See this yet? "Pharmaceutical Grade Cannabis"

gladstoned said:

Absolutely not mad about that at all. I give away more than oz a month and I am remodeling to give away much more. My patients know that. I cannot imagine having so much meds I would be in trouble. I have not been able to cure a jar for a week, let alone stock pile enough to face charges. I have never sold buds to a dispensary either. I have sold hard candy and seeds, but never flowers. The dispensaries have asked me several times, I simply do not have enough. Bob's wording showed his wishes and I could not disagree more. I am in the UP, if I was able to supply a dispensary I would contact an attorney and just be that dispensary. And I am 100% in favor of testing. (at a reasonable cost)

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I was just making a joke about your middle finger rebut, which I liked. I already got the idea you were good to your patients. But yea there are two ways you can go here. You can diving in the pool head first without testing the water. Or you can wait, do what you already do and see if the pool is worth jumping into.

SofaKingPurp said:

I was just making a joke about your middle finger rebut, which I liked. I already got the idea you were good to your patients. But yea there are two ways you can go here. You can diving in the pool head first without testing the water. Or you can wait, do what you already do and see if the pool is worth jumping into.

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Which is basically what I am saying as well. The ozzrock Timmah approach is "WE WIN" ..we haven't. Caution is still the better part of valor.

There is a difference between being a zealot for the cause, and logically assessing the situation. The situation has improved..but no one has won anything yet.

bob harris said:

Which is basically what I am saying as well. The ozzrock Timmah approach is "WE WIN" ..we haven't. Caution is still the better part of valor.

There is a difference between being a zealot for the cause, and logically assessing the situation. The situation has improved..but no one has won anything yet.

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Very right. It looks good on paper to some and bad to others. But in reality we wont know if this is a good thing or not until it is in use and we know all the costs a finer details. But this is positive progression. Still a lot can go wrong, but it is a step toward us being taken seriously.

bob harris said:

I didn't say it would do away with all the small growers. I said it would make them act in an accountable manor or they would not survive.

Small guy could still pony up and do testing and keep books...but the guys in it for profit only, won't do that. I personally think that small, legitimate growers are the best way to fill dispensary shelves. So long as the growers do it in a professional manor.

The guys that will go away (and I want to see gone) are the guys dealing mite infested mid grade swag as medicine. If you don't think that those guys are out there and in large numbers..you are kidding yourself.

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What you said exactly was:Takes all the "one oz per month for your 12 plants' care givers, and shoots them in the ass. Those guys will be all gone, as they should be.

I have argued with many that patients should get atleast an oz per month free. Most do not. Then I give them what else I can at the time. I order tons of strains for each of my patients for them to try and see what actually helps them, not what High Times says will help them. We work day and night to try to get more knowledge and understanding of what is needed to help ourselves and others with medical cannabis or anything else for that matter. I know many that are here on this site to try to get better for themselves and others. I created a thread to see what members all over the state did for their patients. Then you come along and say me and people like me will be gone AS WE SHOULD. You are out of your mind if you think I do not take offense to you saying that I should be "gone".

gladstoned said:

What you said exactly was:Takes all the "one oz per month for your 12 plants' care givers, and shoots them in the ass. Those guys will be all gone, as they should be.

I have argued with many that patients should get atleast an oz per month free. Most do not. Then I give them what else I can at the time. I order tons of strains for each of my patients for them to try and see what actually helps them, not what High Times says will help them. We work day and night to try to get more knowledge and understanding of what is needed to help ourselves and others with medical cannabis or anything else for that matter. I know many that are here on this site to try to get better for themselves and others. I created a thread to see what members all over the state did for their patients. Then you come along and say me and people like me will be gone AS WE SHOULD. You are out of your mind if you think I do not take offense to you saying that I should be "gone".

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You are taking my statement out of it's intended meaning. If you are doing the things you say, you are not the guy I'm talking about.
And if you think that the guy I'm talking about isn't present in large numbers, you are mis informed.

BuddyGanja comes to mind, posting pics of his new cars and bragging about what his patients have bought him.

If you are re investing in genetics, and working to find the right strains for the right conditions, God bless you. You are not profiteering, but rather investing to become more helpful to your patients. I applaud that. Many, if not most CG's are not doing that. they are using the law to deal.

So, accept that as an apology if you will, and I hope I have clarified my meaning.

If i were directing a comment at you personally, i'd have no problem making it clear that it was you in particular that i was calling out. I believe from your posts that you are legit in your work.

But I know of hundreds of guys who are solely in this to deal drugs and make a living hiding behind the med law...and I'd like to see those guys gone. They hurt the cause, not help it.

