Should an Australian be concered posting his grow?

reasonevangelist said:

Also! Back on Topic:

From my perspective and frame of reference, as a native U.S. citizen: Australia and NZ seem "quite harsh" in their approach to cannabis and other drugs... so: yes, i would be "concerned" if i were there.

Then again, i'd be concerned just about anywhere, because most of the planet is ruled by various governments who maintain the position that any involvement with cannabis is sufficient justification for the use of deadly force and/or extreme prison sentences. There are very few places where this is not the case.

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There are Coloradans who are doing Federal time for marijuana related 'offenses', 'committed' after Colorado's medical marijuana laws and even recreational laws went into effect.

Thus so far as I am aware, there is no place on earth which can claim to be totally, completely marijuana legal. Not even here.

So we know it's wrong, soooo what do we do about it?

ttystikk said:

There are Coloradans who are doing Federal time for marijuana related 'offenses', 'committed' after Colorado's medical marijuana laws and even recreational laws went into effect.

Thus so far as I am aware, there is no place on earth which can claim to be totally, completely marijuana legal. Not even here.

So we know it's wrong, soooo what do we do about it?

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Yeah i wasn't even including any part of the U.S. in those few scarce places... the CO/WA laws leave me with mixed feelings. I'm glad "something" is happening, but... i feel like they're doin' it wrong. Surprise surprise, right?

"What do we do about it?" is indeed the most important question, and where the biggest obstacle is found.

I think the only way we can really even "do" anything about it, is to establish the need for some kind of... systems integrity committee, or something, populated only by people qualified to understand right and wrong, and who are given the authority to Abolish laws, but not to create them. All branches of gov't would have to submit to investigations and analysis, even the SCOTUS. We need a recognized and "WTP" authorized entity that can overrule both the POTUS and the SCOTUS, if/when necessary, including all "alphabet groups" like the FDA, DEA, and IRS.

But i'm sure that will go over wonderfully... lol.

An alternative to that notion, would be to make a huge public gathering and demand a change, and stay there until it happens. Seems unfeasible.

Another... would be to "force" a debate with the SCOTUS, and show them they are legitimately wrong to allow any agency or group authorized use of force in anything regarding cannabis, and that all cannabis-related penalties (minus "adulterated" or "tainted" goods) are unconstitutional, illegal, inhumane and unacceptable. That will be incredibly difficult, because there is no currently existing method of overruling them or ousting them when they are revealed to be either malicious or incompetent, unless it's some kind of blatantly destructive behavior.

We have to get them to agree to a rational debate which focuses on the crux of the issue: it is not inherently dangerous to do anything with cannabis. Therefore, any penalty imposed through force, is illegal already. But it will be difficult to get them to separate the implications of truth-blowback and potential resulting infrastructural instabilities (due to everyone realizing the "authorities" have actually been committing crimes against humanity, against their own citizens, for multiple decades), from the heart of the issue. We can easily prove they are unable to remain intellectually honest and unbiased. We cannot easily get them to admit it. They are more afraid of admitting there ever was a problem, than they are of correcting the mistake. They still carry this air of "oh, well, the precedent says such and such, and it couldn't possibly have been illegitimately established..." and so they just disregard that part of reality, and "make a ruling" not in accordance with the actual facts... which is exactly what the SCOTUS is supposed to be at the highest court for NOT doing.

This is a pattern everywhere. It's all backwards, all Orwellian doublespeak, plausible deniability, parallel construction, blah blah blah.

If we can get them to BE REASONABLE, we can win. In many ways, we've already constructed an indisputable position. It's just a matter of getting them to acknowledge it, and for them to accept that doing the right thing means accepting the consequences for all the years they maintained illegitimate authorization to do the wrong things, and the fact that millions of people's lives have been ruined.

