, where it exists as a gas (mainly N2), plays an important role for life. This store is about one million times larger than the total nitrogen contained in living organisms. Other major stores of nitrogen include organic matter in soil and the oceans. Despite its abundance in the atmosphere, nitrogen is often the most limiting nutrient for plant growth. This problem occurs because most plants can only take up nitrogen in two solid forms: ammonium ion (NH4+ ) and the ion nitrate (NO3- ). Most plants obtain the nitrogen they need as inorganic nitrate from the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]soil[/FONT][FONT=&quot] solution. Ammonium is used less by plants for uptake because in large concentrations it is extremely toxic. Animals receive the required nitrogen they need for metabolism, growth, and reproduction by the consumption of living or dead organic matter containing molecules composed partially of nitrogen. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In most ecosystems nitrogen is primarily stored in living and dead organic matter. This organic nitrogen is converted into inorganic forms when it re-enters the biogeochemical cycle via decomposition. Decomposers, found in the upper soil layer, chemically modify the nitrogen found in organic matter from ammonia (NH3 ) to ammonium salts (NH4+ ). This process is known as mineralization and it is carried out by a variety of bacteria, actinomycetes, and fungi. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen in the form of ammonium can be absorbed onto the surfaces of clay particles in the soil. The ion of ammonium has a positive molecular charge is normally held by soil colloids. This process is sometimes called micelle fixation (see Figure 9s-1). Ammonium is released from the colloids by way of cation exchange. When released, most of the ammonium is often chemically altered by a specific type of autotrophic bacteria (bacteria that belong to the genus Nitrosomonas) into nitrite (NO2- ). Further modification by another type of bacteria (belonging to the genus Nitrobacter) converts the nitrite to nitrate (NO3- ). Both of these processes involve chemical oxidation and are known as nitrification. However, nitrate is very soluble and it is easily lost from the soil system by leaching. Some of this leached nitrate flows through the hydrologic system until it reaches the oceans where it can be returned to the atmosphere by denitrification. Denitrification is also common in anaerobic soils and is carried out by heterotrophic bacteria. The process of denitrification involves the metabolic reduction of nitrate (NO3- ) into nitrogen (N2) or nitrous oxide (N2O) gas. Both of these gases then diffuse into the atmosphere. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Almost all of the nitrogen found in any terrestrial ecosystem originally came from the atmosphere. Significant amounts enter the soil in rainfall or through the effects of lightning. The majority, however, is biochemically fixed within the soil by specialized micro-organisms like bacteria, actinomycetes, and cyanobacteria. Members of the Cannabis family and some other kinds of plants form mutualistic symbiotic relationships with nitrogen fixing bacteria. In exchange for some nitrogen, the bacteria receive from the plants carbohydrates and special structures (nodules) in roots where they can exist in a moist environment. Scientists estimate that biological fixation globally adds approximately 140 million metric tons of nitrogen to ecosystems every year. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
Horticultural-Benefit [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen promotes photosynthesis, and is directly responsible for the production of chlorophyll. It stimulates leaf and stem growth, and aids the overall size and vigor of the plants. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Deficiency-Symptoms[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]A nitrogen-deficiency can be recognized by reduced growth-rates and yellowing of the leaves (starting with the older/lower leaves). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Colder soil-temperatures make nitrogen less-available to plants. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Usually the deficiency will start on the lower to middle part of the plant, and then will usually happen to older leaves first. Then the deficiency will work its way up the plant. Your plant can be green on top, then yellowing on the lower leaves when the deficiency is starting out. Yield will be greatly reduced without good amounts of nitrogen in your plants. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen def will start from the tips and work its way back to the leaf node. Nitrogen and Magnesium get confused. The best way to tell them apart is, nitrogen deficiency starts around the tips and works its way to the back of the leaves, where a magnesium deficiency will cover the entire outer part of the leave and make the entire leaves yellow leaving the veins to stay green. If your plants are having a slow growth rate and have yellowing of the leaves, then most likely it’s a nitrogen deficiency. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Towards the middle to end of flowering stages, the plant will show a nitrogen deficiency almost always. This process is completely normal and just let the plant naturally yellow out as it uses it's stored nutrients. This actually helps you by getting ready for final flushing and then harvesting. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nitrogen Toxicity:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Leaves are often dark green and in the early stages abundant with foliage. If excess is severe, leaves will dry and begin to fall off. Root system will remain under developed or deteriorate after time. Fruit and flower set will be inhibited or deformed. With breakdown of vascular tissue restricting water uptake. Stress resistance is drastically diminished. [/FONT]

 

[hellraizer30]

cal mag has a low nitrogen content id go with omi natures necture they have a product line that targets each of the n-p-k, get the nitrogen one its like a 5-0-0
works great plus theres alot of people on here that say cal-mag isnt worth it

 

[DaBong]

Thanks for the responses! I'm not doubting either one of you, but from what I have read, aren't you supposed to slack off the nitrogen in the flowering stage? I have been giving these plants Jacks classic all purpose for awhile and that is supposed to have alot of nitrogen in it.

I'm looking on amazon now to get some prices for cal-mag and Nature's Nectar Nitrogen.

Wouldn't a higher dose of the jacks classic all purpose that I already have do the same thing as these other products?

 

[DaBong]

Bumping this for a few more opinions.....

If this is a Nitrogen deficiency do I need one of these other products mentioned or can I just use a stronger dose of this jacks classic all purpose?

 

[d. mcandrews]

bump, good question.

 

[SinSimian]

For being four weeks into flowering I don't think your girls look bad at all. Still, don't skimp on your nutes but also don't over do it. In flowering it's my understanding that the plant eats herself as she dies, pulling much of the needed nutes from within the fan leaves, hence a discoloration and possibly dieing leaves.

 

[andthatisright]

did you try flushing, maybe the nitros there but locked out cause you need to flush every so often, maybe

 

[andthatisright]

need to repot too by the look of it

 

[DaBong]

For being four weeks into flowering I don't think your girls look bad at all. Still, don't skimp on your nutes but also don't over do it. In flowering it's my understanding that the plant eats herself as she dies, pulling much of the needed nutes from within the fan leaves, hence a discoloration and possibly dieing leaves.

I was thinking that this might be normal to an extent, it just seemed like it was happening a little too quick.

did you try flushing, maybe the nitros there but locked out cause you need to flush every so often, maybe

I have a digital PH meter on the way and when it arrives I plan on flushing with PH'ed 6.8 water.

As far as repotting, that's not really possible as I don't currently have anymore soil on hand. I had thought that these 3 gallon pots would have been plenty big enough if that is what you meant.

 

[andthatisright]

ah right the pots looked smaller than they are

 

[DaBong]

ah right the pots looked smaller than they are

Yea they are 3 gallon. Thanks for your suggestions.

 

[DaBong]

Well, PH meter didn't get here yesterday and I didn't want to wait anymore. Earlier I watered them with just the jacks all-purpose. Hopefully this will help, guess we will see. Wish me luck!

 

[andthatisright]

get a Ph testing kit in a diy garden section or a gardening store just pretend its for your daffodils haaha

 

[countrygirl]

This is what I go through everytime so far, I will be watching your results. maybe it IS normal. I always start to panic when the leaves yellow. I have yet to get to harvest with any leaves left on the plant. The bud is always good tho, that's what counts hehehe.

 

[DaBong]

I have yet to get to harvest with any leaves left on the plant. The bud is always good tho, that's what counts hehehe.

Yea, I have already sampled

If the buds start to go down hill I guess I will just have to harvest early. I've spent about all the money I want to on this particular crop.