Trouble with diagnosis - can someone help? dwarfed leafes..

Hello,

I’m having trouble diagnosing my plants. I had microscopic mites (Tarsonemidae) 2 months ago, but that looked different than now. Under the microscope i do not see any mites...and by eye no insects anyway. As the fight against the mites is still ongoing, i spray the plants all 4-5 days with neem and natural.

Please check the pictures of the plants in the attachements.

In the first picture you can see the motherplant. She is in biobizz light mix and showing this strange curly, malformed leafes. Watering the plants every 3-4 days when the pot feels light. Temp around 77F, Humidity around 60-70.

On the other pictures you can see the clones of that mother. These were transplanted in cocos and are fed with House & Garden AB and Multizyme. The PH is 5.8. I did not put them in flower yet. Also having very malformed leafes, but the plant is still growing quite fast. Temp 77F, Humidity 60.


I did always feed my plants with the same nutrients and watering schedules the last 5 years. I've never had a problem like this, plants were always happy. Of course i had troubles, or pests...but i was always able to handle it. This time i am in serious trouble!... do you think it is a pest like mites? Or is it a nutrient problem...or roots?l

...any help would be highly appreciated.

I am happy to answer any questions..

Many thanks

OK.
These are all guesses. But it's where I'd start.
I'll list in order of most likely, to least likely.

1. Nutrient or ph lockout.
2. Neem oil burn. When are you applying the neem? Just before lights out, is best. Neem oil heats up under the lights. Scorches the plants. Your not using too much dish soap, when you mix it, are you?
You'd only need a drop or so a gallon.
3. Your light is too close. Light that's too intense, can miniaturize leaves.

I'm sorry. It's the best I can do

Hello Tim,

Thanks for your quick and helpful response!

1) What could cause Nutrient or ph lockout?

2) When applying the plant stay on the other side of my room, so not under the lights, until they are dry. afterwards i put them back under the lights, but i always put the lights with more distance to the plants than normal for 24hours...
Yeah maybe i use too much soap...As soap I am using Natural, it has 51% Fatacids (Kaliumsalze; 515,1 g/l). I am using it in combination with neem, but with half dose they suggest...
But i think it still could be that this combination causes the problem...as i sprayed motherplant and the clones with the same, and both show these strange leafes.

I will stop do apply this combination with half of my motherplants to see what happens. But I am afraid the investation of micro mites will come back...and they will be even more resistant against whatever you throw at them.

3) I think we can exclude this, lights are in good distance to the plants i guess..

Looking forward to find out more...maybe someone other suggestions or experience?

many thanks

Good idea.
That's a good plan.
It does sound like a bit of a coincidence too.
You can try something like spinosad, in the meantime.
It would mix things up a bit too.

I will keep you updated.

I also found out, that the company that produced the neem I use suggests, to adjust the PH to 6.0 before spraying. Did you ever hear of that?

In addition i found threads saying that soap rises the ph of the solution.

So maybe has my spray solution a very high ph, and that causes problems to the leafes?

freesen said:

I will keep you updated.

I also found out, that the company that produced the neem I use suggests, to adjust the PH to 6.0 before spraying. Did you ever hear of that?


In addition i found threads saying that soap rises the ph of the solution.
So maybe has my spray solution a very high ph, and that causes problems to the leafes?

Click to expand...

It could be that,yeah.
Its where my thoughts are heading too.
Can't say I've heard of adjusting ph, for neem either. But ya never know.

Cheers.
Updates, would be great.

Good luck, mate.

Checked plants today, and i am pretty sure that the problem is not from the neem and natural.

I have plants, which i dipped into that mixture and they look perfectly fine. also are sometime the strange leaves not on the top of the plant, so the leaves (new growth) which are under direct light are mostly fine.

A friend told me it could be because of ph fluctuations, which could be if my measure device was wrong. BUT this does not explain the strange leaves on the motherplant! they are in fresh bio bizz light mix and drainage watter is at 6.6, which i think for soil is fine.

Some parts of the plant look good, and some leaves then are very bad!

What i also notice is that sometimes leaves have only 3 or 4 fingers...

Also fresh transplanted clones into light mix soil is getting this s*** problem :S

Please check the pictures attached for all this points above...

any more suggestions? what about broad mites?

thanks!!

OK. No worries.

Runoff ph isn't an accurate measurement for soil. I'd collect a sample, mix with distilled water, and test with your pen. Get the ratio off Google. I'd suggest taking a sample, from the bottom, and top. Then compare.
What ph are you watering/feeding at?

There are some tiny white spots, here and there on the leaves. What are they?
Check for bugs, all over. Undersides of leaves too. Any little crevices, dips etc, on a leaf, check them. I think you need at least a 60 X loupe, for some mites. Which you already know.
Might be a good idea, for something like nukem, as a preventative, if none are in flower.

If your mother plant is in different soil. What's the same, about her, as your others?
What are they all getting, the same of, other than the neem?
Is the ph of each pot, the same? Or does it vary.
Have you been giving any liquid feed, to all of them? The same feed? Same time, etc?
What's your schedule?


How often, are you watering? Your soil looks quite damp in the pics.
Have you checked your roots?