US college professor demands imprisonment for climate-change deniers
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ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Denier or not, many of my friends and neighbors are buying hybrid and electric cars for a more basic reason; they're less expensive to own and operate, environmental friendliness is just a nice bonus.
The current fossil fuel industry is currently awash in a great oily ocean of government subsidies, from sales and use tax breaks to waiving severance taxes on public land, the list is endless. END THOSE and let fossil fuels compete on a level playing field with alternatives- and I already know the outcome.
So just how big is that 'vast ocean' of subsidies? It's bigger than all of America's Federally subsidized (ie, not social security) social programs COMBINED. Interesting what that says about our national priorities, isn't it?
The current fossil fuel industry is currently awash in a great oily ocean of government subsidies, from sales and use tax breaks to waiving severance taxes on public land, the list is endless. END THOSE and let fossil fuels compete on a level playing field with alternatives- and I already know the outcome.
So just how big is that 'vast ocean' of subsidies? It's bigger than all of America's Federally subsidized (ie, not social security) social programs COMBINED. Interesting what that says about our national priorities, isn't it?
Doer
Well-Known Member
All the green so far is just moving the problem around for profit, I think. MTBE, Ethanol fuel dilutes all have/had subsidy. But, I have to say, the air is much cleaner.
Those E-battery cars, the batteries are polluting. Power to charge them is polluting.
All a scam still, to me. No range. Hours of charge time. And we don't know the half of interlace and locked on purpose subsidies.
Sometimes it is good, in the effect, like clean air in San Fransisco.
Those E-battery cars, the batteries are polluting. Power to charge them is polluting.
All a scam still, to me. No range. Hours of charge time. And we don't know the half of interlace and locked on purpose subsidies.
Sometimes it is good, in the effect, like clean air in San Fransisco.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
Won't even touch the whale leg bones, that's interesting..
One never to be questioned, followed upon faith, at the threat of death; religion. The other encourages questioning, is accepted upon evidence, and provides more efficient ways to enjoy life; science.
Science has been used to explain reality based on observation, not faith or belief. Science is the explanations of what works whether you believe it or not. Hence the "controversies"
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
How has the theory of evolution changed from when Charles Darwin first published On the Origin of Species to now?
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
The Tesla Model S can be charged enough for a 270km range, in 30 mins, or to half power in 20 mins.
Using the dual plug method (not the faster supercharge method), your charge time would be about 1 hour, to travel 60 miles per day, and would cost about $2.47. Which is about $0.04/mile.
Let's say you decide to buy a Jetta Hybrid.... Let's take the highest rating for mileage they use, which happens to be 48pmg. Using $3.75/gallon for fuel @ 48 miles, that's $0.08/mile. Double the cost per mile over the Tesla....
I don't know the rest of the calculations to figure out how much CO2 was produced to refine the gasoline compared to producing the electricity, but at least from a cost perspective, E-cars make sense.
Mindmelted
Well-Known Member
Yeah until your battery banks go bad! Then what is that going to cost?
And i dont have to recharge my car every 60 miles.
Hell i drive 2 weeks on a tank of gas in my nissan truck.
Doer
Well-Known Member
And they say it makes sense, You can fool some of the people all of the time.
Let's say you do run out of E. Now what? Will you have to wait for a charge as well as the tow truck.
The last Tesla S commercial I saw, they dubed the sound of a Lotus or something. It is all fake, at this point.
Let's say you do run out of E. Now what? Will you have to wait for a charge as well as the tow truck.
The last Tesla S commercial I saw, they dubed the sound of a Lotus or something. It is all fake, at this point.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
The range is about 480km per charge, not 60 miles (100km). You know you can plug it in at night, right?
What happens in a new vehicle if your engine blows up? If it's under warranty, (usually 5 year/100,000km-160,000km power train warranty) it's fixed for free. If not, you pay out of pocket.
The Tesla has an 8 year/Unlimited distance warranty on the batteries. Over 8 years you could easily save $20-25k or more, in gas costs, depending on how you drive, and how often you drive. And that's making a pretty bold assumption that the batteries will suddenly fail after 8 years....
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
Not surprising, another assertion with zero references. Keep em comin'.... just fuel for the rock fire.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
So, a commercial used a fake sound, therefore all of Tesla is just a bunch of baloney.
I love your logic. Pleas continue.
Mindmelted
Well-Known Member
Doer
Well-Known Member
These car batteries are like flight engines. We have a TTO, a Time to Overhaul, we must follow, There is a lot of stuff we must follow.. So, in the total cost of ownership, we fly by the hour. Fuel, oil and maintenance. Also Engine Reserve.
Every hour is one off the Engine Reseve ususally 1500 - 2000 hr and a $25,000+ overhaul.
So, the hidden cost of these E-cars is the Battery Reserve. It is easily another $100 a month, $12K a year.