I also know many that realized years ago the money for a drug dealer isn't marijuana. Drug dealers do not deal cannabis. Cocaine, meth, heroine, and pills are tiny and pricey. They go into suitcases, not semi-tractor trailers. You think I am somewhat going about this in the right direction, obviously so do I. Well one day down the road, if I ever quite buying seeds, I will make the money back for my equipment, then what Bob. Cut back and don't help cancer patients? Will I them be forced to give patients 6 oz. per month? That is what I will need to decide. But I have worked since I was 9 years old picking vegetables in fields with migrant workers and shit. And I have had jobs where people were taken advantage of. Construction is a perfect example. On the weekend some of us would get a "side job". We would build a garage, roof a house, do some siding, whatever. We would do it for cash a lot cheaper than our bosses. Who is right, who is wrong? Is my boss a piece of shit for charging $15000 for a shingle job we do in a few days, or are we p.o.s. for cutting out boss who pays taxes, insurance, blah blah blah. See I felt that the boss would literally fuck people over. They all do. Everyone earns a living somehow. If you go out and meet 20 patients this week and you give them better meds at a better price, are you a nice guy or a drug dealing piece of shit that must be stopped at all cost.

I say back to you. You have money, you have parkinson's and you have a strain that helps. Why in the fuck won't you grow more than what you need and find two people with parkinson's and just give them some of your meds. That is what makes a difference. If you are truly one of the good guys then get more plants going. Someone growing all the plants they are allowed doesn't make them a bad person.

bob harris said:

So, accept that as an apology if you will, and I hope I have clarified my meaning.

If i were directing a comment at you personally, i'd have no problem making it clear that it was you in particular that i was calling out. I believe from your posts that you are legit in your work.

But I know of hundreds of guys who are solely in this to deal drugs and make a living hiding behind the med law...and I'd like to see those guys gone. They hurt the cause, not help it.

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I accept your apology Bob, and I appreciate that clarity.
The way I view things is directly about your last statement here. Would our mj law be better if the honest caregiver helped others and themselves AND the hundreds of guys you mention as drug dealers ALSO make money. (They are michigan drug dealers and the spend that drug money here) or the other alternative where our government and 2 companies take everything.
What is wrong with a convict growing weed. A convict cannot talk many people into paying $800 per ounce. When dispensaries slowed down prices went from $20/gr to various other numbers. Basic supply and demand. What do you want the convict doing? Should the convicts stick to making meth? selling coke? College graduates have trouble finding work,

I take the side that this state better quit backing mother fuckers into corners. We voted, and it wasn't even close. They need to move the fuck along to some real issues.

bob harris said:

It is real similar to AZ. It forces wanna be growers to go legit or go home. Doesn't stop a small grower from playing, just makes them go legit if they want to sell to dispensaries. Takes all the "one oz per month for your 12 plants' care givers, and shoots them in the ass. Those guys will be all gone, as they should be. They will either have to go with the program and become legit, or risk getting busted, as they will have no legal way to sell their 'overages".


Hell, I'd pony up the $1500 for just my 12 plants, if it lets me sell legally to dispensaries. I can already pass all the other hoops. Lets see, 12 plants..6 flowered every 2 months, so 3 per month for an average. I can get 4 oz per plant easy when I want to..12 oz per month..I only need 1oz for myself...11 to sell at 200 per zip...2200 per month..minus 400 in actual cost to grow, minus another 125 per month to cover the license fee...That's $1675 in profit per month. About an hour a day tops to tend a 12 plant grow..30 hours a month...$55.83 per hour...seems fair...

Already know my strain tests 20% + in thc, with high thcv..totally organic, bug and mold free..no chemicals..yea, I bet that gets $200 a zip from a dispensary. Although prices would go down if it passes...

What do you guys think would be the going rate for "pharmaceutical" cannabis?

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I was, ah, offered 1200$ qp all day, when they were open.

bob harris said:

I'd wager that most patients who gave away their plants for an oz per month did so because that is all they need. Didn't want the hassle of growing, 1 oz per month fit their needs. They are so happy to get free weed that they don't care that the cg is making bank off them

That's great. But when that cg goes to transfer those meds to an un related patient, it should become a business transaction. IE: tested for quality and books kept.

the med law was not enacted to create a tax free living for people, it was enacted to help sick people. It's about the Patient...not the Care Giver.

Want to make money at this? Great, keep books, test your product and run like a business.

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bob. All you need is to go on ebay to see Tax free living at it's best.

I don't know tho bob, it just seems like every time it's more about the money with you. like you hate the fact people are making coin off there meds? ((no talking the $400 an Oz cat's but the $250 top shelf 31g OZ people.)) from the sound of it. You would love to see me and most others in jail simply because we are selling what we spent months caring for at a very reasonable price.

