Vegging bulb

Discussion in 'Newbie Central' started by ILoveUMaryJane, Jan 11, 2007.

  1.  
    ILoveUMaryJane

    ILoveUMaryJane Well-Known Member

    Right, so, I got an HPS with integrated hood and ballast from eBay. I've read that I shouldn't veg under this light, that I want a more blue light - firstly, am I right in thinking this? Now, I also read that HPS lights are always E40 fitting bulbs - T/F? If so, can I get a more blue spectrum bulb with this fitting to put in for veg, then put the red one in for flowering? If so, can someone recommend one that'd fit?!
    Cheers guys, sorry bout all the questions!
  2.  
    nongreenthumb

    nongreenthumb Well-Known Member

    if you want to use the same reflector and just change the bulb a metal halide will be the best for veg and is also an e40 fitting, as far as i know all hps that are 250w or above have an e40 type fitting, but then i suppose that might differ depedant on which country you live in.
  3.  
    videoman40

    videoman40 New Member

    I vegged under a HPS with no problems at all
  4.  
    nongreenthumb

    nongreenthumb Well-Known Member

    Yeah you can veg ok under a hps, if you get an altered spectrum one, but if you use mh afterwards you see the diference and the speed at which things happen, I think a good mh can take a week off the veg stage in comparison to a hps. for the sake of 15 of whichever currency to buy just the bulb and switch them over at the different stages.
  5.  
    dankciti

    dankciti Well-Known Member

    thats great i was gonna go look at MH's and hoods i have some extra hoods for 1kw hps's and 600w i think so i am going bulb shopping..:mrgreen:
  6.  
    ILoveUMaryJane

    ILoveUMaryJane Well-Known Member

    thanks for the advice peeps - anyone wanna chuck in their two pennies or am I gonna go ahead and order a shiny new MH? Also, are MHs similarly hot to HPSs?
  7.  
    babygro

    babygro Well-Known Member

    Get a HPS conversion bulb that outputs more light in the blue spectrum than a standard HPS bulb would - I beleive (I'd need to check on it) the Sylvania Growlux outputs a decent amount in the blue spectrum.

    Don't bother with Metal Halides, you'll need to buy a new ballast to run them.
  8.  
    ILoveUMaryJane

    ILoveUMaryJane Well-Known Member

    wait a sec, that's quite a different opinion to what the others have said! Why does an MH require a different ballast?
  9.  
    babygro

    babygro Well-Known Member

    Because it's a different system and uses different starting voltages, line voltage and operating characteristics? Some ballasts are switchable between HPS and MH and if you had one of those you could switch between the two, but by the sounds of it you don't.

    You can't just put a Metal Halide bulb in a HPS system and expect it to work - it may work, but it probably won't last very long. Just because other ill-informed people had told you, you can put a Metal Halide bulb in your HPS system doesn't make them right I'm afraid.

    Actually looking back through the thread, no-ones told you, you can put a Metal Halide bulb into a HPS system and ballast - you've misunderstood what they've said - they've said you can use a MH system as an alternative to a HPS system.
  10.  
    ILoveUMaryJane

    ILoveUMaryJane Well-Known Member

    Ok, there's no need to take that tone - you're not talking to a child or an idiot, it just happens that this as not an area i'm that familiar with. The reason I post on here is so better informed people (like you I assume) can help me out! And please, I appreciate your advice, but what nongreenthumb said was that I could 'just change the bulb'.
  11.  
    nongreenthumb

    nongreenthumb Well-Known Member

    On my 400w ballast it says hps, but it has been running a mh for over a month, and seems to be doing so just fine,
  12.  
    nongreenthumb

    nongreenthumb Well-Known Member

    Oh just so we get one thing straight though, I am in no way guaranteeing that it will work, I take no responsibility if anything goes wrong.
  13.  
    ILoveUMaryJane