So, it doesn't make a bit of sense, except to assuage your dippy sensisbiites, and I know several Dippies with Prius, Leaf, etc,
Ford CEO: Battery Is Third of Electric Car Cost
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304432704577350052534072994
Speaking at a forum on green technology on Monday, Ford Motor Co. f -0.13% Chief Executive Alan Mulally indicated battery packs for the company's Focus electric car costs between $12,000 and $15,000 apiece.
http://green.autoblog.com/2013/06/20/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-will-cost-100-month/
Jun 20, 2013 - Nissan announces a $100/month battery replacement program for the ... Under an expanded New Electric Vehicle Limited Warranty, Nissan ...
The very word, GREEN is a shameful use an important color, to me.
Every hour is one off the Engine Reseve ususally 1500 - 2000 hr and a $25,000+ overhaul.
So, the hidden cost of these E-cars is the Battery Reserve. It is easily another $100 a month, $12K a year.
So, it doesn't make a bit of sense, except to assuage your dippy sensisbiites, and I know several Dippies with Prius, Leaf, etc,
Ford CEO: Battery Is Third of Electric Car Cost
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304432704577350052534072994
Speaking at a forum on green technology on Monday, Ford Motor Co. f -0.13% Chief Executive Alan Mulally indicated battery packs for the company's Focus electric car costs between $12,000 and $15,000 apiece.
http://green.autoblog.com/2013/06/20/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-will-cost-100-month/
Jun 20, 2013 - Nissan announces a $100/month battery replacement program for the ... Under an expanded New Electric Vehicle Limited Warranty, Nissan ...
The very word, GREEN is a shameful use an important color, to me.
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Doer
Well-Known Member
I said it was indicative of the fake. Get a Prius why don't you? Can't afford the battery, is that it? Nothing wrong with this in the Big Casino.
You can't fool all the people
Your silliness is just that, Philo.. I am not trying to converse with you. That would require discussion skills, you don't even have.
You can't fool all the people
Your silliness is just that, Philo.. I am not trying to converse with you. That would require discussion skills, you don't even have.
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Harrekin
Well-Known Member
You are aware the energy used to produce the cars/batteries and then the electricity used to charge them makes E cars actually come off worse environmentally than gas powered cars?
You're betting on the wrong horse, Iv seen theoretical plans for hydrogen fuel cell powered cars that use solar power to electrolyse the water.
The only thing you put into it is water, and its only output is water. And it can theoretically use the solar panels all day to produce a reserve of hydrogen for night time driving.
Far from a working prototype last time I checked, but the theory is sound assuming things keep getting smaller...
Big Oil is shitting themselves over a concept like that, not your plug in go-karts.
At the very least you could've gone with the gasoline powered generator running electric drive train models, theyre even moar cost efficient than pure electrics and still have the reliability of gas.
Doer
Well-Known Member
And Toyota has come out with a 3 cylinder, 78 mph gas engine with Adkinson's cycle.
http://www.gizmag.com/toyota-atkinson-engines-improved-thermal-fuel-efficiency/31615/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=804b9a0d1f-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-804b9a0d1f-91265109
I am for all clean environment, and all against lying for profit.
They are still way ahead in the gas tech. There is nothing in H-tech, right now above a bicycle booster canister.
The energy to compress and store this very volition substance is still not worth it.
H-Fuel cells, using natural gas however, do look very promising, There are 2-80 kilowatt versions now based on new tech from MIT.
http://www.gizmag.com/toyota-atkinson-engines-improved-thermal-fuel-efficiency/31615/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=804b9a0d1f-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-804b9a0d1f-91265109
I am for all clean environment, and all against lying for profit.
They are still way ahead in the gas tech. There is nothing in H-tech, right now above a bicycle booster canister.
The energy to compress and store this very volition substance is still not worth it.
H-Fuel cells, using natural gas however, do look very promising, There are 2-80 kilowatt versions now based on new tech from MIT.
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
Doer
Well-Known Member
It will certainly impact N-gas pricing. We pay about 4x for E. It is this silly self rule, rate tier system we have applied to ourselves, trying to be do-gooders, as usual.
Hey, the Cube is here. Commercial versions available. Cost per mW, is way down but still way up there, A few years of production and R&D re-coup and the price will drop, if the laws to favor something else like Solar don't doom it.
Only a meter on a side, and under 1000 #.
http://www.redoxpowersystems.com/products/
Hey, the Cube is here. Commercial versions available. Cost per mW, is way down but still way up there, A few years of production and R&D re-coup and the price will drop, if the laws to favor something else like Solar don't doom it.
Only a meter on a side, and under 1000 #.
http://www.redoxpowersystems.com/products/
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
Damn, not publicly traded...It will certainly impact N-gas pricing. We pay about 4x for E. It is this silly self rule, rate tier system we have applied to ourselves, trying to be do-gooders, as usual.
Hey, the Cube is here. Commercial versions available. Cost per mW, is way down but still way up there, A few years of production and R&D re-coup and the price will drop, if the laws to favor something else like Solar don't doom it.
Only a meter on a side, and under 1000 #.
http://www.redoxpowersystems.com/products/
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