Tiny & fast white bugs, +rep for help in identifying

Discussion in 'Bugs' started by DannyGreenEyes, Dec 20, 2009.

  1.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    I had a small infestation of thrips last week, I used Mite X to get rid of them, and I took off all the leaves with white spots to dispose of the eggs.

    Today I noticed they were coming back, either that or it's a new infestation, I haven't been able to get a thrip/mite screen on my intake yet.

    When I was inspecing my plants I saw 2 very small white bugs that moved way too fast to be baby thrips, they moved as fast as an adult thrip would (I saw an adult last week). I'm not sure what they are and I have no pics or pocket microscope yet, hopefully my description will be enough since I'm releasing lady bugs tommorow and if they're a mite I might want to treat with neem oil first.

    They're about the same size as a baby thrip but they're white, maybe a little greyish. They move quickly and they might make small webs or cacoons of some kind that can't be seen by the human eye. (A piece of perlite hung from a leaf I clipped today, couldn't see what was holding it there though)

    That's what I know for sure. These are other things that may or may not be related.

    I got bit twice on the right wrist while watering & spraying. And right now it feels like I have some crawling on me, but I don't see shit. I'm itching like crazy though ever since I sprayed in there.

    I've noticed white dots on the leaves over the last week that ended up being something on the leaf, not thrip damage. You can rub it off with your finger. I just assumed it was dead thrips but someone suggested it might have been white fly shit. When I took my micro sheers and tried to move it, it looked like a tiny flake, kinda like a small piece of ash or something.

    The leaves are very dry and some have become waxy looking. Also some show damage like I haven't seen in any thread. The edges of some leaves look kinda like they've been chewed on. Some have greyish spots that become small holes. And 3 leaves were almost cut in half only held together by the center vein, 2 of them it's only a crack but one of them has an actual part of the leaf missing so the middle vein is completely exposed for about 1/8".

    So I sprayed again with Mite X and I'll be releasing 1,500 lady bugs in there tommorow as a precaution to future infestations. Before I release them I need to know if these things are something that lady bugs wont kill off. If I need to treat with neem oil or something, then I have to wait to release the lady bugs.

    Does any of the above description sound like anything that anyone has had before? (I can't find anything on any of the threads)

    +rep for any help.
  2.  
    Dirtyboy

    Dirtyboy Well-Known Member

    Perhaps fungas gnats
    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  3.  
    GPD.831

    GPD.831 Active Member

    They could be springtails, which are beneficial/neutral. Their presence means healthy soil.
    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  4.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member


    Thanks for your help, +rep.

    I thought about that, but the damage started about a 3 weeks ago, and the dry leaves strated about a month ago. I would think that I would see some flying around by now.

    Some of th damage looks like their larvae damage. But I checked the soil and didn't see anything.

    Plus it's dry in there. Even with a humidifier it's only 40%, and it's normally 20% in the state so it's not a big gnat area. And I don't overwater the plants, if anything I underwater them. There's almost never any water in the run off trays and the top layer of soil is dry most of the time.

    So it kind of seems like it might be them but there are some signs that say it's not. Unless it's some kind of dry gnat that's developed somehow. And as long as they lost the ability to fly.

    Also, it's white. I would expect gnats to be darker.

    The most important thing though is that they're not some kind of mite or something that reproduces as fast or faster than the spider mite. Are there any bugs out there that fit the description that have a hi rate of reproduction? (I think the lady bugs would take care of a gnat problem if that what they are)
  5.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    Thanks for your help. +rep

    I've heard of springtails but never could find much info on it.

    Do they make any kind of webbing or cacoons or anything like it? And are they that small (a tiny dot or spec)?

    And how fast do they reproduce? (if they bite or crawl on people, I want them gone beneficial or not. lol)

    And do they bite?
  6.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    I finally released the lady bugs and it looked like they started going to town right away, they must have woke up hungry.

    So I let them do their thing and closed up the room. Then I went to check on my clones and while I was looking at them something fell into the run off saucer that had water in it. It was dead for some reason, and I think it's a gnat.

    It looks like a regular black gnat except the wings were kind of grey. And when I squished it red came out. This might be the little shit that bit me last night.

    Can anyone tell me what kind of gnat this is because as far as I know fungus gnats don't bite.

    Also, I have a Rapid Rooter with a dome, and I have 8 or 9 rooted clones in cups sitting in a 14" draining saucer. The saucer still has a little water in it from a watering last night. Should I move the rooted clones into the veg room with the lady bugs, or can adults like this lay eggs?

    Attached Files:

  7.  
    GPD.831

    GPD.831 Active Member

    You got yourself some deep trouble.

    webs/cocoon=spider mites.
    spider mites =destruction.
  8.  
    herbose

    herbose Well-Known Member

    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  9.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member


    Dam, I already released the lady bugs too. But the leaves feel a lot less dry since I released them (1500) and I'm planning on picking up another 1500 tommorow.

    The infestation didn't seem to be bad, I only saw a few leaves that seemed to have that stuff on. I won't really know till the budding starts though, right?