But you know, we can sentence them later. We just need to get them to be reasonable first, and let the justice system function the way it was intended. But there's big money and power in obstructing and manipulating that function to their own advantage, which is why things are as they are.

vostok said:

Total Bullshit ..!!!! Australia belongs to the 5 eyes club set up after WW2 to spy on us soviets .. a very weak idea that is used now to spy on the very people that the 5 eyes are set up to protect, Canada,UK, USA, Australia, and Eireland? those with the smaller populations and greater land mass are the greater targets, as they can't hide in populace locals and the football world cup is the ideal proof of that, using the cup as an experiment of mass social communication, and individual montiering

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While there is certainly a need to protect your privacy, intelligence agencies - IN SOME CASES, have a legitimate need to target and monitor certain individuals & groups, the very concerning part is that law enforcement agencies now want access to the metadata which could be used in criminal prosecutions of Australians based on intercepted communications, previously that has only happened in terrorism related cases, i've never heard of these measures being used on people growing weed here in Australia.

http://www.dpmc.gov.au/publications/intelligence_inquiry/chapter7/7_cross_community.htm

vostok said:

I do like this comment, but can't help but think microsoft windows(any version) has back doors as per "Security by design, from the very onset, is the best and arguably only "secure" way to do anything at all" ....?

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http://www.wired.com/2013/09/nsa-backdoor/

In August 2007, a young programmer in Microsoft’s Windows security group stood up to give a five-minute turbo talk at the annual Crypto conference in Santa Barbara.

The talk was only nine slides long (.pdf). But those nine slides were potentially dynamite. They laid out a case showing that a new encryption standard, given a stamp of approval by the U.S. government, possessed a glaring weakness that made an algorithm in it susceptible to cracking. But the weakness they described wasn’t just an average vulnerability, it had the kind of properties one would want if one were intentionally inserting a backdoor to make the algorithm susceptible to cracking by design.

Yeh if u run windows just right click on the jpegs, properties, remove all metadata from seletected items, ok.

Just don't use this site with bloody gmail and put your full name or something as your username lol.

@reasonevangelist ;

I disagree with your suggestion that we merely ask our Federal Government to 'be reasonable.' They aren't interested in reasonable, only power- so show them some! Begin the process of organizing a Constitutional Convention, on the ground that the current government is no longer responsive to the people and has become hopelessly corrupt.

Any attempt to block or interfere with such a gathering on the part of the Federal Gov't would instantly backfire into full scale revolt against the Feds- and a Conditional overthrow. And, they know it; go read up on the Equal Rights Amendment, and see how the Feds responded. Spoiler alert; 'kid gloves'...

panhead said:

however take the members advice about sim cards & do all you can to conceal your identy .

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This will do nothing. Location data comes from the GPS unit not the sim card.

ttystikk said:

@reasonevangelist ;

I disagree with your suggestion that we merely ask our Federal Government to 'be reasonable.' They aren't interested in reasonable, only power- so show them some! Begin the process of organizing a Constitutional Convention, on the ground that the current government is no longer responsive to the people and has become hopelessly corrupt.

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I decided to move out of this country next year when I heard about the no dole till 30 policy and the Medicare co-payment. I could barely afford antibiotics if I get sick ffs. All for a 'medical research fund', 100% of which will go to big pharma to make more useless drugs and line their pockets.. 0% of this money will go towards cannabis research.

ttystikk said:

@reasonevangelist ;

I disagree with your suggestion that we merely ask our Federal Government to 'be reasonable.' They aren't interested in reasonable, only power- so show them some! Begin the process of organizing a Constitutional Convention, on the ground that the current government is no longer responsive to the people and has become hopelessly corrupt.

Any attempt to block or interfere with such a gathering on the part of the Federal Gov't would instantly backfire into full scale revolt against the Feds- and a Conditional overthrow. And, they know it; go read up on the Equal Rights Amendment, and see how the Feds responded. Spoiler alert; 'kid gloves'...

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I got a little giddy when i read that. I wasn't really talking about "asking" them... lol, i'm talking about putting them on the spot and giving them a choice: be reasonable, or we start invoking our conditional constitutional protections (aka "TSHTF")

IMO, the argument has already been won. I and many others have already "adjusted our scope of legitimate authority." Many of us already see the line, and that it has not only long since been crossed, but that they have attempted to illegitimately manipulate it, beyond what authority they are allowed to have.