I don't speak for the low life I can't grow a blade of grass CG's and I doubt any competent grower would either but, We are not all to be lumped into one category for the simple fact of selling meds.

and before you or someone else comments that the "law is the law" then we all should hold hands on the way to federal prison seeing it's.. well I'm sure you can guess it's standing in the federal system.

SketchyGrower said:

bob. All you need is to go on ebay to see Tax free living at it's best.

I don't know tho bob, it just seems like every time it's more about the money with you. like you hate the fact people are making coin off there meds? ((no talking the $400 an Oz cat's but the $250 top shelf 31g OZ people.)) from the sound of it. You would love to see me and most others in jail simply because we are selling what we spent months caring for at a very reasonable price.

I don't speak for the low life I can't grow a blade of grass CG's and I doubt any competent grower would either but, We are not all to be lumped into one category for the simple fact of selling meds.

and before you or someone else comments that the "law is the law" then we all should hold hands on the way to federal prison seeing it's.. well I'm sure you can guess it's standing in the federal system.

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Ebay ain't so tax free..unless you only sell a small amount.

http://stores.entwooddugouts.com/StoreFront.bok

That's a link to a business I started on etsy (similar to ebay) I've sold it now, it got too big too fast for me to keep up with, due to my Parkinson's.

I assure you, taxes are paid on it. Pay pal, ebay, etsy, and credit card companies all report significant transaction dollars to the IRS. If it's handling cash..you better report.

Yes. it was 'under the table" money at first. At that time had I reported it, there would have been no tax liability anyhow..to much growing expense/ reinvestment.

The damn thing does way to much business to go un seen now.

I have no issue with "under the table" income..until that income becomes significant. But a guy making $100,000 grand, should be paying some taxes. Where is the number that income should be reported..not sure...but at some point.

As applies to cannabis? Top Shelf at $250 is probably reasonable at today's prices. But how do we know it's "top shelf" without testing data to back up the claim?

Personally, I think TOP SHELF prices will come down with testing. It will force people to grow better quality.

Top shelf meds will probably settle around $200 a zip...with mids at around $150 if regulations are enacted and enforced.

A guy with a small grow is never gonna pay taxes even if he files. Anyone making under 30k doesn't really pay taxes anymore. Your personal exemption and standard deduction wipes out what..the first 25k? And if you are self employed..in any respect..you'll have plenty more deductions.

I really hate most of the people that bitch about taxes..most don't pay any even if they file. Just had a buddy bitching about paying his City taxes...he owed $100 bucks....said that he wasn't "getting anything' for his tax money.

Way I see it..he didn't contribute enough to fix the pot hole in from of his house..what's to bitch about?

Anyone wants to complain to me about taxes..tell me how much you actually paid first. then we'll discuss if you got your moneys worth.

Like using the roads we have? Enjoy the warm fuzzy protection provided by our military? Problem with the economy is that the taxes are too low (for the rich) and Government isn't spending enough.

Government spending is at its lowest percentage of GNP since Eisenhower. Tax the rich, employ the poor to rebuild the infrastructure, and churn the money in the United States will fix the economy. Worked like a champ in the 40's..got us out of a depression, and into the best financial times for the most American's.

We need to do it again...

I see ebay has indeed changed. I dropped my store after all the PP/Ebay fee's got out of control (2004-2005).

Taxes are taxes.. never said A. we shouldn't B. I didn't pay them. . but, it's just like all the recycle bullshit you here. It's not the individual that is fucking the world it's corporations. and corporations are getting away with not paying any or very little taxes whilst sending our jobs over seas to reap even more benefits (profits)

No, I don't agree with the military (as it stands today)


Our way of life is why we are fucked.. period.. People are more concerned with being friends with there kids instead of being a parent to them...We give the lazy everything and take from the hard workers... People would rather know every aspect of the "insert latest pop star" life then knowing what the fuck is going on in the world.(the real world)


Here is something I like to watch when ever I'm getting a comfy feeling about our government as it stands today
[video=youtube;xIHLlqI4m_A]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIHLlqI4m_A[/video]

"We will see how very important it is to bring about, in the human mind, the radical revolution. The crisis, is a crisis of consciousness. A crisis that cannot anymore, accept the old norms, the old patterns, the ancient traditions. And, considering what the world is now, with all the misery, conflict, destructive brutality, aggression, and so on... Man is still as he was. Is still brutal, violent, aggressive, acquisitive, competitive. And, he's built a society along these lines."

-Jiddu Krishnamurti





how did this get so far away from what I posted in my last post? about you hating people selling meds..... oh well LOL!