    And I'm no longer sure that I got rid of Thrips last week or if I had Thrips a few days ago. I was reading a book that said Thrips only get to the size of a pin head and when I killed them last week I saw an adult that was about 1/8 or 1/16 of an inch. Looked like the pic of a Thrip though. Could this be something else that spins webs/cacoons? If not, any idea what it might be.

    Also, any time I see a leaf with white spots I clip the leaf and put it right into a cup of water. If I get rid of all the leaves with white spots, am I getting rid of the nest? I ask because I've been told that they wont make a nest where predators are present.

    The lady bugs seem full though which is why I was going to add another 1500. And I've found some digging in the dirt which I though meant they were going after Gnat larvae.
  10.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    Thanks for your help. +rep

    Yeah, got that link saved as a favorite. I wonder if that tobacco juice with chilli pepper powder would hurt the lady bugs.

    I have to water tommorow, I'll take another look then. If I see more webs I'll try get a few more humidifiers to get the humidity up to around 80% to help the lady bugs whipe them out. I've already seen lady bug eggs too, so hopefull their larvae will help even more.

    Maybe what I saw were spider mites and not thrips since the make the same white dots. But then what the hell did I see last week that looked like a 1/8" thrip? I really need a pocket microscope. lol
  11.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    And if those slow black bugs are mites, then I still don't know what those fast white bugs are. Any suggestions?
  12.  
    smallclosetgrowr

    smallclosetgrowr Well-Known Member

    if there white and they fly and there small = white flys , i got a shitload on my outdoor plants added some pyrithuim and its all good now
    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  13.  
    laceygirl

    laceygirl Well-Known Member

    Quote
    Yeah, got that link saved as a favorite. I wonder if that tobacco juice with chilli pepper powder would hurt the lady bugs.Quote

    Thank you for being concerned for the ladybugs... Its nice to see environmentally sound growers...:-)
    Big Kiss Mwwuahh....:oops:
    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  14.  
    grobofotwanky

    grobofotwanky Well-Known Member

    If you notice tiny black dots on the leaves, you still have thrips. I got rid of them last year by sealing off my growroom and "bombing" it with a Hot Shot pest strip. Those things work great and I don't see so much as a gnat anymore. Hope you get it worked out.
    DannyGreenEyes likes this.
  15.  
    Silky Shagsalot

    Silky Shagsalot Well-Known Member

    i've had spring tails a couple times, (pic.) the stay in the medium and eat dead plant matter and are actually beneficial. i don't like em though, and they reproduce like rabbits! webs mean spider mites, which means big trouble as someone mentioned. i don't know of any bugs that would be interested in your plants and also bite you. sounds like you're on the right track though with the ladybugs. (no rep thanks.)

    Attached Files:

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  16.  
    smallclosetgrowr

    smallclosetgrowr Well-Known Member

    that shits nasty, looks like the mites that feed of our dead tissue in our sheets n pillows.
  17.  
    smallclosetgrowr

    smallclosetgrowr Well-Known Member

    on another note i found a huntsman spider chilling out on my face last nite getting warm from my breath i didnt sleep for hours after that :)
  18.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member

    Thanks, but if they're flies, I'm sure the Lady Bugs got them by now. And I think they might have been because I kept seeing white specs on the leaves that brushed off when I inspected them. Someone told me it was probably white fly shit. Those white dots didn't fly though.

    Awwww gee. thanks :oops: Been too long since I had one of those :) Lady bugs are laying eggs already btw, can't wait to see the larvae out on the hunt :bigjoint:

    I thought they were thrips because a couple weeks ago when I killed them off the first time, I squished what looked like a 1/16" thrip, but a book told me that they don't get bigger than a pin head, so now I'm not sure. I'd love to know what I squished if it wasn't a thrip.

    But Thrips & Gnats & White Flies I'm not too worried about, the lady bugs have got them taken care of. The only thing I worry about is the lady bugs getting full before they're all gone. lol I'll be getting 1500 more tommorow though.

    I don't have spring tail, there's noting in the soil, checked it real good. Didn't see gnat larvae either which make no sense.

    If there's nothing else that makes webs, then I guess they're spider mites. But I like what I've been seeing.

    The infestation wasn't bad when I got on top of it. I sprayed and removed the leaves with white dots (only5 or 6 had dots) and the next day I released the Lady Bugs.

    The Lady Bugs only spent a couple of days roaming the plants, now they're roaming the room. There are some always on the tops of the plants having sex & stuff, nesting I guess. But there's a group of them that were all over these 2 exposed patches of carpet, now their all over the wood beams that the lights hang from. I think they're wiping out the spider mites. I'll know more when I go in there to water in a few minutes, I'll have a good chance to examine the plants real good.

    And I figure if they need any help the other 1500 lady bugs should do the trick. I guess I got on top of it early enough (knock on wood) for the lady bugs to do the job.

    Thanks for the help everyone, + rep for everyone.

    And have a great holiday
  19.  
    DannyGreenEyes

    DannyGreenEyes Well-Known Member


    Are those the spiders I've seen that don't spin webs? They kinda look like small wood spiders.
  20.  
    Silky Shagsalot

    Silky Shagsalot Well-Known Member

    if there are springtails, and they are deep in the medium, look in the run-off for them. they can't hide, but they're very small.

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