I was just saying... i think the "best" way of going about it, would be to "beat them at their own game," by way of "forcing" them to make an untenable argument, and reveal their own malice and/or incompetence, while trying to wriggle their way out of the jam they've knowingly created for themselves. But we all know, the best way isn't always available.

I was just discussing some of the relevant points at the heart of this issue, with someone else, right before i came back to read that reply... such as personal sovereignty, and the constitutionally protected inalienable right to self-ownership and self-governance. No man anywhere in this world has the right to dictate what i may do with either my own body, or my personal property, UNLESS i have chosen to do something that impinges the rights or liberties or properties of another. Therefore, it is, technically illegal for cannabis to have ever been made illegal in the first place. Now, i do realize, they have done all sorts of litigious and linguistic acrobatics in attempt to falsely justify their abuses of power... but unjustifiable is unjustifiable, their grounds are simply invalid, and that is that. All actions committed based on those invalid and untenable grounds, should rightly be considered crimes against humanity, not to mention treason. But that's a WHOLE LOT of people to charge with treason and conspiracy all at once, and they do happen to have the military advantage in this situation, so i'm not quite sure how we can get around that without immense bloodshed, but i would obviously prefer for us to avoid a "civil war," if at all possible. And i suppose it would be "best," if we could allow them that Choice: be reasonable, or be held responsible for not only the crimes of the past, but every casualty that may yet result from their refusal to cooperate with the conditions of their own authority. If a civil war happens, any and all blood will be on Their hands, not WTP, especially if they do end up refusing that given chance to be reasonable. They made it this way, not us: they are responsible and accountable for whatever results.

Anyway, i spend a lot of brain cycles on this stuff, if it wasn't already obvious. Surely there are people more qualified and capable than myself, and in better positions to actually do something about it. I'd like to find them and mind meld with them, and hopefully find a way to usefully contribute.


Also: i tried googling "equal rights amendment" and "constitutional convention," and i'm not sure whether i've found any results relevant to what we're actually discussing here... seems to be mostly women's rights results (not that those are any less important, just not what i thought i was looking for...). Got any good links?

reasonevangelist said:

But that's a WHOLE LOT of people to charge with treason and conspiracy all at once, and they do happen to have the military advantage in this situation, so i'm not quite sure how we can get around that without immense bloodshed, but i would obviously prefer for us to avoid a "civil war," if at all possible. And i suppose it would be "best," if we could allow them that Choice: be reasonable, or be held responsible for not only the crimes of the past, but every casualty that may yet result from their refusal to cooperate with the conditions of their own authority. If a civil war happens, any and all blood will be on Their hands, not WTP, especially if they do end up refusing that given chance to be reasonable. They made it this way, not us: they are responsible and accountable for whatever results.

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Erm.. a civil war here would end up like Tienanmen square, thanks to John Howard after certain events in Port Arthur. The police know where every registered gun is. Only the rich and tech savvy than can afford to order a gun off the deep web or 3D print a liberator would stand a chance of survival.

And the general public are WAY too brainwashed for it to come to that anyway. Walk around a typical public place in this country, good luck finding someone with a triple digit IQ. How the do you think tony abbott got elected?

Northern Lights Grower said:

Erm.. a civil war here would end up like Tienanmen square, thanks to John Howard after certain events in Port Arthur. The police know where every registered gun is. Only the rich and tech savvy than can afford to order a gun off the deep web or 3D print a liberator would stand a chance of survival.

And the general public are WAY too brainwashed for it to come to that anyway. Walk around a typical public place in this country, good luck finding someone with a triple digit IQ. How the do you think tony abbott got elected?

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If they massacre the proletariat, who will run the infrastructure? Who will pay the taxes?

They Need Us. That's why they're not just massacring us already. If they didn't need us, they'd already be pulling Nazi style mass exterminations. "Slow Kill" is because they need us to live for long enough to harvest our labor and resources. We are the microbes feeding their plants.