    ILoveUMaryJane Well-Known Member

    Cheers nongreenthumb, appreciate the advice
  14.  
    videoman40

    videoman40 New Member

    I think what nongeenthumb meant was to use a conversion bulb, the following is from htgsupply.com
    What is a "CONVERSION" lamp and why should I use one?
    A "conversion" lamp is a specially designed and constructed lamp that allows operation of a HPS lamp type with a MH ballast type or an MH lamp type with a HPS ballast type. These lamps, while once unreliable and expensive, now have become very dependable in quality and performance and the price is very reasonable. They serve the purpose of improving yields for indoor growers who have only one type of lighting systems for their garden. For example, suppose an indoor gardener has purchased a HPS lighting system. They may also use a Metal Halide Conversion lamp for the vegetative growth cycle of the garden and then switch to the HPS light for flowering/fruiting phase of growth. This is a very popular way to grow plants indoors and will dramatically increase yields. HTGsupply.com highly recommends the use of an MH conversion lamp if you are using a HPS system for your indoor garden, our customers have reported significant yield increases with our conversion lamps!
  15.  
    nongreenthumb

    nongreenthumb Well-Known Member

    No i meant what i said, i have a conversion hps, but i still plug a normal mh into the reflector and use the same hps ballast to power it, has been doing just fine for over a month
  16.  
    warmboe

    warmboe Well-Known Member

    I've not experienced first hand a system failing from putting a mh bulb in a hps system, and I'm glad yours still works nongreenthumb. My husband has been an electrician for 9 years, and his dads been one for over 40 years, and he's navy trained (supposed to be the best). they said that the two are very similar, only diff being the level of heat it is able to put up with, and some diff twisting in the wires, as far as they know off hand. They said that one WILL run the other one fine. As far as long or short/long term extra wear and tear by using the wrong bulb in the wrong ballast, they weren't sure, but on my request, his dad will find out for me, then I will post what he finds.:peace:
  17.  
    warmboe

    warmboe Well-Known Member

    I did a little research on my own and I found this: HID Lamp Electrical Properties for Homebrew Ballast Builders and Experimenters

    What I got from that is you can run hps on a mh ballast, but not very often the other way around, probly not unless it said so on your ballast. Interesting; 35w hps actualy uses 35w. 35w mh actualy uses 39w.

    Anyway, read it and see what your conclusion is. Then you can make your choice according to what you're comfortable with.:peace:

    Best of Luck!
  18.  
    Al B. Fuct

    Al B. Fuct once had a dog named

    The point has been made that vegging plants prefer a bit of a bluish spectrum. All credit to those who go to the trouble of using MH for their veggers. It's the ideal way to go.

    However, I've used nothing but a spectrum-modified 400W HPS to maintain my 7-10 mums for quite a few years now. Used to be that it was only the Philips Son-T-Agro HPS lights had added blue, but now Sylvania, GE and many other makers sell this sort.

    I haven't done a side-by-side comparison of MH to modified spectrum HPS. I suspect that veggers under MH would be more compact and dense. However, that would kinda work against the way I grow. I cut very big clones for my SOG, approximately 150mm tall. I don't mind a bit of stretch in my mums. I do a pass of cuts every 2 weeks, so the longer stems make for cuttings which better suit my technique.

    Cannabis is fun to work with because it's so easily manipulatable for different growing situations.
  19.  
    babygro

    babygro Well-Known Member

    With the greatest respect to your husband and his dad, are they experienced with MH and HPS ignition systems? If it was as simple as you suggest, why don't manufacturers simply make one ballast that works with both? Why produce separate ballasts for HPS and MH? The simple fact is because the systems are different and use different ignition voltages for igniting the bulbs. Yes you could get away with putting a MH bulb in a HPS system, but its life will be severely shortened due to the different voltage ignition.

    It's the same as putting the wrong spark plugs in your car - yes itll work and yes the engine will fire and run, but those spark plugs wont last long if they're the wrong ones - they'll burn out quickly.

    However, I don't care - it's not my bulb, it's not my money and it's not my lighting system.
  20.  
    warmboe

    warmboe Well-Known Member

    Honestly, no, hps & mh are not their specialty, although they have been hired by many to set up grow rooms. If you notice my next post after the one you quoted, I did some research on my own and came up with the same conclusion as you; they will run, but if they are used improperly (mh in a hps ballast) it will greatly decrease the ballasts life. It realy is that simple though, the differences in the wiring and the make-up of the ballast, which would include the start up power used and the run power, is what
    makes the mh incompatable w/ the hps ballast. Apparently the mh is more demanding so will cause unwanted wear on the hps ballast.

    I personaly have a ballast that switches from hps to mh, so I don't have to worry bout that.:peace:

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