Everyone in the "legal" mj biz is screwed in the end anyways. In the next few years Michigan will have a full out legalization bill, which in fact is just a decriminalization bill. It will prolly be something like, legal to have 1 ounce and/or 6 plants if you are 21 years old+. Medical goes out the window, guys with 72plants "legally" harvesting 10pounds a month goes out the window.

And the black market takes over, again. And here comes 400 a oz prices again.

Same thing is happening in Washington state right now. They are voting in November and it will more then likely pass.

Wow more bullshit we have to get stopped, Gotta love them guys on top making the money that need more and more. Greedy fucks.

hockey4848 said:

Everyone in the "legal" mj biz is screwed in the end anyways. In the next few years Michigan will have a full out legalization bill, which in fact is just a decriminalization bill. It will prolly be something like, legal to have 1 ounce and/or 6 plants if you are 21 years old+. Medical goes out the window, guys with 72plants "legally" harvesting 10pounds a month goes out the window.

And the black market takes over, again. And here comes 400 a oz prices again.

Same thing is happening in Washington state right now. They are voting in November and it will more then likely pass.

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Decriminalization is far more likely that legalization. With decriminalization though, I doubt you would be able to grow. Med patients could grow..but decriminalization really amounts to no charges for possession of less than maybe an oz.

Manufacturing and intent to deliver would all most likey remain crimes.

you can still grow. its illegal on most of this planet.

but we still got a shit load of it

Has anyone figured out how they plan on this working?

Kinda sounds like grow in the back, dispense in the front. That rarely works. Backing dispensary front, 60 plants can give you enough yield to make a loving, but you can't support many strains very well.

If ya have more than a few strains, you run low on selection to soon..

Is there grow to supply a separate dispensary in there?

I've read it through a few times...it's really well coded legal babble..can't quite put my finger on it's 'intent"

bob harris said:

Has anyone figured out how they plan on this working?

Kinda sounds like grow in the back, dispense in the front. That rarely works. Backing dispensary front, 60 plants can give you enough yield to make a loving, but you can't support many strains very well.

If ya have more than a few strains, you run low on selection to soon..

Is there grow to supply a separate dispensary in there?

I've read it through a few times...it's really well coded legal babble..can't quite put my finger on it's 'intent"

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As ive read it, it is intended as you said, but as the law is currently written, it does not rule out supplying dispensaries.
We will see if that changes.

vilify said:

As ive read it, it is intended as you said, but as the law is currently written, it does not rule out supplying dispensaries.
We will see if that changes.

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Yea, that's what I see. Hope it stays that way.

Seems like it is intended to create a separate medical marijuana system where patients pick either the MMMA, or their pharmaceutical dispensary model. Why else would patients need an enhanced card? Why have this enhanced card system when there is already a card system?

Could they be working to get everyone onto this new system that they make and then repeal the MMMA? If everyone jumps on board, then the MMMA will be easy to repeal. I'm sure a medical marijuana program that doesn't need a super majority from both houses to amend is a lot more appealing to the legislature!

Beagle said:

Seems like it is intended to create a separate medical marijuana system where patients pick either the MMMA, or their pharmaceutical dispensary model. Why else would patients need an enhanced card? Why have this enhanced card system when there is already a card system?

Could they be working to get everyone onto this new system that they make and then repeal the MMMA? If everyone jumps on board, then the MMMA will be easy to repeal. I'm sure a medical marijuana program that doesn't need a super majority from both houses to amend is a lot more appealing to the legislature!

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One they write the rules to.
In the words of Sarah Palin, 'You bet ya'.

Look behind the curtain and you will find the dispensary cats donating money to the sponsors and meeting with them.
Those behind this are complete sellouts - they always were - but there is no longer much need for them to be stealth because we don't have an effective voice.

Our only defense is disgust and rejection of them.
That is a personal decision each must come to on their own.

If giving away our freedoms wasn't so tragic I would be rolling on the floor laughing right now.
Those gun nuts supporting this attack against our Civil Rights think they are safe because they have guns!
Leo has body armor. And tanks. And air power.
Idiots.
They are coming for your guns and you are allowing them to set precedent now on 'other' citizens rights.
When they raid the gun owners they are going to get what we get, "tell that to the Judge".

This is where Timmah, and even crazy Joe Cain, are absolutely correct - this is much bigger than the MMMAct - this is government running roughshod over our rights.
And this is Democrats along with Republicans doing it to us - they all worship money and donations and power - they only do the right thing when forced to act.
This is government that has moved from not doing legally required budgets to not doing anything it doesn't want to do if they can get away with it.

Fast & Furious! - even the cops can't get Justice! It's the new American way.