Plus, you know, we're all gonna die someday anyway, and people are tired of being jerked around and violated.

Also, the point about people being too dumb and brainwashed... i have some ideas about how to approach developing effective solutions for that. Think: "universal personal property rights (including the person as his/her own property), basic fundamental logic, and/or emotional wording, 100th Monkey, and viral marketing."

We can't just march up to Capitol Hill and demand justice. We have to "build and cook the soil" first. Plant the seeds, water and illuminate, and let them pollinate unrestricted.

Which reminds me: cannabis breeders are in a perfect position to see the parallels between breeding plants and human eugenics. This is one of the most important reasons TPTB doesn't want us doing it. Or, maybe they never even considered this, and by so desperately prohibiting it, they have drawn focus to the very same knowledge they tried to keep hidden?

The Feds are anything but a monolithic THEY. First, 'They' consist of a vast array of different and distinct departments, very few of whom know what the others are doing. This allows for more control from the top, which is where part of the problem lies.

Second, the Federal Government is made up of a highly professional, dedicated and hard working group of individual American citizens, who feel as passionately about our country as you and I do. They feel some esprit de corps in last because they feel that are indeed serving the country.

Don't forget that and don't make the mistake of assuming the man in the office or in uniform is the enemy.

How do I know? I have multiple family members who have in the past or currently serve in highly responsible positions with various branches of our Federal Government.

Don't forget to speak to them, because successfully making the case that they've been duped by their superiors will short circuit your feared carnage.

It won't be difficult to figure out who the enemy is. They hold too much stolen wealth to hide.

How much stolen wealth is too much? How does 40% of the entire nations wealth as a whole, held by just one man in TEN THOUSAND? I don't care what their last names are, it's unacceptable! We're replacing the democracy we replaced monarchy with now they want to give us plutocratic royalism!

I DEMAND MY RIGHTS AS A UNITED STATES CITIZEN.

ALL OF THEM. NO EXCEPTIONS.

A DOLLAR IS NOT A VOTE, AND THEREFORE MONEY MAY NOT INFLUENCE POLITICS. ALL ELSE IS CORRUPTION; 'DEMOCRACY' FOR SALE.

EXTREME WEALTH IS A SIGN OF FAILURE TO REPAY YOUR COUNTRY AND YOUR FELLOW CITIZENS FOR YOUR GOOD FORTUNE IN THE SECURE ENVIRONMENT WE ASK WORKED TOGETHER TO BUILD. TO THE ONE IN TEN THOUSAND; PAY IT BACK. NOW!

Anyone else want to start posting some 'revolutionary slogans', be my guest!

ttystikk said:

The Feds are anything but a monolithic THEY. First, 'They' consist of a vast array of different and distinct departments, very few of whom know what the others are doing. This allows for more control from the top, which is where part of the problem lies.

Second, the Federal Government is made up of a highly professional, dedicated and hard working group of individual American citizens, who feel as passionately about our country as you and I do. They feel some esprit de corps in last because they feel that are indeed serving the country.

Don't forget that and don't make the mistake of assuming the man in the office or in uniform is the enemy.

How do I know? I have multiple family members who have in the past or currently serve in highly responsible positions with various branches of our Federal Government.

Don't forget to speak to them, because successfully making the case that they've been duped by their superiors will short circuit your feared carnage.

It won't be difficult to figure out who the enemy is. They hold too much stolen wealth to hide.

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I never manage to include all the points i wish to include... there are just so many.

I agree with everything you just said. In fact, THIS is part of the reason i have any hope at all. It's just prohibitively complex, and requires so much articulation that "they" is used for getting the point across. I definitely don't think ALL of the people in ALL areas of gov't are "the enemy." I realize some of them have the best of intentions, and would vastly prefer Actual Justice to be the result, and to avoid unnecessary harm to anyone. Breaking through the cognitive barriers and knocking down false constructs, will require an Invitation. You can't just go barging into people's minds throwing your weight around, they will immediately raise their defenses and resist, and you won't even get a chance to be seen as correct, even if you are.

We have to "overgrow" the minds of our fellow citizens, including those with good intentions in positions of power and influence.

It's not just about the individual fighting for himself... it's about whether we're all willing to fight for each other, and whether we care enough about the outcome to focus all available energy into the correct pressure points. Which is why it needs refining. It's not quite ready, but it's getting there. ^^

I'll continue to add my ideas to the fire, so as to help gain the most finely forged results.

'Every man for himself' America isn't working for every man, not even the everyman. But every man- and woman! We are all equal CITIZENS!- has the right and even the responsibility to stand for change and to act to hold those who stole power accountable.

I believe it was an injustice to allow SCOTUS to sit above the People, immune to their recall. Thus, there is no check against their Transgressions against We the People, and We therefore have no choice but to resort to Constitutional remedies that do not include them, nor may brook their interference.

I know I lapse into legalese, but the bottom line is that under the disguise of criminals among us (RICO), keeping secrets from the Enemy (War Powers), and unspecified terrorist threats (Patriot Act), the Federal Government has unlawfully separated the People from proper representation or respect under their Bill of Rights, as indeed they have no authority to do.

This isn't sedition; this is solemn accusation of those who manipulate our governmental apparatus for their own ends of high crimes against The People of the United States- and not any 'official' bureaucracy who would assume the right to speak for Us.

Fuck. I am so in the wrong thread with this, lol

ttystikk said:

Fuck. I am so in the wrong thread with this, lol

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yeah... i was just thinking "man we shouldn't be hijacking dude's thread..."

Back on topic: Yep. Plenty of reason to be concerned, pretty much anywhere...

reasonevangelist said:

yeah... i was just thinking "man we shouldn't be hijacking dude's thread..."

Back on topic: Yep. Plenty of reason to be concerned, pretty much anywhere...

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Uh yeah, sorry for the 'Jack, totally didn't see the title...

Northern Lights Grower said:

I decided to move out of this country next year when I heard about the no dole till 30 policy and the Medicare co-payment. I could barely afford antibiotics if I get sick ffs. All for a 'medical research fund', 100% of which will go to big pharma to make more useless drugs and line their pockets.. 0% of this money will go towards cannabis research.

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May I ask where you would go? While Abbotts policies will hurt the lower and middle classes mainly (what's new with a liberal government?) the medicare co payment for low income earners on centrelink benefits is waived and health care cards provide prescriptions at more than a 50% reduction, sometimes up to 90% of the recommended retail price. No dole to 30 and an additional six month wait to qualify is really going to hurt people, i agree, but in light of how some other countries structure their Social Security/Welfare system Australia is not the worst place to live, granted it is becoming harder, but the are organisations that can help our where centrelink cant...

earnest_voice said:

May I ask where you would go? While Abbotts policies will hurt the lower and middle classes mainly (what's new with a liberal government?) the medicare co payment for low income earners on centrelink benefits is waived and health care cards provide prescriptions at more than a 50% reduction, sometimes up to 90% of the recommended retail price. No dole to 30 and an additional six month wait to qualify is really going to hurt people, i agree, but in light of how some other countries structure their Social Security/Welfare system Australia is not the worst place to live, granted it is becoming harder, but the are organisations that can help our where centrelink cant...

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I agree with this.

Wow there is a lot of complaining about in this thread but let's face it, Australia is a great place to live, sure, the govt make bad decisions and tell lies, but what government doesn't? It's not a few evil men hell bent on ruining your life, it is hundreds of people trying to operate every aspect of a country, it doesn't matter who is in power, they are going to piss people off.

The govt is not going to use back doors into your computer system to see if your growing weed, so take off the tin foil hats, smoke a bowl and relax, Lol.

As for gun control, while I think that some of the laws are a little overkill, I much prefer it to what they have in the USA where there are shootings in schools every month. I'm a fire arms owner and avid hunter, and I don't mind people needing a valid reason to own one, carrying a gun for self defence is just dangerous and unnecessary.